Strongly considering solo diving - lets talk

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DA Aquamaster:
I agree with you Scott and I think there is an obligation for more experienced divers to pass on their experience to newer divers. The majority of my dives last year were with relatively newly minted divers and my boat is open to any new divers who want to come aboard. One of the few buddies I trust is an instuctor and has the same basic policy on his boat as a service to his newly certified divers.

Consequently, we leave the dock at 6am to do a deep dive for the day and then come back to the dock to pick up other divers at 9am. since the odds of getting below 60 ft with them are very very slim. On the routine shallow dives I am usually paired with buddy and dive with or without the rest of the group, depending on the skills of the buddy. I also frequenty assist with taking divers on their first deep dives and/or deep specialty check dives. In this role I usually act as a trailing safety diver to ensure no one wanders off, that everyone gets back to the ascent line and gets off the bottom in good order. This incidentally is a whole lot easier to do solo and allows me to assist a diver who is having problems without deserting a buddy. The extra air in a set of doubles also comes in handy if a new diver has air related problems.

I have no problem assisting a diver to gain experience and learn or practice their skills on a normal weekend at the lake. But to be honest, after spending so much time doing that each summer, I really appreciate the chance to go solo when the occasion arises.

A PADI instrutcor who works out of our LDS certifies a ton of divers each year on private courses after they decide they want to get certified two weeks before they are supposed to leave for the the Bahamas or Mexico. They are a large percentage of his business, but I pity every other person who will ultimately get stuck on the same dive boat with them. Even if they are the perfect buddy, their inexperience pretty much dooms the whole boat to the well trampled easy to dive sites.

On the one tropical trip I can afford a year I absolutley do not under any circumstances want to be paired with a new diver or with a diver who is not 100% self sufficient. Given the cost per dive and my distance from salt water, I am not going to abort a dive because the buddy can't get down, is not comfortable at depth or hoovers his or her air. There is far more likely to be a homicide than an abort. And I REALLY REALLY absolutely do not want to be paired with the guy who spent the first couple days of the trip doing his checkout dives as he did not feel like getting this done in the murky local waters around Cleveland or where ever he came from. A tropical trip is absolutely NOT the place to do your OW checkouts.

So my thoughts are that expereinced divers should take the time and effort to help newer divers. But at the same time, newer divers should show the foresight to get certified well in advance of their dive trip to somewhere warm and should demonstrate the dedication to get as much experience as possible locally before they leave on a trip to inflict themselves on a more experienced buddy who is also paying $100 plus per dive somewhere nice. (It's definitely to your credit that you are seeking experience before you leave on your trip.)

Similarly, if the only diving a diver does is one or two tropical trips per year, they need to find another hobby. Fifty dives spread over 5 trips and five years is worth a whole lot less than 50 dives done locally over the course of a summer. There are many traveling divers who will never dive enough to be competent or safe and I certainly do not want to buddy with them in Cozumel even if they feel they are experienced divers as they have been diving for "5 years".

Well said, I completely understand your point of view. I have several trips now planned all of which I am BMOB (Bringing My Own Buddy). Actually this will probably be the way I travel most of the time so as not to be a burden on anybody else's trip. One of my dive buddies has been diving since the early 60's, he always asks the DM on the dive boats to take the new guy. He loves to help new divers when ever possible.

I have a camp on lake champlain also so we will be diving all summer to hone the skills.

Scott
 
Scott M:
Mo2vation:
Case in point: My recent trip to Monterey over T-giving (what up, Atticus?) on a boat by myself, hooked up by the DM with an insta-buddy – dude had 12 dives. I drove for 6 hours round trip, and at the end of an 11 hour day, I had one 21 minute dive and one 30 minute dive. The guy had issues, and my day sucked.
It's nice to know us noobs can rely on you seasoned veterans to take us under your wing and help so maybe we won't make the mistakes or create the "issues". Not all of us were experts on our first dive as you must have been. So this is what I have to look forward?

Scott M:
DA Aquamaster:
On the one tropical trip I can afford a year I absolutley do not under any circumstances want to be paired with a new diver or with a diver who is not 100% self sufficient. Given the cost per dive and my distance from salt water, I am not going to abort a dive because the buddy can't get down, is not comfortable at depth or hoovers his or her air. There is far more likely to be a homicide than an abort.
Well said, I completely understand your point of view.


Scott, which is it? Is it ok for an unprepaired newbie to ruin someone elses vacation or isn't it?

James
 
James Goddard:
Scott, which is it? Is it ok for an unprepaired newbie to ruin someone elses vacation or isn't it?

James

I was speaking from the hip to a statement that at the time seemed to scream noobs not welcome, not just for me but for all noobs. I have since rethought that at least on my perception and clarified my statements. I for one do NOT have a problem with admitting I misspoke. As you can see from statements and past posts I HAVE done everything with in my ability to improve my skills. I have asked the questions dumb or not, I have practiced dry every chance I get, I have scheduled and taken skills classes.

To your question: I would suppose it would depend on the circumstances. An extremely experienced diver and a totally unprepared diver. I could understand some people would get upset with that.

I for one hope to never think I am so good that I would not or could not be bothered to help a new diver if I can. For me the effort and reward of being able to help out if I can would over shadow the lost dive time. Making a friend and being an ambassadore to the sport would be more important than a little lost dive time. But thats just me. I learned this as I said from one my last posts from the gentlemen that introduced me to the sport. Listening to his tales of the reef or whatever he was diving was always over shadowed by the stories of him helping the noob and the experiences he had with them.

Scott
 
James Goddard:
Scott, which is it? Is it ok for an unprepaired newbie to ruin someone elses vacation or isn't it?

James

One note, I said I understood DA's statement, the ENTIRE statement as a whole.

Scott
 
James Goddard:
Scott, which is it? Is it ok for an unprepaired newbie to ruin someone elses vacation or isn't it?

To play devils advocate...

James, why are you spending so much money something you can't ensure you're going achieve? Instead of harrassing Scott and telling he's ruining your trip why don't you bring a buddy so you don't get stuck with and insta-buddy that will ruin your trip?
 
When Walter, a couple of others and myself were diving on sunday at Venice, the viz was poor and i had another tank rented for the weekend and thought about doing a solo dive in a pretty simple lake around here (Lake Denton - about 35ft max, entry is only about 100yds from a roped system around the bottom with a few sunken 15ft boats, no current, ~78-80F, viz 5-15ft depending on algae). I was planning on just walking in from the entry and going exploring with the rope system, just practicing some solo stuff, i have dove this lake 4 times for my checkouts and feel pretty comfortable with the lay of the land and surfacing IF something were to happen. I keep a good eye on my watch, gauges and am usually quick to pick up how an area is above water (hopefully below as well).

I suggested this to Walter as we were having lunch, i dont know why he raised his eyebrow at this (i wasnt buddying him that morning, so we didnt actually see much of each other underwater), but i got the impression that he wasnt so keen on me doing it. Turns out as i was driving home that if i had made the trip off the interstate i wouldnt have got home til later and that was the eventually reason i didnt drop in for 40+ mins on the lake. I felt confident enough to get myself out of the water if something were to happen, but not over-confident, not that kind of guy who is all bravado with nothing to back it up, i pretty much know my limits and was going to be conservative. IF i had had the time i probably would have done it and may still one day if the opportunity arises. I have only done 13 dives so far including my checkouts, all but 3 were in freshwater and i feel my weight is where it should be, my skills are ok, being used to hanging upside-down and various other positions just on breath alone for a period (minutes, before i got bored peering at whatever) and swimming thru tight squeezes too on the couple of trips i have done - none of which is needed for this basic lake, which is a large dish shape with the surface only 30ft away.

Anyway, i did fancy trying it that time, set a few simple skills goals and just have a little fun on the rope system, but couldnt due to time. Where is the true harm in that? And as a seperate note if Walter reads it, why the raised eyebrow?

Simon
 
cornfed:
To play devils advocate...

James, why are you spending so much money something you can't ensure you're going achieve? Instead of harrassing Scott and telling he's ruining your trip why don't you bring a buddy so you don't get stuck with and insta-buddy that will ruin your trip?

If James would forward me a list of trips he has scheduled I would be sure to rearrange my schedule as to not interfear with his diving. His loss really, I've been told I am a pretty fun guy to hang with :wavey:

Scott
 
simbrooks:
Anyway, i did fancy trying it that time, set a few simple skills goals and just have a little fun on the rope system, but couldnt due to time. Where is the true harm in that? And as a seperate note if Walter reads it, why the raised eyebrow?

Simon

There are a significant number of people who are simply philosophically opposed to solo diving.

IMHO careful analysis does not bear out their position, but then again, religion is funny like that.
 
Scott M:
If James would forward me a list of trips he has scheduled I would be sure to rearrange my schedule as to not interfear with his diving. His loss really, I've been told I am a pretty fun guy to hang with :wavey:

I would hope so... given your avatar! :D
 
Genesis:
There are a significant number of people who are simply philosophically opposed to solo diving.

IMHO careful analysis does not bear out their position, but then again, religion is funny like that.

My biggest problem with it (and I'm not including anyone here in this statement) is relatively new divers who are basically asking for permission to solo dive. If you want to solo dive go do it. I don't care because I won't be diving with you! :D
 

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