Time For Some Industry Standards for Dive Computer Alarms

[Mike]

First off, Let me say that I appreciate everybody's input. Concepts and ideas need to be scrutinized by people who know what they're talking about. There's no doubt you guys are good divers.

In the perfect world, everybody would be a great driver (of an automobile), we wouldn't need seat belts, air bags, etc. but we all know that's not how the real-world works. In life, a lot of people forget, or simply decided not to follow the rules. A hypothetical couple on vacation, that hasn't done a dive in 2 years, are more than likely not going to be calculating SAC rates or have a solid dive plan. I'd say that they're more likely to get distracted too. These are the people who need to be targeted for better safety (idiot proof) gear.

Well, now you've switched tactics. Now you're talking about a niche product for a niche group of divers.

In a free economy, the void in a market gets filled. If there is a market for a dive computer that caters to morons then a manufacturer will create a product to take advantage of it.

Let vacation divers who aren't familiar with equipment, who haven't been in the water for 2 years solve their own problem through the normal conventions that diving provides today which is for them to do a refresher course, or get in the pool back home before they go on vacation, or hire a private dive master... etc... this in the real wold is called (accountability and accepting personal responsibility)

BUT - wanting legislation across an entire industry is not the answer to solve a niche problem.

We have enough dumbing down going on in our nanny state already. Printing warning labels on a package of steak knives that says "Objects contained are sharp and can cause bodily injury if used improperly." Isn't on the package to save lives of those few morons who are going to stab themselves in the eye with a steak knife because they didn't realize its sharp. NO, no, no... that warning label is on that package to protect the manufacturer from the Asshat lawyers in this country who will try to cash in on our moronic sense that everybody must be protected from themselves and must be compensated for their stupidity.

Dumbing down dive computers and legislation is not the answer ever, it's following the example in the warning label on the steak knives, because the more stupid we get, the less able we are to detect our own stupidity. Unfortunately there are more and more people who think a warning label on a package of steak knives is what should be there, and think it strange if there isn't one, and you're pretty much becoming that person. You look at a package of steak knives without a warning label and are alarmed by it, thinking something is missing. That is why you're so alone in your thinking on this thread. All of us get it, unfortunately, you don't. You're the guy who wants a warning label on the steak knives, all of the rest of us don't because we realize that warning label is much, much more than just a paper sticker on a package, it's an acceptance of what's wrong in America today and another step down the slippery slope of the nanny state that many of us have seen enough of.

Some of us watch Christmas Story and when the little kid wants the Red Rider BB gun and is told he will shoot his eye out, and we laugh and get the joke. Others hear that line and think it's not only good advice, but should be a warning label, and we should pass legislation protecting people from themselves regulating the purchase or BB guns with age limits. Which one are you?

 

[gcarter]

First off, Let me say that I appreciate everybody's input. Concepts and ideas need to be scrutinized by people who know what they're talking about. There's no doubt you guys are good divers.

In the perfect world, everybody would be a great driver (of an automobile), we wouldn't need seat belts, air bags, etc. but we all know that's not how the real-world works. In life, a lot of people forget, or simply decided not to follow the rules. A hypothetical couple on vacation, that hasn't done a dive in 2 years, are more than likely not going to be calculating SAC rates or have a solid dive plan. I'd say that they're more likely to get distracted too. These are the people who need to be targeted for better safety (idiot proof) gear.

This is the fundamental problem with today's society / nanny state. The rest of us are asked to live like the stupid people rather than letting natural selection do its work. You cannot legislate or regulate away stupid, so please do not ask me to live in a cocoon in a misguided attempt to protect someone who is too stupid to get out of his own way.

If someone wants to "forget, or simply decide[d} not to follow the rules", how and why should that be my problem? Why do I need to submit to regulation? Will that make them remember, or magically now decide to follow the rules?

Not likely.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

It's called natural selection. The weak, stupid, and foolish are weeded out so that their genes are not passed on to weaken the species. Lawyers have insured that process is watered down and so we have more stupid people who refuse to take responsibility for themselves and thus creating the need for more lawyers. And the cycle goes ever onward.

 

[gcarter]

You know where I got this idea from? The Fire Service. You see, every firefighter in the country has a bell on their SCBA that goes off at 500 psi. They also have a PASS device which they can activate manually if they become trapped, OOA, lost, or entangled. You see, fire fighters also have a limited air source, just like you can't breath water, they can't breath smoke. And just like divers, they and their buddy need to know when it's time to leave. Someone, at some point said, "you know what be a good idea... if we had some sort of warning device that let's us and others know when we're in trouble." The NFPA adopted this and now it's a standard. Now, no matter where you go in this country as a firefighter you know when your own air-supply, or that of your buddy is low. It's easy to become distracted in a fire and it's easy to become distracted underwater. Where is the harm in having a backup alarm, especially, if everyone knows and understands what it means? The NFPA thought this was important enough they adopted it as a standard. Could it save a life? It couldn't hurt.

There is a big difference between regulating workplace health and safety issues, particularly when individuals are required to enter hazardous environments as part of their job, and regulating voluntary recreational activities. Have you implemented a WHMIS system in your home? Do you maintain an up to date MSDS library? Should that be mandatory as well?

 

[diverrex]

.....all of the rest of us don't because we realize that warning label is much, much more than just a paper sticker on a package, it's an acceptance of what's wrong in America today and another step down the slippery slope of the nanny state that many of us have seen enough of.

The whole post was well said but the part above is what I really like. We too often here things like "what's the harm in requiring a 500 PSI alarm on dive computers". First it runs up the cost and inconveniences those divers that don't need or want it. But secondly and more importantly is what the post quoted above says. The more often we allow people to be not responsible for their actions the more likely they are also to become less able to be responsible forcing other more responsible people to take care of them. I'm tired of taking care of others who have chosen not to be as responsible as me.

Plus we all know what would happen after 500 PSI alarms become required. The first time someone died after their alarm malfunctioned (because there will be some people who think why should I bother looking at my computer the alarm will tell me when I have a low air problem) or perhaps the alarm even went off but was not "loud enough" to be heard then the manufacture gets sued, raising all our costs in the process. And divers simply get dumber and less responsible since the legislation is telling them they don't have to be smarter and more responsible because "something or someone else" will take care of them.

 

[AfterDark]

PDC's have alarms?