Thinking about options to upgrade my divecomputer

[Cheizz]

Just curious: what don't you like about the Ratio interface?

 

[Belzelbub]

(And it's even easier to violate on a smaller time scale, that's 1ft over 1.5 seconds.)

Yep, the time scale is important. If it's that short, I could see simply raising your wrist could violate that. I've noticed early on that my Garmin seems more sensitive to ascent rate than my Shearwater.

However, looking through the Garmin manual, ascent rate doesn't appear to be one to trigger a lockout. Only violating a decompression ceiling for more than 3 minutes will trigger a 24 hour lockout, and that will be after the dive disabling the Single gas, Multi gas, and CCR dive modes. And that will be after it alerts you visually, vibration, and audible (unless the vibe and audio are disabled).

 

[Diving Dubai]

Yes, Suunto certainly locks users for deco violations. But it also seems that Suunto will lock users out for non-deco reasons -- diving on (what Suunto considers) a low battery, and mixing free-diving and scuba-diving modes on the same day. Those are certainly more subjective (when is a battery too low for a dive), but other manufacturers (Shearwater, Ratio) don't lock their users out for that.

Any computer that has a free diving option will not allow scuba diving for a period afterwards.

Shearwater doesn't have a free diving options

Yes a low batt will get a lockout if it dies because the computer can't track what you've done. I sure if you lost batt live during a dive on a Shearwater it wouldn't be happy

While entry level computers tend to be conservative given most users don't really know what the computer is saying - theres a load of old wives tales and anecdotes which are untrue

I've even put my Eon on a very conservative setting and done pretty much everything I can on a scooter during a NDL dive to "bend it. Not happened.

 

[Diving Dubai]

according to this page Suunto the POD batteries are no longer user serviceable - This changed following a tank POD recall 4-5 years ago. the only kits I can find online do not include the cover, which Suunto says has to be replaced.

I have no doubt to not believe them, but I was still getting kits from my main dealer until 2020. The recall was because some cheap moron reused the plastic cap (teh kit provides a new one) over tightened teh screws and it went bang!

At the time I was in monthly contact with Suunto regarding transmitter battery life - I wasn't seeing 50 dives or 4 months. They were replacing transmitters FOC via their dealer but nothing was working.

What transpired was, it wasn't the transmitter but the batteries. which were shipped separately - the Suunto specified batteries available in country were actually counterfeit (which is apparently a huge worldwide thing) My batteries weren't being returned to suunto so they didn't know. It was only a new distributor who did a voltage test uncovered the whole thing

 

[Diving Dubai]

Suunto will also lock you out for fast ascents and for yo-yo profiles.

Having never owned a Zoop I'll take your word for it. I can assure you that and Eon won't. Been there tried that, including setting it to the most conservative profile then being "stupid" on scooter under NDL.

Also people comparing a Zoop to a Shearwater are just being disingenuous An entry level computer compared with high end will be different

 

[Diving Dubai]

I loved the suunto eon core’s interface..BUT it locked my wife out because it was “low” on battery during a dive…it still had 4 hours of life left…sold them immediately and bought 2 perdix AI’s.

The was an issue - I've run my Eon's down to 1 hrs (while underwater) and had no issues Although mine was a stell so has a bigger battery

The Problem with the Eon software was (is?) the battery life display giving time. This "time" was a guestimate based on previous information - but alter the settings (say screen brightness) and this time is invalid. A bit like your mpg display of the taking the average over time which would be different from when its been reset.

Shearwater's solution was to display a battery voltage, but that's equally useless, and battery voltage decreases faster at the lower end.

My solution to all this was to always charge the Eon's over night and change the rechargeable battery on my Perdix daily too so I always had fully charged batteries each morning, so if there was an issue not being able to charge in the evening I had at least 1 extra day of diving time to solve the issue. As always PPPPPP

 

[tursiops]

Having never owned a Zoop I'll take your word for it. I can assure you that and Eon won't. Been there tried that, including setting it to the most conservative profile then being "stupid" on scooter under NDL.

Also people comparing a Zoop to a Shearwater are just being disingenuous An entry level computer compared with high end will be different

My statement was too strong. It does not lock you out for a fast scent, it just penalizes you with a mandatory safety stop and a reduced NDL on your next dive. Just like the Eon.
And the EON also will lock you out while diving (and for 48h afterwards) if you violate a deco stop for more than 3 minutes.
Reading the Eon manual regarding ascents and missed deco stops, it reads almost exactly like the Zoop.

 

[Diving Dubai]

My statement was too strong. It does not lock you out for a fast scent, it just penalizes you with a mandatory safety stop and a reduced NDL on your next dive. Just like the Eon.
And the EON also will lock you out while diving (and for 48h afterwards) if you violate a deco stop for more than 3 minutes.
Reading the Eon manual regarding ascents and missed deco stops, it reads almost exactly like the Zoop.

The only penalty I've witnessed on the Eon, is with a conservative setting (P-0) and a short (45min SI) then the NDL will decrease of the next dive. I really have done everything to try to upset the Eon, and on its most aggressive setting it never differed from my Perdix on 45/95. Over 500 dives with both of them there was zero difference with NDL or Deco time

Generally Fused RGBM is different from normal RGBM and is supposed to be less conservative. However

In 2019, 4 of use went on the Current Junkies boat in Komodo. These dive were always into largish currents - very similar to the washing machine types we were used to in the Musandam, and because of the real chance of down currents everyone dived air for the week

I was diving an Eon and Perdix, my Friend and OSTC and Perdix, and the very experience guide a Zoop. She dived this for the added conservatism it supposedly gave (given the risky dives)

At the end of the dives the NDL was never more than a couple of minutes adrift between each computer. Deco was banned but skirting the edge of deco was the norm with some of the dives

So you had Buhlmann, Fused RGBM and basic RGBM all giving similar times. Go figure.

 

[tursiops]

The only penalty I've witnessed on the Eon, is with a conservative setting (P-0) and a short (45min SI) then the NDL will decrease of the next dive. I really have done everything to try to upset the Eon, and on its most aggressive setting it never differed from my Perdix on 45/95. Over 500 dives with both of them there was zero difference with NDL or Deco time

Generally Fused RGBM is different from normal RGBM and is supposed to be less conservative. However

In 2019, 4 of use went on the Current Junkies boat in Komodo. These dive were always into largish currents - very similar to the washing machine types we were used to in the Musandam, and because of the real chance of down currents everyone dived air for the week

I was diving an Eon and Perdix, my Friend and OSTC and Perdix, and the very experience guide a Zoop. She dived this for the added conservatism it supposedly gave (given the risky dives)

At the end of the dives the NDL was never more than a couple of minutes adrift between each computer. Deco was banned but skirting the edge of deco was the norm with some of the dives

So you had Buhlmann, Fused RGBM and basic RGBM all giving similar times. Go figure.

Glad it worked out for you.
The issue is not whether they are similar when all is going well and you are diving within the rules for your computer; the issue is what does the computer do if you violate any of these rules? This is the Suunto problem; it has more rules you can violate, and it has some rather moderate-to-strong penalties for doing that. Displaying ERROR at depth when you have missed a deco stop is not really helpful. Keeping yoj out of the water for 48h afterwards is rather extreme.

 

[Belzelbub]

Any computer that has a free diving option will not allow scuba diving for a period afterwards.

I'm not sure that's correct, and doesn't really make sense. I can see not allowing free diving after Scuba for some time, but not the other way around. I found nothing about a lockout if free diving first in the manual. I'll have to try it out this year when I'm in the Keys, but I suspect if I free dive first, it will let me choose a scuba mode soon after.

Shearwater doesn't have a free diving options

This is definitely not correct. It's true the Perdix (Peregrine, Petrel, etc.) does not have a free dive mode. The Teric most certainly does have a free dive mode.

Yes a low batt will get a lockout if it dies because the computer can't track what you've done. I sure if you lost batt live during a dive on a Shearwater it wouldn't be happy

Don't really know. I get plenty of warning before my battery is dead. When I do change my battery, there is an option to clear tissues or not. If I don't clear tissues, it will keep what it had, that would only really be useful if I changed between dives.

The recall was because some cheap moron reused the plastic cap (teh kit provides a new one) over tightened teh screws and it went bang!

I had heard that it was from something like that, but what do you mean "went bang"? Is the battery compartment pressurized? No OPV on the transmitter?