The "S" Word

[mweitz]

Uh, golf forum, Strokes are the topic of conversation .

Chortle

Mark

Its part of being human actually, nothing to do with DIR.

DIR is just a system.

It doesn't post, it doesn't talk, it just is. After that, add in human behavior. Look at any message board, on probably any subject and you will find the same behaviors. If this was a golf forum, we would be fighting about steel vs graphite shafts.

For scuba...we have DIR to kick around (today...there might be something better to fight over in the future). Usually, the good thing is that behind most of this "stuff" are people that love to dive and if they ever meet in person, that usually is more important. But for the internet...nope, debate fuels the fire, so I think it will never end

 

[JeffG]

Uh, golf forum, Strokes are the topic of conversation .

Chortle

Mark

Anyone that farm animal stupid enough to use a graphite shaft is definitely a stroke.



Edit: I have to call a woooooooosh to myself. I get it now.

 

[DennisW]

Now, now. Don't totally ban the word. I was called one some time ago because I use an Air II. I wear the title with pride and distinction.

In all seriousness, you have to consider the source if someone uses the term in a derogatory manner. I wouldn't bash DIR folks just because I don't do the whole DIR thing. The method is a very serious way to approach SCUBA when venturing into overhead and cave situations. It stresses alternative methods, safety, bouyancy control, etc., etc. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I don't do deep dark holes. I'm just not interested. That doesn't mean I'm not a safe diver. I am a very cautious diver and I know my equipment and my limitations. More power to the DIR folks that want to continue their diving education and experiences. I continue to learn more about diving as well and I have certain experiences I am interested in pursuing. They just aren't the same kind of experiences.

Now, let's shut up and go diving.

 

[Rick Inman]

I think that question can be asked at more than one level ... starting with "Why is there so much antagonism toward DIR"? I have to deal with that a lot ... and being someone who really would prefer to promote the concepts of safer diving, I'm not always pleased about the answers.

Much of the reason pertains to the topic of this thread ... and a mentality that spawns a lexicon of terms intended to demean people.

It's really rather unnecessary ... and self-defeating ... in the long term.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

My wife has a tendency to dislike actors who play the part of bad guys TV shows. I try to tell her, it's just their TV persona, that, in real life, they're really very nice. Just like DIR divers on the internet.

A lot of demeaning talk goes on on-line. I've never seen it in person.

If I just based my decisions on what I read on-line, I wouldn't be taking the F class. But, darn it, when I dive with the suckers, they have some skills I don't, and you can't get 'em from the local Spokane PADI shop.

So, if, after the class next month, I start to give off an attitude of exclusivity, superiority, condescension, narrow-mindedness, snobbery and anti-strokishness, please remind me of this post.

 

[Uncle Pug]

So, if, after the class next month, I start to give off an attitude of exclusivity, superiority, condescension, narrow-mindedness, snobbery and anti-strokishness, please remind me of this post.

We'll just remind you that you are provisional.

 

[TSandM]

So, if, after the class next month, I start to give off an attitude of exclusivity, superiority, condescension, narrow-mindedness, snobbery and anti-strokishness, please remind me of this post

.

Bob says there are a lot of people who ought to be quarantined for 30 days after Fundies.

 

[El Orans]

We'll just remind you that you are provisional.

Well, he just might pass the first time...

 

[mweitz]

I certainly hope that isn't the case with me. As I’ve said before, I’ll dive with most anyone and have a few regular dive buddies who are strictly recreational. I don’t look at their fins, or computers or whatever. We just dive and I do whatever ascent they normally do, including the 3 minute safety stop.

My real point is that the word and what it stands for are in fact DIR. Trying to squelch the term because you find how some people use it offensive is inane.

I also don’t go around calling folks Strokes, except jokingly amongst my regular dive buddies.

So, if, after the class next month, I start to give off an attitude of exclusivity, superiority, condescension, narrow-mindedness, snobbery and anti-strokishness, please remind me of this post.

 

[headhunter]

I agree with those that don't think that the "S" word should ever be used in polite discourse in a serious manner.

I also agree with those that believe using it "tongue in cheek" is OK, but I personally try to keep that to comments in person where you can read the tone in my voice and perceive it as a joke.

Its meaning has developed in a way that has become a very derogatory term in dive circles.

To answer Blackfish's question about the origin, I'll relate the story that I heard and sounds like it's probably accurate.

As I understand it, it goes back to when GI3 was the Project Manager for the WKPP. He would have people come by and try to "butter him up" or "stroke him", so that he would allow them to get on the team as support divers. So, he referred to people that "stroked" him to get on the team as "strokes". Since many of these people were considered divers with an unsafe attitude that had no business being on the team, the term "stroke" grew to mean "any diver with an unsafe attitude".

Again, this is what I "heard through the grapevine", but it seems to make sense and I wanted to offer a viable answer to Blackfish's question. If someone has first hand knowledge to answer this question, please let us know.

Now for that disclosure that Ben was looking for:

It would also help the discussion if people would state if they are DIR, DIR trained minded ect.... Non DIR guys are obviously going to be on the No side since they think they are the ones being referenced

I am not now nor have I ever been a DIR diver. However, I believe the philosophy to be a good one and am enrolled in Michael H. Kane's December DIR-F class on Catalina Island.

That should cover it.

Christian

 

[mweitz]

GI stole it from Parker Turner I think:

http://www.baue.org/library/irvine_baue_talk.html

I agree with those that don't think that the "S" word should ever be used in polite discourse in a serious manner.

I also agree with those that believe using it "tongue in cheek" is OK, but I personally try to keep that to comments in person where you can read the tone in my voice and perceive it as a joke.

Its meaning has developed in a way that has become a very derogatory term in dive circles.

To answer Blackfish's question about the origin, I'll relate the story that I heard and sounds like it's probably accurate.

As I understand it, it goes back to when GI3 was the Project Manager for the WKPP. He would have people come by and try to "butter him up" or "stroke him", so that he would allow them to get on the team as support divers. So, he referred to people that "stroked" him to get on the team as "strokes". Since many of these people were considered divers with an unsafe attitude that had no business being on the team, the term "stroke" grew to mean "any diver with an unsafe attitude".

Again, this is what I "heard through the grapevine", but it seems to make sense and I wanted to offer a viable answer to Blackfish's question. If someone has first hand knowledge to answer this question, please let us know.

Now for that disclosure that Ben was looking for:



I am not now nor have I ever been a DIR diver. However, I believe the philosophy to be a good one and am enrolled in Michael H. Kane's December DIR-F class on Catalina Island.

That should cover it.

Christian