Question Solo Cert for Technical Dives?

[Cthippo]

I want them to at least be aware that there are safer, easier, more fun ways to do these dives so that they can make informed decisions.

Has it ever occurred to you that different people might enjoy different things than you do? That not everybody prefers doing activities with other people or finds doing things with other people more enjoyable? I know you might find this hard to believe, but not everyone is like you.

 

[Nick_Radov]

Has it ever occurred to you that different people might enjoy different things than you do? That not everybody prefers doing activities with other people or finds doing things with other people more enjoyable? I know you might find this hard to believe, but not everyone is like you.

Sure, I understand that some divers prefer to make things as difficult and dangerous as possible. That's fine, they can do as they please and it's not my place to tell anyone how to dive. I just want to ensure that the new divers who read these forums are aware that better alternatives exist.

 

[SpaceX Aquanaut]

So what, I knew 2 divers one on OC and the other doing a check out dive on a rebreather in a quarry where they both drowned, did they drown because there was 2 of them. Save the scare mongering for the new divers you like to preach your perfect system too, its not going to work on me.

Sure, I get it. Nothing I write can scare the tough guys who are convinced they have it all figured out. I know there are old timers on here who are going to keep doing whatever because they believe they're invincible (or they just don't care), and that's fine.

When I post on these forums my comments are aimed more at the newer divers who still have open minds. I want them to at least be aware that there are safer, easier, more fun ways to do these dives so that they can make informed decisions. That involves taking a more systemic approach with a greater level of discipline and preparation. When I started diving back in 1999 I was lucky enough to stumble upon the old Aquanaut Techdiver mailing list where some users opened my eyes to a holistic system which — while perhaps not perfect — was at least superior to what my training had covered. So now I'm just trying to pay it forward.

Look at it objectively this way guys: Adrift and lost at sea -it takes about three days to succumb to Dehydration in tropical waters (a terrible and painful demise); in colder temperate waters and onset of Hypothermia:

●60 degree F/15degC - survival time 7 hours
●50 degree F/10degC - survival time 2.5 hours
●40 degree F/5degC - survival time 2 hours
●32 degree F/0degC - survival time 1.5 hours

At least in cold waters, you will "fall asleep" into unconsciousness. . .

Best informed decision, if offshore (and last resort): just get a PLB.

 

[MB NZ]

Look at it objectively this way guys: Adrift and lost at sea -it takes about three days to succumb to Dehydration in tropical waters (a terrible and painful demise); in colder temperate waters and onset of Hypothermia:

●60 degree F/15degC - survival time 7 hours
●50 degree F/10degC - survival time 2.5 hours
●40 degree F/5degC - survival time 2 hours
●32 degree F/0degC - survival time 1.5 hours

At least in cold waters, you will "fall asleep" into unconsciousness. . .

Best informed decision, if offshore (and last resort): just get a PLB.

I'm sure you could half those times for me, if not reduce them even further. My old fishing buddy in the US refused to wear a lifejacket when we fished offshore out of Montauk. He was of the opinion that a lifejacket would only prolong the suffering!

 

[Anish]

When I first read "pinnacle dives" I interpreted the phrase to mean diving at the edge of one's ability. i.e. you shouldn't solo dive at the edge of your ability. However, upon googling I see Pinnacle Dives are those which:

...explore underwater rock formations that rise vertically from the seabed, creating a "pinnacle shape", often with challenging features like narrow crevices, overhangs, and strong currents, typically requiring a higher level of diving skill and experience compared to a standard reef dive.

I have only dove freshwater quarries and Florida caverns. Having no experience with current, it sounds like a dangerous, anxiety-inducing environment to me.

I just did some Pinnacle dives at Maldives (the rock formation in the ocean kind) and got into some real trouble at one site (Fish Head) with washing machine currents. Ive dived currents before in Indonesia but nothing prepares you for ripping current that changes direction including down current. At one point we were climbing up the reef with our hands. I can see why as a solo diver that would be dangerous. Even with the group and experienced instructor level guides it was quite terrifying for the whole group.

 

[flymolo]

I just did some Pinnacle dives at Maldives (the rock formation in the ocean kind) and got into some real trouble at one site (Fish Head) with washing machine currents. Ive dived currents before in Indonesia but nothing prepares you for ripping current that changes direction including down current. At one point we were climbing up the reef with our hands. I can see why as a solo diver that would be dangerous. Even with the group and experienced instructor level guides it was quite terrifying for the whole group.

gotta be even more terrifying for the guides if they can't get to someone because the currents won't allow it

 

[grantmac]

I just did some Pinnacle dives at Maldives (the rock formation in the ocean kind) and got into some real trouble at one site (Fish Head) with washing machine currents. Ive dived currents before in Indonesia but nothing prepares you for ripping current that changes direction including down current. At one point we were climbing up the reef with our hands. I can see why as a solo diver that would be dangerous. Even with the group and experienced instructor level guides it was quite terrifying for the whole group.

Was everyone in the group using redundant equipment?

 

[lostsheep]

Nothing I write can scare the tough guys who are convinced they have it all figured out. I know there are old timers on here who are going to keep doing whatever because they believe they're invincible (or they just don't care), and that's fine.

When I post on these forums my comments are aimed more at the newer divers who still have open minds. I want them to at least be aware that there are safer, easier, more fun ways to do these dives so that they can make informed decisions. That involves taking a more systemic approach with a greater level of discipline and preparation. When I started diving back in 1999 I was lucky enough to stumble upon the old Aquanaut Techdiver mailing list where some users opened my eyes to a holistic system which — while perhaps not perfect — was at least superior to what my training had covered. So now I'm just trying to pay it forward.

Sure, I understand that some divers prefer to make things as difficult and dangerous as possible. That's fine, they can do as they please and it's not my place to tell anyone how to dive. I just want to ensure that the new divers who read these forums are aware that better alternatives exist.

I don’t think hubris and name calling are likely to achieve your goal of enlightening newer divers.

Do you see the irony of mentioning your 26 year diving history, mocking old timers who are unwilling to change , followed by an adherence to your own rigid protocols?

 

[34109411]

As I recall, DAN has noted that in a very high percentage of dive fatalities, the diver died alone. That does not mean, however, that it was the diver's intent to be alone. In many cases, the diver was with a buddy or a group and somehow became separated. Of the people I know personally who died on dives, every single one died alone, but every single one started the dive with someone and had no intention of being alone.

I used to write the descriptions of cave diving deaths for the National Speleological Society's cave accident reports. Almost all of those were also alone. Most were planned solo dives; others had unplanned separations.

i read somewhere that most diver separated from the group had usually their tank almost full and the cause was not direct and OOA situation but most likely panic that lead to hyper ventilation or similar.

 

[boulderjohn]

i read somewhere that most diver separated from the group had usually their tank almost full and the cause was not direct and OOA situation but most likely panic that lead to hyper ventilation or similar.

I have never heard anything remotely like that. It isn't close to true in any of the cases I know.