To weight or not to weight

[svictorino]

Hello,

I'm new to scuba, and I'd like to share my first experience after checkout. I decided to dive in a calm place here in Brazil, which I believe it's best for beginners. My first problem was to find a partner to dive but the dive center I contacted told me that wouldn't be a problem because that would easy to find, and it went fine.
But, the problems I had was about to come.
1. I didn't put enough weight. 2 months after I did the checkout I stopped gym and gained some fat, enough to make me miss the right amount of weight and then, after 17min diving I couldn't keep myself under water.
2. During my second dive (over-weighted now), I didn't have any problem on staying under water but, because of this weight, I had to spend my energy, more than usual and got tired and, to get worst, the person who was diving with me, didn't respect the limits the divemaster asked us to(btw, this person is new to scuba diving too). So, after 33min of diving I ran out of oxygen and had to ask for help from my partner.

Now I learned a couple lessons:
1. Back to gym to gain resistance and lose this weight again.
2. Only dive with people you know
3. If you know your friend is going beyond the recommended, make him understand that.

PS. If anyone wants info about scuba diving in Brazil, just PM me.

Sergio

 

[sibermike7]

When I only had to add 2 pounds to accommodate for a trilam drysuit over a 5 mil wetsuit,

Someone did tell you that they make actual drysuit undergarments!? You really don't need to wear a wetsuit under your drysuit. Well, I suppose you could, but don't see much sense in it!

 

[deltablade]

I use 8 weights with 11 litre aluminium tank and 7 with a 11 litre steel, my bc can hold 6 weights tho i use 4 in it with a weight belt,, is it a good idea to put as much weight in my intergrated weight pockets ie 6 in bc and 2 on belt or should i keep the majority on my weight belt,, i seem to have issues with my body rolling to one side and hope to correct it with weights, i am obviosly new with 9 dives so far and i would appreciate some imput, also should i have weight on belt evenly distributed on the side or back of my belt?

cheers will

 

[BettyRubble]

Hello,

I'm new to scuba, and I'd like to share my first experience after checkout. I decided to dive in a calm place here in Brazil, which I believe it's best for beginners. My first problem was to find a partner to dive but the dive center I contacted told me that wouldn't be a problem because that would easy to find, and it went fine.
But, the problems I had was about to come.
1. I didn't put enough weight. 2 months after I did the checkout I stopped gym and gained some fat, enough to make me miss the right amount of weight and then, after 17min diving I couldn't keep myself under water.
2. During my second dive (over-weighted now), I didn't have any problem on staying under water but, because of this weight, I had to spend my energy, more than usual and got tired and, to get worst, the person who was diving with me, didn't respect the limits the divemaster asked us to(btw, this person is new to scuba diving too). So, after 33min of diving I ran out of oxygen and had to ask for help from my partner.

Now I learned a couple lessons:
1. Back to gym to gain resistance and lose this weight again.
2. Only dive with people you know
3. If you know your friend is going beyond the recommended, make him understand that.

PS. If anyone wants info about scuba diving in Brazil, just PM me.

Sergio

The early days are frustrating. Once you get your weighting right you'll have more success; and the conditioning is always a good idea. I hate surface swims but conditioning has helped me with those.

You touch on another topic I want to to comment on. That is the buddy issue. I travel alone sometimes and worry about who I will get paired with. Even with 80 dives, I still feel very much like a newbie and worry I'll be paired with someone equally inexperienced. However, I have found two important things:

1) Once I'm paired, I interrogate the poor soul. How many dives, what types of diving, last time they dove, what type of computer are they using, etc. I also explain my experience level and expectations. It helps me know what type of diver I am getting in the water with.

2) I have control of my dive . . . EVERY dive. . EVERY minute. If my buddy is putting us at risk, or if I AM putting us at risk, I call it.

I learned this the hard way. I was in a threesome in December and did not pay attention to the tank size of my buddies. I am usually fine on an 80 with men who dive 80's because I breathe less air. . always come up with more then enough reserve even after extended dives. But I didn't realize at first that my two buddies were diving 120s. BIG mistake. THEN I compounded it by NOT calling the turnaround mark when I hit that point in the rule of 1/3's. I finally ended up calling the dive when I realized my two buds were NOT going to do so anytime soon and I was down to 150 psi. STUPID STUPID STUPID. I had enough air to do my safety stop and by the time the boat picked us up (drift dive) I had 50 psi. I was livid with myself. I could not blame anyone else. I should have asked the questions and called the turnaround point.

The next poor soul I got buddied with the next day got the spanish inquisition. Which was hysterical since it turned out he had 600 dives under his belt. He turned out to be an awesome insta-buddy.

I'll stop rambling now. Just wanted to encourage you that with proper prep, insta buddies (even newbies) can be good. Just take control of your dive from start to finish.

 

[drdaddy]

So I got my BCD/Belt weight exactly right on!!! But then, while I stayed around the same body weight, but my tone changed and shifted a bit from muscle to belly fat. I could not believe the difference this made - I had to "push" myself down and little. This wasn't a big deal as I wear a 7mm farmer john - and I therefore probably pushed a couple of bubbles out so I was OK when I got down a couple of feet. But now, because of this "tone loss", I will probably add a couple of pounds of lead or lose a few pounds of my buoyant fat and replace it with less buoyant muscle. Any guesses which will be easier?

 

[nwh20]

Wow, the more you learn, the more you know what a crazy thing diving is! I'm another ultra-newbie and trying to take in all this advice and info so I won't be scared sh**less every time I dive. Thanks so much for this terrific thread!

I had a bad experience on a refresher course after not diving for 6 yrs. As usual, I was having trouble with buoyancy in the freezing cold water and visibility was just 3-5 feet with lights. After accidentally popping up to surface, I went back down and ended up losing my buddy and instructor on the ocean side of a breakwater wall. That's because the instructor took my buddy off in another direction, although he thought they should stay there where they last saw me. It seemed like I was getting confused and heading out into the ocean instead of toward shore so I decided I was too disoriented to cruise along the bottom. The surface was too rough to swim at as wave action was pushing me up against the breakwater, so I went down about 5ft. to the bottom of the concrrete wall and followed it back the long way around, getting to the calmer water inside the breakwater just when my tank was down to 500. The group was all searching for me, but of course no one could see anything underwater more than a few feet away. It was a very scary experience for me and could have ended badly. I think it could have been avoided if I had my buoyancy under control. It was a good learning experience but not something I'd like to repeat.

I'm mentioning this because I will soon be on a trip to Hawaii and diving with charter companies, and hope to do the Manta Ray night dive. My bad dive was like a night dive, so I have a little anxiety about it but I will do some day dives before that. Reading this thread has reinforced for me that I should schedule a buyonancy course or spend some time with private instruction, maybe on my trip.

I KNOW I have weighting and buoyance issues so I always love having that anchor line right next to me going down or up. Since I am always using rental gear (and we're talking all of about 8 dives here), and diving with different charter companies, you can't really 'dial it in' very well can you? I'm putting my trust in their crew that they're picking out the right equipment for me, except for my mask/snorkel/fins.

Thanks in advance for any advice you care to give about how you figure out your buoyancy when using different rental equipment, in water different than where you got certified.

 

[BettyRubble]

Wow, the more you learn, the more you know what a crazy thing diving is! I'm another ultra-newbie and trying to take in all this advice and info so I won't be scared sh**less every time I dive. Thanks so much for this terrific thread!

Sounds like you kept your wits about you, thought through a course of action and didn't let panic take over. Good instincts and staying calm makes a difference.

You might want to consider a peak buoyancy class. It did wonders for me and gave me some added confidence.

To help me keep track of my weighting in different environments/set-ups, I log EVERYTHING. Type of wetsuit I have on, hood or no hood, tank size and whether it is AL or Steel, water conditions, salt vs. fresh, vis . . everything.

Now I have a mini table in the back of my book that notes different configurations of setups:

Full 7 mil wetsuit + salt water = X weight Add X if AL tank
Full 7 mil wetsuit + fresh water = x weight Add X if AL tank
3 mil wetsuit + salt water = x weight Add X if AL tank
etc etc etc

But I own my gear so it has been easier to figure this out. You will need to log more info about what brand/type of BC, wetsuit etc you are diving. There won't be a large differnece between the setups but a couple pounds here or there makes all the difference. Tanks in particular are tough sometimes because not all tanks add or subject weight to your configuration. Each brand/model has a slight variation to their empty weight and filled weight vs another brand.

In the short-term, just explain to your buddy and the DM that you need to do a weight check when you first get in. If conditions allow, it is an easy enough thing to do on your first dive on the trip.

Hopefully some veterans will jump on and give you some additional advice.

Enjoy your trip!

 

[nwh20]

Thanks for your tip about creating a table, Betty. I do write things down but not quite in that much detail, so I will do that with future dives. Guess it will just be hit or miss for awhile.

Sorry to sound like a neophyte once again, but how do you do a weight check when you first get in? I thought previous posts had talked about getting your correct weight when you are down to 500 in your tank. And would a DM on a charter be OK with that, or want you to get down so you don't hold up the group?

 

[dpaustex]

All you new divers (and many old ones, too), proper weighting is pretty crucial.

Buoyancy is a pretty straightforward principle, in that you are buoyant when your in-water weight volume is less than the weight of the water you displaced. The reverse holds true, also (if your weight is more, you sink).

There are lots of factors impacting these volumes. One, if you have a new wet suit (they tend to have more "bubbles" in them at first). Also, as you descend, the pressure is increasing 1 ATM for each 33 feet (generally), so your wetsuit and gear is also compressing (and not necessarily in a linear progression, either, so you may reach a "break over" depth where your bouyancy seems to suddenly be off).

I suggest my students work on buoyancy in the pool. The reason is that, on a percentage basis, the greatest differential pressure change is toward the surface, so that if you can nail your buoyancy in a 10 foot deep pool, you can do it anywhere. One good trick is to take your fins OFF in the pool, and adjust your weighting without fins (so you won't kick). When it's right, you should be able to ascend and descend in the pool, simply by "top" breathing (which is taking a slightly deeper breath). Once your ascent starts, remember to exhale a stready stream of bubbles. Students are amazed at this "trick", which is quite fun to do.

As far as the weight check, once you get in, the best method is to get in the water with your gear (be sure your reg is in your mouth, and air is on). Next, deflate your BC entirely. With normal air in your lungs (not a deep breath, but not on an exhalation), you should float in the water with the water about level with your eyes. Remember, to have all of the air out of your wetsuit, too (seems to be a big problem with new divers). If you are floating any higher than that, you need more weight. Add the weight in small increments. Once you get it right, make sure you log it somewhere.

Now the issue is when you get in salt water, the water is slightly denser, which makes you more buoyant than you were in the pool (but not by much, about 3%). So if you happened to have it to the ounce in the pool, you'll need another pound or so in salt water.

If you're on a dive boat, many of the DM's might not want to screw with the weights. One way to handle this is to try and do it at the dock, first. Lacking that, don't try and be the first off the boat. Many boats will over-weight you, if you don't know your proper weighting. One thing to remember is that the more muscular you are, the less weight you will need than a similarly sized person that has higher body fat concentration (fat floats, muscle doesn't). I've seen huge guys need 4 lbs, and another guy of the same size, on the same dive, with similar gear, truly need 16 lbs.

Remember, if you overweight, you are the one pushing that extra weight through the water, and burning up your air a bit faster.

The danger of being underweight is if you are diving aluminum cylinders, which go slightly buoyant when they are empty. Most boats want you back on at 500 psi, which should be fine. But if you're pushing the limits, you'll probably want to be 2-3 lbs negative at the start of your dive. In other words, if you are doing a weight check, with a full cylinder, get the weighting right for floating eye-level. After that, add 2-3 lbs to make sure you stay down as your cylinder starts to go buoyant toward the end of the dive.

Main thing is to have fun. Ask others to help you weight yourself, and keep track of what works. Remember, different sizes and thickness of wetsuits, and different BC's all have different impacts on your buoyancy. Don't get freaked out about this, just keep a chart of what works best (in your log book). It'll take you a few times to get it all worked out correctly, but the up-front effort is worth it in having a more comfortable dive.

 

[dpaustex]

I need to add some things people mentioned on releasing your weights - and knowing where your buddie's are -and HOW to release them. These are great points.

But the need to release weights is different than overweighting. Some posts are referring to people dying with their weights in (very true), but that isn't because of them being overweighted, and the weights somehow causing them to drown.

What causes many divers to drown is panic. They are in situations they have never been in before; or they get their masked knocked off, and have never practiced mask removal and clearing at depth; or they are hyper-ventilating; or a host of other reasons.

The issue is that when/if a problem happens at depth, you have to fix the problem at depth. For you new divers, this means you actually need to practice that dreaded mask removal and replacement at depth on every dive. This means you need to be able to take off your BC in the water, at 60 feet deep, and put it back on. All of these things are really no big deal. Start doing them in shallower water (less than 30 feet) until you can nail them 100% of the time.

But people drown when they think "up" is the only option when something goes wrong with their gear, and they're 50 feet down. Instead of fixing the problem, they spit their reg out (big mistake) and swim like mad for the surface, without exhaling (bigger mistake). Sad fact is that most drownings happen and the people have air in their tank, and their weights in. Remember your drills in your OW class for the emergency swimming ascent, and the emergency buoyant ascent? Well, these are LAST RESORT things to do.

Learn your gear. Learn your buddies gear. Go through your pre-dive check throughly on your gear, that of your buddy, your alternate air-source, hand signals, lost buddy procedures...the whole deal, folks. We instructors don't teach and drill you on this stuff to be a pain in the backside. We're trying to make you competent divers. But in doing so, we are giving you the tools to enjoy this great sport, as well as to stay safe. But you all have to do your job, too. This means diving and taking that mask off (completely!!!) at depth, then putting it back on. It is really no big deal. Simply practice it. I talk to lots of dive folks, and many laugh if they dive with me and see me do it. But on almost every dive I take my mask off, mainly just for practice. So when I am on a cattle dive boat, and some doofus kicks my mask off, it's really no big deal.

For you new divers, and old alike, I highly recommend you all take a stress and rescue course. The main reason I suggest this is that the course teaches you what forms a panic situation, how to recognize it, how to avoid it, and what to do if you find yourself in one (Stop, breathe, think, ACT). But above all, don't panic!!!

Through practice, ANY diver can learn to recognize panic situations, and how to deal with them. But spitting a perfectly good reg out of your mouth and swimming for the surface isn't generally the best option. All of the instruction agencies teach this stuff for a reason. It is not something to forget about once you get that C-card. Having the knowledge that you KNOW what to do is crucial if something goes amiss on your dive.

My hats off to the folks asking the questions. I like people in my classes that ask lots of questions, and want to be better divers. I learn something new on every dive, even as an Instructor.

If any of you are nervous, get your dive buddy (or one here) and go someplace controlled where you can practice the mask removal over and over and over. Practice buddy breathing, and air sharing. I've had gear malfunctions at 95 feet, and my practicing of skills made the solution really no big deal. However, had I not practiced them, I'm sure the "flight" instinct would say "swim for it". That's a bad instinct at 95 feet, especially when I had a buddy within 30 feet to help me out.

But as a diver, YOU are responsible for your own skill set. You were each given the tools in your open water class, so please, PLEASE practice those drills.