Sea Shepherd condemned by International Whaling Commission.

[aquaman_06]

Mike,

I agree with your statement and think the due process would be the best answer. Sadly it seems Japan working as an economic bully has protected themselves from having the laws they break enforced upon them. As I stated earlier when Japan breaks conservation laws their ship should be boarded and those taking part in the action tried under the law. For some reason that does not happen even when Japanese Whaling fleets are in clear violation of the law.

There was an article in National Geography two years ago detailing the way Japan was offering financial bribes to a variety of nations, even small island nations that have the swing power in the IWC's vote on whether to continue whaling's worldwide moratorium.

It was the U.S. that pressured Japan into cutting back on whaling promising that if they stopped whaling they could still fish in the Alaskan territory. When the Japanese used illegal fishing practices in the Alaskan territory and nearly over fished all the key species in no time flat the U.S. sent them on the road and they increased their whaling operation.

Personally I think it would be great if SS took all the money they spend on ships and what not and invested it in legal services and investigators to prove how in the wrong the Japanese are. The problem in during the time investigations were taking place and all this evidence went through countless litigation the Japanese would be killing hundreds if not thousands of whales. I guess SS feels that their direct action conservation approach works much better.

What I can't get about the Japanese people is how a culture so stopped in honor and tradition has allowed themselves to become mass murderers of the sea. Long ago in Japan when Iceland and Norway started whaling with powered vessels and harpoons that Japanese whalers were against this mindless slaughter of whales. They believed the whales to be the Guardians of the Sea and promoted a sustainable harvest. It wasn't until post WWII Japan that the demand for whale meat increased, partly due to the economic fall post Hiroshima. It was then that the Japanese began full scale whaling which they have not stopped even today.

I just fear that unless law enforcement were to take action SS is the only protection whales will get from illegal whaling. How to you work against a nation who founded the proverb:

"There's nothing to throw away from a whale except its voice."

This proverb speaks to the fact that the Japanese utilize the meat and oil of the whale. Pretty disgusting saying if you ask me.

 

[Zingtea]

How does law enforcement generally work (at least around here)? When someone commits a conservation law violation they are ticketed or arrested. Later the case is decided in court. Usually we refrain from issueing punishment until there is a conviction. It's the whole due process thing.

Ever have a law enforcement officer just ram your car or throw rancid butter at you?...that's not what they usually do anyway. They flash their lights or show you a warrent, you yield, they write you a ticket or arrest you and then you get ygour day in court.

I don't think we should confuse what SS does with law enforcement.

In the United States, police officers are authorized to tase someone who doesn't comply with their orders. Sea Shepherd's actions are not physically harmful.

 

[MikeFerrara]

In the United States, police officers are authorized to tase someone who doesn't comply with their orders. Sea Shepherd's actions are not physically harmful.

Yes, the police can do that in certain situations. In theory, they're also trained to know when they can and when they can't and held responsible when they screw it up. SS isn't authorized to issue orders to anyone and nobody in the world is legally obligated to comply with any order coming from them. Yet, they have damaged property, destroyed property, thrown things at people (assault/battery) and interfered with the free movement of others (unlawful restraint around here).

What do you mean their actions aren't physically harmful? Didn't they use explosives to sink a ship? You don't think that could get someone hurt? They modified their ships for ramming, right? You don't think someone could get hurt when ships are crashing together?

 

[aquaman_06]

Mike,

Whenever SS makes a direct action they always radio the ship first and open all airways of communication. They even went as far as boarding a Japanese whaler with a written letter asking the whaling ship to cease illegal whaling activities. They don't just suddenly start ramming vessels - they first ask them to stop and cite what international law they are acting under.

The individual from SS that boarded the Japanese whaling ship was tied to the side of the ship as the captain turned sharply into the cold antarctic surf. It was a major fiasco just getting that individual back from the Japanese.

Personally I don't have any problem with SS's actions. What I would like to see is the U.N. and countries who's laws have been violated be the ones to enforce the rules. It seems like that isn't happening. Though the Australian government has stated they are looking into what can be done regarding Japan's recent actions in their waters.

Perhaps at the end of the day neither SS or Japan are in the right. It's like Captain Watson says, "We are pirates of compassion working to stop pirates of greed." I guess SS is fighting fire with fire.

 

[Zingtea]

And for the record, Sea Shepherd never used explosives to sink a ship.

 

[scubadale]

And for the record, Sea Shepherd never used explosives to sink a ship.

This quote is from the Sea Shepherd website:

The Sierra had been towed to Lisbon for repairs, though the Portuguese authorities lied to the American consul and told him that the ship had left the country. Taking advantage of the Sierra's immobility, a team of underwater demolition experts made preparations to finish the career of the whaler.

On February 6, 1980, after undergoing US$ one million in repairs, the Sierra was sunk at dockside by a single limpet mine that blew a small hole in the hull. The ship took on water and slowly sank until it struck the bottom. Nobody was injured.

 

[Zingtea]

I read about that event in Sea Shepherd: My Fight for the Whales and Seals. It was written by Paul Watson in the 80's, which is probably before the Sea Shepherd website was created. He described how he rammed the Sierra. He wrote that he later heard of the bombing, but never implied that he was responsible. I know this is a primary source and therefore probably biased, but I believe it more than the website.

 

[Geoff_H]

So judging from what you have said as long as I don't recognize a nations waters or laws then I don't have to abide by them. All I need to say is hey only a few nations recognize this as yours, heck none of them are big and I don't think the U.N. recognizes it either - I can do whatever I want here. Perhaps Paul Watson of SS didn't recognize those whaling ships as ships. Maybe he recognized them as giant robots like the transformers rising out of the deep. Perhaps even the Japanese didn't recognize Paul Watson's ship as a ship either when they shot at it. Maybe they thought it was - ahhhhhhhhhhh "GODZILLA!!" (lips not matching words)

It is pretty clear that one country doesn't have a unilateral right to declare vast swathes of the ocean as their own. America, Russia and China don't agree with Australia's claim, and nor do more than one hundred others. Neither does the supreme authority in these matters - the United Nations.

But, I guess you feel your opinion is more important than all these nations and authorities. Let's call the new state of play as "aquaman's world". In aquaman's world, all nations have a right to ignore international laws and start declaring their own as they see fit. I hope everyone gets along nicely in aquamans's world but I'm afraid I can't really see it happening.

 

[Geoff_H]

Whenever SS makes a direct action they always radio the ship first and open all airways of communication. They even went as far as boarding a Japanese whaler with a written letter asking the whaling ship to cease illegal whaling activities. They don't just suddenly start ramming vessels - they first ask them to stop and cite what international law they are acting under.

So when you're walking along the street that I have declared as MY STREET (even though the claim isn't recognised by others) it's ok if I give you a letter before I harrass and throw acid over you?

What happened if I declare all the streets around your work as MY STREET and forbid you from walking on them? Would you ignore my unilateral declaration or would you stop going to work?

 

[Mr.X]

It is pretty clear that one country doesn't have a unilateral right to declare vast swathes of the ocean as their own. America, Russia and China don't agree with Australia's claim, and nor do more than one hundred others. Neither does the supreme authority in these matters - the United Nations.

But, I guess you feel your opinion is more important than all these nations and authorities. Let's call the new state of play as "aquaman's world". In aquaman's world, all nations have a right to ignore international laws and start declaring their own as they see fit. I hope everyone gets along nicely in aquamans's world but I'm afraid I can't really see it happening.

Sure they can. They do it all the time. Russia, Canada and the US are fighting over vast swaths of underwater real estate under the Arctic.

I'll stress one point again to all. Why does this sector of the Japanese fishing industry continue to pursue this course of action, especially in light of the fact that no one wants the meat? It's a tremendous waste of time, energy and Yen. What motivates the leadership of this industry to continue this course of action? I have my ideas as to why this exists, and they are not very pretty. An ugly underbelly that precludes the sovereignty to hunt cetacea.

X