Sea Shepherd condemned by International Whaling Commission.

[Geoff_H]

You should learn to read posts better.

He can't handle the cognitive dissonance that would invoke. In his world, things are black and white and there are no shades of grey.

 

[StevenN]

The economic thing is because of the moratorium. No one can just keep a fleet idle for years. The Japanese subsidise a very small fleet that conducts the "scientific research" to keep the skills etc in existence until such time as commercial whaling is allowed again. It's only about 5 boats in reality. However - they would become the core of any future commercial whaling operation.

Kim is outing the Japanese whalers for lying about their intent.

 

[terrillja]

I had already replied. My point was you can't find anyone credible supporting the Sea Shepherd.

I was never trying to support Sea Shepherd...

I was only presenting a counterpoint, and then providing statements from Sea Shepherd to better inform others of their position and plan of action. At no time did I say throwing spoiled butter or attempting to foul propellors was a great idea.

Though now that you bring up credible, I'd have to say the Dalai Lama is a pretty credible guy, and he supports Sea Shepherd, and certainly doesn't have anything to gain by supporting them.

 

[terrillja]

Welcome to the board.

In answer to your question - many in Japan think that whale makes nice "sushi" - which, given your screen name, I'd have thought you might understand!

You can have the sushi! You do know the mercury levels in whale meat, right? Just remember that the small amount from the bottom travels up the food chain and can get quite hight at the top. Probably why nothing would want to eat us, with all the trace amounts of chemicals and such building up inside of us.

 

[StevenN]

Kim says-

"Japan DOES conduct scientific research - it's not a lie at all......they publish the results.

On the other hand the scientific research gives them an excuse to do something they want to do anyway."

So which one is it? You have a conflicting argument here which just makes you seem that much less credible.

When you tell the truth you don't have to remember what you lied about.

 

[Geoff_H]

Though now that you bring up credible, I'd have to say the Dalai Lama is a pretty credible guy, and he supports Sea Shepherd, and certainly doesn't have anything to gain by supporting them.

Ten years ago (1998) he supported them, I see no evidence that the support is continued or he approves of the aggressive actions taken recently.

By the way, the Dalai Lama needs publicity - that's one reason for him to issue statements like he did in 1998. The only way Tibet will free itself from Chinese control is through a wider understanding of the problems there and pressure from foreign governments on China. As we've seen recently, the Chinese will crush any form of uprising.

 

[scubadale]

I had already replied. My point was you can't find anyone credible supporting the Sea Shepherd.

Even the Australian government - hardly pro-Japanese whaling! - said this to the Sea Shepherd

UK Indymedia - Sea Shepherd Receives Message From the Australian Government

It is interesting that you cut out portions of the letter from the Australian govt. to make it appear that they wanted Sea Shepherd to stop. The letter indicates that the Australian govt doesn't want the Sea Shepherd to board the Japanese vessel again as it is a hazard for the Australian govt to transfer the boarders off of one ship and onto the other.

Here is the link you gave:

Sea Shepherd Receives Message From the Australian Government

Sea Shepherd Conservation Society | 29.02.2008 16:37 | Animal Liberation | World
Captain Paul Watson onboard the Sea Shepherd vessel Steve Irwin received an email from the Australian government. See the letter and Captain Watson’s response below..

Japan's quota is to kill up to 1000 whales this winter
Japan's quota is to kill up to 1000 whales this winter

===============
From: Donne, Tony
===============

Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2008 23:36
Subject: Message to Captain WATSON on behalf of the Australian Government [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Dear Captain WATSON

I have been asked to transmit the following message on behalf of the Australian Government.

Following the transfer by the Oceanic Viking of two of your crew members from the Yushin Maru No. 2 to the Steve Irwin on 18 January 2008, you made the public statement that having delivered a letter of protest to the Japanese whaling fleet, you did not see an incident of this kind occurring again.

The Australian Government is concerned that your recent public statements indicate that you may be contemplating another boarding of a Japanese vessel in the Southern Ocean.

Weather and sea conditions in the Southern Ocean, and the very long distances involved, mean that the area is an inherently dangerous one in which to operate. For this reason, the Australian Government has continually called on all parties in the Southern Ocean to exercise restraint.

As the Australian Government has previously outlined, now that the monitoring mission of the Oceanic Viking has been completed, neither protest nor whaling vessels can in any way assume that the Australian Government will be in a position to respond immediately in the event of any serious incident.

You should also understand that it may not be possible for the Australian Government to intervene, in the event of another boarding incident, to facilitate the transfer of people from one vessel to another on the high seas.

Crew members of ships in the Southern Ocean should not attempt to board other vessels. All parties should understand that to do so may well be contrary to the law of the flag state of any such vessel.

For this reason, the Australian Government once again calls on you - as it does all parties - to exercise the utmost restraint in your activities in the Southern Ocean.

The Australian Government strongly discourages activity which could be illegal or unsafe activity which could lead to injury or loss of life at sea.

TONY DONNE
A/DUTY COORDINATOR
INTELLIGENCE

======================
Reply from Captain Watson:
======================

Dear Mr. Donne,

Thank-you for your message.

We did say to the media at the time that we saw no need to deliver a another message to the Japanese notifying them of the fact that there was an Australian Federal Court ruling that very day prohibiting Japanese whalers from killing whales in Australian territorial waters.

We never said that we would rule out boarding Japanese vessels as a tactic. If the non-violent boarding of an illegal whaler can shut down illegal whaling for days or weeks then we believe this is a valid tactic.

In fact at no time did any representative of the Australian government ever speak to me directly about tactics, plans or issues. I never spoke to a representative of the Australian government or the Federal police to the fact that we would not board a ship again if circumstances required us to.

We regard the Japanese whaling ships as poaching vessels. I believe that Australia has boarded poaching vessels many times in the past and rightfully so. The Sea Shepherd Conservation Society has been working in the Galapagos in partnership with the Galapagos National Park rangers and we have boarded shark poaching vessels on many occasions. We have also boarded shark poaching vessels in the waters of Cocos Island National Park off Costa Rica and in 2001 we seized the Ecuadorian long-liner San Jose in the Cocos Island National Park Marine Reserve.

The Japanese whaling fleet is presently hunting whales in the Australian Antarctic Territory despite an Australian Federal Court order specifically prohibiting the killing of whales in these specific waters.

Japan is targeting endangered whales (Fins) in violation of the Convention on the International Trade in Endangered Species (CITES). Japan is violating numerous regulations of the International Whaling Commission.

In your message you relayed it was stated "The Australian Government strongly discourages activity which could be illegal or unsafe activity which could lead to injury or loss of life at sea."

Respectfully this must include illegal whaling and illegal whaling is causing the loss of life at sea - specifically thousands of whales.

What is Australia going to do to protect the lives of the whales presently threatened by illegal Japanese whaling activity?

When the Australian government calls for the exercising of "restraint" I would expect this to include the Federal Australian court order that used that exact same word in calling for the "restraint" of all Japanese whaling operations.

Last month it was the Japanese who requested that the Oceanic Viking remove two of my crew and return them to the Steve Irwin. I made no such request but I was willing to cooperate with both the Japanese Captain and the Captain of the Oceanic Viking to have the men transferred back to my ship.

I do not expect to and I will not request Australia to intervene in the event any of my crew are once again held hostage by the Japanese. I would find it interesting to see how Australia would react to having an Australian citizen seized in the territorial waters of Australia by illegal Japanese whalers and taken against their will to Japan.

The question must then be asked: Is the line on the nautical charts that indicates the EEZ for Australia 200 miles off the Australian Antarctic coast to be taken seriously? Is this or is this not a legitimate territorial claim? We have been operating under the assumption that these waters do belong to Australia as we have been assuming that an Australian Federal Court order must be worth more than the paper it is printed on. Is this Court Order just a joke to appease Australians who want to see something done about whaling? Is this all just posing and posturing or is Australia serious about ending illegal whaling?

This is my fourth season in these waters. I am well aware of how dangerous and remote this area of the world is. I have never asked nor have I ever expected Australia to come to our rescue in the event of an accident.

The Australian government can expect that the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society will adhere to our long-standing policy of not causing injury to the criminals we oppose. We will however take the required risk to oppose unlawful Japanese whaling operations and we do so within the definition of intervention in the United Nations World Charter for Nature that allows for non-governmental enforcement of international conservation laws and regulations.

I would like to report a crime. The Japanese have eight ships presently inside the Australian Antarctic Territorial waters and these ships are engaged in unlawful activities and they are doing so in blatant contempt of the Australian Federal Court ruling issued January 15th that prohibits the killing of whales in these waters. What is the Australian government going to do about this?

Sincerely,

Captain Paul Watson

Master of the Steve Irwin
Founder and President of the
Sea Shepherd Conservation Society

Sea Shepherd Conservation Society
- Homepage: Sea Shepherd Conservation Society

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Oh yeah this is another bump as the more you and Kim respond the more I am inclined to join Sea Shepherd as well. Maybe I am a terrorist too?

 

[Kim]

Kim says-

"Japan DOES conduct scientific research - it's not a lie at all......they publish the results.

On the other hand the scientific research gives them an excuse to do something they want to do anyway."

So which one is it? You have a conflicting argument here which just makes you seem that much less credible.

When you tell the truth you don't have to remember what you lied about.

Not at all - I simply know the difference between a "lie", and an "excuse" - something you don't appear to.

 

[Kim]

It is interesting that you cut out portions of the letter from the Australian govt. to make it appear that they wanted Sea Shepherd to stop. The letter indicates that the Australian govt doesn't want the Sea Shepherd to board the Japanese vessel again as it is a hazard for the Australian govt to transfer the boarders off of one ship and onto the other.

Someone else who seems to read selectively.

Which part of:

"For this reason, the Australian Government once again calls on you - as it does all parties - to exercise the utmost restraint in your activities in the Southern Ocean.

The Australian Government strongly discourages activity which could be illegal or unsafe activity which could lead to injury or loss of life at sea."

isn't clear?

Note - the letter even says "once again".

 

[StevenN]

Kim you're missing the other post with your quote-
"The economic thing is because of the moratorium. No one can just keep a fleet idle for years. The Japanese subsidise a very small fleet that conducts the "scientific research" to keep the skills etc in existence until such time as commercial whaling is allowed again. It's only about 5 boats in reality. However - they would become the core of any future commercial whaling operation."
Calling it an excuse is just your way to spin a lie and you know it, You said it yourself. I'm not making these quotes up they're your own.