Teen diver dead - Catalina Island, California

[Centrals]

I was denied to sign up for a dive at Playa de Carmen many yr ago because I did not have my C-card. My DAN insurance card was not good enough.

 

[DandyDon]

I had the pleasure of diving with Liberty Dive in Tulamben, Bali in early September. I wasn't asked for a card (although I did show up with all my gear, lugging a camera )

Yeah, no one carries more gear to a dock than me, at least on the boats I go on - plus my pony bottle, my camera, CO tester, along with my old age, aged T-shirts, dry back pack, etc.

All this has little to do with the accident discussion, tho. It sounds like the poor boy was going for too much, too soon. Cameras can easily distract a diver from watching details like air supply, I know all too well, I hate to see newbies with camera - and I suspect that spear gun was too distracting as well.

I hate threesome dives, watching out for two buddies, wondering if anyone is watching me, etc. From the limited info we've been given, it sounds like maybe the Instructor went up with the distressed diver and the boy stayed below? When I do buddy with anyone, I have learned to have a pre-dive discussion emphasizing that we (all 3 if needed) descend together, stop if needed together, ascend together, stop together, surface together, exit together - stay together at every change. It's too easy to think the other diver will catch up later, with risks escalating from there.

 

[JohnN]

All this has little to do with the accident discussion, tho. It sounds like the poor boy was going for too much, too soon. Cameras can easily distract a diver from watching details like air supply, I know all too well, I hate to see newbies with camera - and I suspect that spear gun was too distracting as well.

You're absolutely correct, sorry for the OT

[video=youtube;SSUXXzN26zg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSUXXzN26zg[/video]

 

[mikeycanuk]

I quickly realized with my first underwater GoPro rig that no way was my 12 year old going to use his. My son is currently 14 and he's only diving with me or my wife, no way in hell am I going to put his life in the hands of strangers, DM, Pro or otherwise.

When he was just days post 10th birthday we went to learn in Akumal. On our very first dive as part of the OPW course he got separated from us. The "instructor" went down with us then took off with us racing to follow. I guess our son stopped to look at something and got separated. When the instructor turned around do did we and junior was gone. Nothing in the way of dive briefing either.
His very first dive was a solo one. Very scary but he came up 15 minutes later way off in the distance. Thankfully he had 5 hrs of Seal Team pool sessions prior to this at home.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Sam Miller III]

The point is a 14 year old lad lost his life diving at Eagle reef near Catalina Island.

Eagle reef is open water diving, the reef extends from the surface to 120 + feet, it is generally sweep with currents, often in heavy boat traffic and by many would be or is considered an advanced dive.

YET a 14 year old lad from Utah with an unknown amount of experience and knowledge of California diving was allowed to dive in a threesome to "spearfish" to a depth of almost 100 feet and lost his young life.

This is a classic American diving tragedy !

The event is shrouded in mystery ! Very little in the local news, nothing from the Utah news that I can locate, absolutely nothing from the boat crew or the boat's captain that so many of you praise.

This leads one to question "Is there a cover up?" "Could there be litigation in the future?" It is certainly developing into a certain amount of intrigue and has all the classic signs of future litigations over the death of the unknown and unnamed 14m year old diver.

Time will tell...

SDM

 

[MikeMeagher]

So let me get this straight. Tell me if I have things right.

A three dive team including an instructor, another adult without good experience, and a 15 year old boy entered the water for their third dive of the day. They dived to more than 100 feet, after which the adult diver surfaced in distress. After a while, they thought about the 15 year old boy looked for him, and found him at 94 feet unresponsive but evidently still alive. He later died after attempts to revive.

The third diver, the instructor, is not mentioned again.

Is that an accurate summary of what we have been told?

That is what I know.. from a VERY good source that was on the boat. that day.. I was not there personally, but shared what was conveyed to me. Not sure where the instructor was. I have no idea if what I was told was factual or not. Just from what I was told from someone who worked on the boat that day.

---------- Post added October 19th, 2015 at 06:21 PM ----------

Some where in Utah a congregation is gathering to remember a young man who lost his short life underwater at Eagle reef in California.

I send the parents, grandparents and his brothers and sisters my most sincere sympathy for their tragic and unnecessary loss.


There are three dive locations in a row in that area; Ship rock, LuLu reef (Dr. Bill can tell you about that one) and Eagle Reef. The last two are open water dives, although at a minus tide the top of Eagle reef can , on occasion, be seen...Actually in the past I have stood on top of it numerous times.

Eagle reef begins a few feet under the water and, as I recall, drops off to 120 or more feet. Because of its location the reef is subject to boat traffic, open water wave action, strong currents and has been known as one of the more advanced dives on the front side of the island.

In the past the trio, Ship rock, LuLu reef and Eagle Reef were favorites for lobster diving and spearfishing; the hunt would begin at Ship rock , work our way via boat to Eagle reef and often reverse the procedure prior to call it a day.

The young victim was also spearfishing. At this juncture one can only speculate as to his spearfishing ability and weapon of choice .

Also one can also only speculate as to the amount and type of training he received in Utah to prepare him for California open water diving.

I suspect there are a number of divers in Utah as well as in California who are doing some very serious soul searching as to what they could have said or what they could have done to prevent his tragedy from occurring.


SDM
LA Co Underwater instructor #11 UICC
NAUI Underwater instructor #27
PADI # 241 or 2241
(And many more in the instructor's alphabet)

I feel for the parents and family of the young man lost. Now that I have my own two young boys.. I vow to Never push them into diving, nor to permit them to dive until they demonstate to me the critical thinking skills that are required. I personally learned to dive in teh mid 70s at age 15. I was fortunate to have been very serious about the sport, studied it hard, and had rigorous instructors at that time. That said. I still am "lucky" to be alive due to the stupid acts that I did as a young man. I got in over my head many times, but I was lucky and I was able to deal with it at the moment. I don't blame the divers that were diving with the youth.. one enters the ocean and is responsible for their own actions. Us with experience know that it can be overwhelming mentally underwater in a stressful situation, often too much for an adult to deal with, let alone a youth. I feel that the certification agencies as a whole over the years have "dumbed down" the requirements to become a diver and blame that fact as a contributing factor. IMHO.

 

[Psykoesis]

Sad news. I know that many on the board will disagree but if the 14 year old was at 90 ft then that is a deeper than I would want a 14 year old of mine to be at. Not so much the physiology but the consistent judgement and risk appreciation of that age group.

Totally agree...

 

[drrich2]

Of course it's 'shrouded in mystery.' The authorities will take awhile to investigate, and will be in no rush to disclose their findings as they go.

The captain & boat staff would probably be wise to say nothing; I imagine any decent lawyer could tell them that. About all that's needed to trigger some lawsuits is the claim of a bad outcome (& here there's definitely a bad outcome); it doesn't necessarily require an illegal or otherwise wrongful act, and a business or individuals can lose a great deal even if they successfully defend the case.

What's more, people speaking spontaneously from memory while excited in the near aftermath may inadvertently misspeak, but in this day & age, even inadvertent misinformation travels fast, and once the cat's out of the bag, there's often no going back.

As much as we like to get reports like what Mike Meager got from an unnamed source, the fact remains, for people to broadcast info. to the general public is a bad idea from a liability standpoint, even if there's no wrong-doing. IIRC part of the PADI Rescue Diver course covers caution in disclosing information to the media.

Richard.

 

[bowlofpetunias]

Sam I wouldn't be too quick to read conspiracy and cover up into this situation. Don't know if you have ever been on a dive where someone died. Unfortunately I have and I can tell you the first little while it is hard enough to just put one foot in front of the other and function in your world. Anyone involved even in the periphery of the death of this youngster is likely traumatized!

In our litigious society a person would have to be a fool to NOT wonder about potential litigation! Now lets look at the fact that nobody on the INTERNET or in the MEDIA has a RIGHT to information. We have no right to demand the people involved expose themselves to the potential criticisms and legal risks of identifying themselves and posting here before the investigation is complete. Indeed doing so may compromise the investigation.

All of that said it appears to me that someone is providing information to a third party posting here to help our discussion. I know that is what I did in our event. Perhaps we should focus on the information we have so far?

---------- Post added October 20th, 2015 at 04:37 PM ----------

Obviously we can not call these facts because facts require Proof so I shall call it a summary of information provided in this thread...

Initial report told us that:

Teenage diver suspected between 14 and 15 was pulled unconscious from water
Life saving efforts failed
Was diving 60 to 90fsw
diving at "Great Escape"
USCG 11:24 am victim was in Cardiac Arrest
Transported to Catalina Hyperbaric Chambers and later pronounced dead
“The emergency happened at depth,” he said. “He may have run out of air, but we don’t know yet.”
His 23-year-old diving partner was treated and is in stable condition

Discussion concluded that (post 7):
Eagle Reef is a dive spot and the Great Escape is a charter boat

Police appeal for public assistance Post 8 in return of missing weight pocket if found
Eagle Reef site
depth 94fsw
sandy bottom
Black Tusa integrated with "DA" in permanent marker

Discussion:
depth of weight pocket doesn't indicate depth of diver

Discussion to post 17 consensus
Age risk factors impact on diving:
Diver decision making ability not well developed yet
Highly distractable
Poor risk management
Task overload potential

Padi Supervision Requirements provided here

Information provided by third party here (can not be verified as fact)
Boat name Great Escape on Multiday Trip to Catalina
3rd dive of the day @ Eagle Reef dive conditions excellent
Three member team (Instructor, Adult certified but inexperienced and 15? yr old)
? Rumour teen spearing?
Adult Male surfaced alone screaming for help
DM rescued him
Crew put on O2
Role call identified a missing diver
Coast Guard notified
divers search locate and bring up teen
? divers seen below 100fsw during dive?
?15 minute time lapse to recovery?
Sherriff on scene
baywatch took both to the chamber at Catalina
Grandfather on boat

Questions unanswered Instructor's role

News Release here
15yr old Utah Resident

He apparently ran out of air at depth, which was 94 feet.

Investigators from the Sheriff’s Department Emergency Services Detail will handle the investigation.

adult companion was treated at a hospital and was reported in stable condition

Further discussion re Instructor's Role
Information not available on this

Discussion Regarding Boat diving in California
Boat is a Taxi to the site
Crew Available on Board to assist on entry/exit surface
Provide Dive Brief but not in water guide/DM for the dive
Once paperwork is signed and certs verified the divers are in charge of their own dives/safety under water.

Discussion Regarding verification of Certification/Age
Some report this is adequately/inadequately done by dive OPs around the world.

Discussion about Buddying with a Minor:
Requirements by agencies see above

Consensus:
This practice is fraught with dangers on multiple levels and Family members set significant boundaries. Posters believe unrelated divers seem to prefer to avoid taking the responsibility of being the buddy of a minor.

Third party information here (unable to qualify as fact)
2 instructors on board
at least one instructor know the age of the teen
unable to say what paperwork done
one supervising adult on record as responsible for teen

Discussion post 43 to 59 ..

Eagle Reef dive description from someone who has dived it
Eagle reef begins a few feet under the water and, as I recall, drops off to 120 or more feet.
subject to: boat traffic,open water wave action, strong currents (it was stated previously conditions on the day were excellent)
?speculation if diver from Utah prepared for California Diving?

Further discussion regarding dangers of young divers and spearfishing. Note it has not been confirmed if the teen was actually spearfishing.
Noted that in spearfishing some buddy separation is needed for safety in case of stray shots or accidental firing.

Discussion teams of 3
Harder to keep track of buddies, keep buddies together

 

[OldNSalty]

It may or may not have been a factor but I have come to the opinion over the years that jumping into an additional activity with SCUBA early such as spearfishing is a bad idea. It comes down to task loading and awareness, add in lack of experience and then add in youth....