Steve Irwin dead from stingray sting

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Diver0001:
Between ribs, probably.

R..

There are two ways to get into the heart through the chest without going through bone (i.e. the sternum):

1) between the ribs -- best approach is between the 4th and 5th ribs just to the left of the sternum (patient's left).

2) just beneath the xiphoid process (at the bottom end of the sternum) and aiming up towards the patient's left shoulder.

I know because when I was an intern, it was common practice to give intracardiac injections of adrenalin during a cardiac arrest. I gave many of them.

My problem is that I just can't picture what position the stingray was in relative to Steve to get the barb in his heart. Was the ray facing in the same direction as Steve or opposite to him? I also didn't realize that sting ray barbs detatched within their victims.

I suspect that Steve might have had a better chance of surviving if he had not pulled the barb out. It was possibly tamponading the wound while in and also, since the serrations point backwards, he would have ripped a bigger hole in his heart/chest by pulling the barb out.:shakehead
 
I think that this man (whom I have never met) died tradgically doing what he loved, I'm so sorry for his family, wife and children~ I would guess they will always feel his absence, as will anyone who saw or were affected by his passing. He really was an inspiration to anyone with a mind for conservation or link to the natural world, mainly because he tried to make everyone understand that the natural world wasn't supposed to be feared, but respected and understood. He is, and will continue to be an icon that I hope is understood in this way. I think that the analysise by some in this and previous post are off the mark considering that if you play with fire, you get burned, to me this was a fluke~ explained only by a spiritual call home. I have some experience with handling dangerous animals (not being handled by them) and there is a mutual no harm feeling that developes after the initial contact, for a fact. I have the sincerest hopes that he rests in piece and that his family finds piece without too much harrasement. Again, very sorry to hear Jim
 
As others have said, this is a tragedy. Agree with his methods or not, Steve Erwin enlightened us and made us more aware of nature and endevored to preserve it.
I hope that the video of his death is not published for his families sake but I do hope that someone (his producer?) who is knowlegeable could review it so that the rest of us who come in contact with rays can learn from this accident.
I think there is a big difference between a sting ray city ray that is used to human contact and one who has rarely if ever seen a human being.
Aren't sharks the natural predator of rays? The ray may have thought he was a shark and reacted defensively. Regardless, he should have not put himself in harms way like that. Rays have a safe end and a dangerous end and I am sure he knew that unless he didn't see it.
I had the opportunity to feed rays in Grand Turk and found it a safe experience unless you foolishly stepped on one.
I also encountered a large ray on the bottom in Baja Sea of Cortez last year. This area was rarely dove and the ray stared at me for several minutes trying to figure out what I was. If I had swam over it and tried to play around with it I would have been flirting with disaster.
When you approach two pit bulls and one is wagging it's tail and acting friendly and the other is just staring, you would be well advised to be careful with both.
Steve Erwin was an expert with Salt Water Crocs and snakes but was he an expert on rays?
None the less, a terrible loss of a great advocate of nature.
 
It was a tragic accident but will it prevent me from going on the stingray dive in the Caymens next year no.

Besides three people have died from stingray stings in Austraila since they kept records whenever that was and 100 people die every year here in the USA from choking on ball point pens. I will dive with rays and use a pen mabe I should be on suicide watch hehe :).
 
Another accident was reported in Florida. Rays have the equipment, if you are close enough for a defensive strike and the ray is in the mood, you may well get spiked. Nothing really new in this. There are lots of leg wounds out there to support this.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/lo...ct19,0,3579615.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines
Stingray jumps aboard boat and stabs Lighthouse Point man, 81, in chest


By Sofia Santana and Brian Haas
South Florida Sun-Sentinel and sun-sentinel.com

October 19, 2006, 7:04 AM EDT


A Lighthouse Point man underwent open-heart surgery late Wednesday after he was stabbed in the chest by a spotted eagle ray that leapt onto his boat..

James Bertakis, 81, was reported in critical but stable condition on Thursday morning at Broward General Medical Center. Sarah Howley, spokesman for the North Broward Hospital District, said a more detailed update would be issued later.

The accident occurred while retired developer Bertakis was with two of his adult granddaughters on a cruise Wednesday to look at waterfront mansions in Lighthouse Point.

When the stringray landed in the boat, Bertakis tried to push it back in the water, and that's when he was stabbed, relatives said.

The freak occurrence brought to mind the stingray attack that killed "Crocodile Hunter" Steve Irwin and left Bertakis' family in disbelief, said one of Bertakis' granddaughters, from her Gross Pointe, Mich. Home Wednesday night.

One of Bertakis' other granddaughters described the injury Wednesday night: "Every time his heart pumps, it's like a razor blade, it just keeps cutting," said Catherine Bertakis, from her Grosse Pointe, Mich. home.

The stinger also pierced James Bertakis' lung, said son John Bertakis, from his office at the family business in Roseville, Mich. "Initially it seemed all right, but he lost a lot of blood," he said.Some relatives were standing vigil at the hospital, relaying details back to relatives in Michigan, where the family owns Bertakis Development Inc. James Bertakis in 1972 founded the company, which specializes in manufactured homes and has property in Michigan and Texas

"We're all in a state of shock right now," John Bertakis said. "We hope health and strength are on his side, he's a strong man."

Catherine Bertakis described her grandfather as an athlete who rarely gets sick.

"He lives in this 35-year-old body," she said. "He should live to be 120 years old."

James Bertakis was conscious after the attack and, with the help of his granddaughters, steered the boat back to his Lighthouse Point home in the 3800 block of Northeast 30th Avenue, where one of them called 911.

Firefighters and police found Bertakis with a foot-long barb in the left side of his chest.

"He was in pain from the toxins," said Lt. Mike Sullivan of the Lighthouse Point Fire Department.

Firefighters initially took Bertakis to North Broward Medical Center in Deerfield Beach, but hours later he was flown to Broward General in Fort Lauderdale for more treatment. Sarah Howley, Broward General hospital spokeswoman, said Bertakis was listed in critical condition.

The stingray, which was about 5-feet wide, died on the boat, firefighters said. They kept it in a plastic bag and on ice until Florida Fish and Wildlife Conservation Officers could pick it up late Wednesday, Sullivan said.

In his 23 years with the fire department, he had never heard of such a stingray attack in Lighthouse Point.

Irwin, the popular, telegenic naturalist from Australia, died Sept. 4 after a similar rare accident. A stingray barb pierced him in the heart while he was filming on the Great Barrier Reef.

Carl Luer, senior scientist at Mote Marine Laboratory in Sarasota, who studies sharks and rays, said spotted eagle rays often jump completely out of the water, although no one is sure why. "It can be very dramatic," he said.

But certainly this ray had no aggressive intentions toward the boat, he said.

"That's a very unusual accident," Luer said. "I've never heard of an eagle ray jumping into a boat before. But I can tell you it was not trying to jump into the boat. It was a pure accident."

Florida waters harbor four species of rays that have barbed tails: Atlantic stingrays, southern stingrays, spotted eagle rays and cownose rays. Anyone who encounters one, whether in a boat or any place else, should not touch it to avoid getting stung, he said.

"The best thing to do is to not try to handle it," Luer said.

Staff Writers David Fleshler and Tal Abbady contributed to this report.

Sofia Santana can be reached at svsantana@sun-sentinel.com or 954-356-4631.
 
DivingDoc:
There are two ways to get into the heart through the chest without going through bone (i.e. the sternum):

1) between the ribs -- best approach is between the 4th and 5th ribs just to the left of the sternum (patient's left).

2) just beneath the xiphoid process (at the bottom end of the sternum) and aiming up towards the patient's left shoulder.

I know because when I was an intern, it was common practice to give intracardiac injections of adrenalin during a cardiac arrest. I gave many of them.

My problem is that I just can't picture what position the stingray was in relative to Steve to get the barb in his heart. Was the ray facing in the same direction as Steve or opposite to him? I also didn't realize that sting ray barbs detatched within their victims.

I suspect that Steve might have had a better chance of surviving if he had not pulled the barb out. It was possibly tamponading the wound while in and also, since the serrations point backwards, he would have ripped a bigger hole in his heart/chest by pulling the barb out.:shakehead

In this latest accident involving the 81 year old man, apparently the barb was gradually pulled into the heart muscle through normal heart function following the initial penetration and breaking off of the spine.

There are two news video clips at http://www.sun-sentinel.com/ currently, (they may not be there tomorrow), one describing the accident and the other covering comments from the attending medical team regarding the heart surgery. They mention that the spine tamponaded the wound which in this case was left in place pending surgery.
 
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