Scuba diver dies after being found floating at Kurnell, NSW, Australia

[DandyDon]

A lot of assumptions there. Just not adding up.

Overweighted, OOA, and failing to ditch weights will kill anyone.

And I really hate the temr "travel wing/BC." So many brag about how easy it is to fly theirs, but so dangerous in an emergency.

 

[gcarter]

It means that the inherent positive buoyancy of the kit (suit, AL tanks when empty etc) and the inherent negative buoyancy of the kit (weight of negatively buoyant gear + ballast) is about equal..... in other words, you're not carrying too much weight.

In practice the litmus test for a balanced rig in the eyes of most divers is if you can float all your gear (core kit plus weights, lights and other paraphernalia) on the surface with only the positive buoyancy of the BCD. There is reason to believe in this case that the rig was not balanced..... which means that even with the BCD inflated that the whole was still negatively buoyant.

R..

---------- Post added October 11th, 2013 at 01:43 PM ----------


I believe it's possible that both of these points played some role.



I don't believe that 50 bar in 3 meters of water with an expectation of a few minutes of bottom time would indicate an unsafe reserve. This conclusion goes too far as far as I'm concerned. There is no doubt, it would seem, that the tank was empty when she was found but there is an unresolved question about how the tank came to be empty.

R..

---------- Post added October 11th, 2013 at 01:47 PM ----------



At this point I'm edging to the same conclusion but I would be cautious of assuming that eye-witness accounts are 100% accurate. They usually are not. To my way of thinking it's possible that the BCD was partially inflated and reported by witnesses as fully inflated.

R..

If her BCD was full and she was still negative, it would follow that she would have been using her drysuit for buoyancy during the dive. If, in her unfamiliarity with the kit she was trying to gain lift but momentarily forgot that she needed to use two different inflators, is it not possible that she simply kept pushing air into the BCD and losing it through the OPV? It would not take long to go through 50 bar this way.

 

[Diver0001]

Overweighted, OOA, and failing to ditch weights will kill anyone.

And I really hate the temr "travel wing/BC." So many brag about how easy it is to fly theirs, but so dangerous in an emergency.

Don, what makes you think that a travel wing is inherently dangerous in an emergency?

R..

 

[DandyDon]

Don, what makes you think that a travel wing is inherently dangerous in an emergency?

R..

It just seems to be cutting corners on buoyancy. How many with them know what the lift is for theirs?

 

[scubadada]

My Scubapro Knighthawk has 45 pounds of lift, gross over spec for the majoriity of my diving, but adequate, even for diving as described in this thread.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

This is the part that bothers me, I think. As a diver, I have to believe that all this practice of the skills will hold me in good stead when doodoo occurs. If not, what is the use? Would we not just be playing the roulette game? Just adding a drysuit in a benign environment, and my skills will be of no use?

Everything we train for is useless, then. And from my military experience, it isn't true. Even fatally shot, soldiers have done things on pure muscle memory that proves that we do, indeed go to our lowest practiced standard. I don't like Cave Divers' hypotheses, but his description is possible. I prefer to believe that something prevented that ability to revert to the well-practiced skill. We will know after the autopsy -- if they find nothing, I am left with nothing else but the P word.

Skills are only tools, Jax ... no matter how well practiced, they're only as good as your ability to apply them under the correct circumstances and your awareness that you should. I've just this past week had to talk to a very experienced dive buddy about her decisions. I don't doubt her skills for a moment ... she's a very good diver. But I watched her do something that put her in a situation that could've gotten her killed if just one little thing had gone differently ... and it scared the crap out of me.

Awareness and good decision-making are at least as important to safe diving as all the skills they teach you in your diving classes ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[racerx_]

And I really hate the temr "travel wing/BC." So many brag about how easy it is to fly theirs, but so dangerous in an emergency.

In this case, yes, but really depends where you're diving. A travel wing is definitely not going to work adequately in every environment (cold water etc) but in itself adds no danger in say a warm water dive. I have to travel to dive in Asia and the conditions are quite similar in most cases so no issue with my travel bc being able to lift my rig etc. but when I head to Seattle the wing doesn't cut it anymore..

 

[tracydr]

She told me that she was concerned about using any undergarment thicker than lavacore because her drysuit didn't have room for anything else. I questioned whether the drysuit actually fit her but I never got an answer to this PM. This was the 5th of October.

---------- Post added October 11th, 2013 at 05:41 PM ----------

If Quero was overweighted, how was she able to come to the surface, hold position, and discuss her gas?

She inflated her drysuit. She still had air at the time. But, if she ran out of air,she could only orally inflate her BC and had no way to inflate the drysuit.

---------- Post added October 11th, 2013 at 05:45 PM ----------

It just seems to be cutting corners on buoyancy. How many with them know what the lift is for theirs?

A travel BC is fine if it can float your rig. It's usually perfect for tropical conditions. It's just that Quero continued to use a travel BC despite switching to a cold water exposure suit and requiring more lead. She didn't make sure that her wing was still appropriate for her new configuration.

 

[Kevin Carlisle]

Jax, believe me when I say that from the bottom of my heart I want to believe this.... but I'm afraid, despite my sincerest efforts, I can't.

The facts seem to point to a diver who got in severe trouble due to buddy separation and equipment unfamiliarity in combination with being over weighted. There seems to be some complication like OOA or a free flow but the facts are what they are.....

I think it's good to face this because there is a stark lesson to be learned from it.... no matter how experienced you are with the gear and context you're used to... as soon as you change that, you need to learn again.

I have no doubt at *all* in my mind that if Quero were wearing a wetsuit that we would not be having this discussion. The fact that she chose to dive in a drysuit and had made certain gear choices (choices she admitted online that she was struggling with) is key to understanding this accident.

Believe me. I wanted it to be a "simple" heart attack or whatever too .... but the evidence just doesn't support that.

R..

Everyone needs to pay attention to this post. I didnt know the victim but I am close friends to several of her friends. Over the last six years or so I have been involved with too many cases like this, over a dozen and I knew or talked to most of those. It can be tough on friends, and if you are to learn you must put the hurt aside and learn from the facts, and even learn from the speculation no matter how far fetched some are. One major factor is that experienced divers get egos, and I have seen way to many with the it cant happen to me attitude. Every cave diver I have known who died wasnt an accident, there was at least one or two health related things but ALL of the others were completely preventable. The worst thing that can happen here is you dont learn from it. From what I have read, I know the victim would want you to learn from it, even if she made a mistake. Maybe she didnt, but it doesnt look that way.

 

[DevonDiver]

I don't believe that 50 bar in 3 meters of water with an expectation of a few minutes of bottom time would indicate an unsafe reserve. This conclusion goes too far as far as I'm concerned.

I think 35 bar / 500psi is a reasonable reserve for the depths discussed. This provides ample gas for an immediate ascent, whilst also insulating against any gauge inaccuracy. If a problem arises, it also provides some realistic time to stop-think-act if a problem exists/arises.

My thoughts, in relation to this incident, is if re-descending at 50bar; was there an intention to maintain a reserve or was it just a case of "suck the tank dry, because I'm shallow and on my way to the shore not far away?"