Save yourselves, it's too late for me (help needed)

[Nemrod]

Creed has some good advice but he will not stop with two of everything. He has single handed created a tank shortage--lol.

Not to push you guys into anything but the DA is a fine regulator, the Mistral is the real deal and so very vintage and awfully fun to dive with. Nothing like swimming past a swarm of DIR guys practicing weird drills and with a Mistral--you should see their eyes bug out--as you pass them at 110 feet into a strong current--lol. BUT, all that said, the king of the deep, the master of disaster, the top rooster, is the Royal Aqua Master, virtually every important part it uses is available to keep them in top form especially using new Conshelf seats and parts and tuned by a master they can and do perform on par with any modern gear.

I know it will push prices on ebay everytime I say this but if you really want a rebuildable regulator that you can do any dive with in reason then you need a RAM, a late model with heavy yoke will handle the high pressures easily, anything a Conshelf can handle. Someday new seats and parts for the DA will be available or conversion kits to turn it into a RAM but for now with the DA and Mistral some parts can be hard to find-new and unused. Not impossible but can be a challenge. That is the main reason among many that I so prefer the RAM over anything else with two hoses--parts--parts--parts and of course it does not hurt that the crazy thing PERFORMS very well, thank you. All of the above is an opinion so take that it to consideration.

One other thing, vintage is not about cheap, it is entirely possible to spend more money to put together a vintage outfit than a good modern rig. It is entirely possible to have more money into a RAM or the other super doublehoser, the Trieste II, than in a Legend or Apecks complete rig.


"I'm sorry, I was just taking a nap. Good luck with that antique. Don't kill yourself."

Well, that antique has survived almost 40 years and still works and I doubt it has killed anyone. If you can say that about a Apecks 40 years from now--well--we shall see. I suspect the DA will still be around, the Apecks will probably be contributing to a landfill.

N

 

[Creed]

Creed has some good advice but he will not stop with two of everything. He has single handed created a tank shortage--lol.

Not to push you guys into anything but the DA is a fine regulator, the Mistral is the real deal and so very vintage and awfully fun to dive with. Nothing like swimming past a swarm of DIR guys practicing weird drills and with a Mistral--you should see their eyes bug out--as you pass them at 110 feet into a strong current--lol. BUT, all that said, the king of the deep, the master of disaster, the top rooster, is the Royal Aqua Master, virtually every important part it uses is available to keep them in top form especially using new Conshelf seats and parts and tuned by a master they can and do perform on par with any modern gear.

I know it will push prices on ebay everytime I say this but if you really want a rebuildable regulator that you can do any dive with in reason then you need a RAM, a late model with heavy yoke will handle the high pressures easily, anything a Conshelf can handle. Someday new seats and parts for the DA will be available or conversion kits to turn it into a RAM but for now with the DA and Mistral some parts can be hard to find-new and unused. Not impossible but can be a challenge. That is the main reason among many that I so prefer the RAM over anything else with two hoses--parts--parts--parts and of course it does not hurt that the crazy thing PERFORMS very well, thank you. All of the above is an opinion so take that it to consideration.

One other thing, vintage is not about cheap, it is entirely possible to spend more money to put together a vintage outfit than a good modern rig. It is entirely possible to have more money into a RAM or the other super doublehoser, the Trieste II, than in a Legend or Apecks complete rig.


"I'm sorry, I was just taking a nap. Good luck with that antique. Don't kill yourself."

Well, that antique has survived almost 40 years and still works and I doubt it has killed anyone. If you can say that about a Apecks 40 years from now--well--we shall see. I suspect the DA will still be around, the Apecks will probably be contributing to a landfill.

N

Now, Nemrod, don't be harsh. One can hope instead that the Apeks will by that time be melted down and recast as a new double hose.

And I only have 3 steel 72s and 4 45s. I have no idea what "tank shortage" you are speaking of.

 

[Hammerhead]

Some fantastic advice here; Creed, Nemrod, Duckbill thanks a lot!

TS&M, bennedc - I'll take it under advisement

Right, where to start...

Be cognizant of your body position in the water, and you'll do fine. This is coming from a novice double hose diver

I'm more aware of this than I was having switched from BCD to BP/W less than a year ago, so I should be able to adapt with practise (I hope)

Why not join the vintage group in a few weeks at Wazee or Portage for some training from people who actually are experts at double hose diving.

Love to, where is that in Hong Kong?

The good news is that I'll be warm water diving, shallow with great viz and low currents. My Apeks regs will be with me for anything challenging.

I am not sure what a Halycon Pioneer is but I am thinking it is some sort of wing with a BP type system.....A BP using a STA is going to place the tank higher from your back than optimal

Yup, it's a BP/W, but without any STA. Twin cam straps through the BP & straight round the tank, so no fuss there.

So, anyways, I feel your pain, so will your credit card!

I'm not loaded, but not poor. My other hobbies (apart from beer) have all been pretty much abandoned and - believe it or not - my loving wife approves of my spending money on something I love this much. Basically I can afford what I want within reason, but no Gavin just yet...

in order to use a banjo you must have a long yoke form VDH or VSS or just steal one from an old Calypso or Conshelf

I have several of these just asking to be used for spares, got a piccy or a link of a suitable one? Cheers.

I recommend the octapus on a 40 inch hose with a swivel fitting on the regulator. I recommend you route it under your arm and use a slip bungee DIR style to hang it around your neck.

That's what I'd have envisaged, very close to my current diving set-up. good, good, getting there.

All of your questions are answered in another VERY recent thread here on "The Sea Hunt Era":
http://www.scubaboard.com/showthread.php?t=148067
Titled: Diving "Modern" with "Vintage" Reg

Um, yes, whoops!

that antique has survived almost 40 years and still works and I doubt it has killed anyone.

I should hope not, judging by parts, filters and looking for tell-tale scratches, I don't think it had ever been put on a tank until last weekend

Thanks again, all. I'll do my shopping for banjo and hookah adaptor this weekend...

 

[Mike Veitch]

Larry.. i am here to take the piss..

I can't believe i read that whole first post....

Well, we know if you can't take a pic worth a damn at least you will be able to write articles...

 

[Hammerhead]

I can't believe i read that whole first post....

Most of the people I know that you've met would have equal difficulty believing that

Well, we know if you can't take a pic worth a damn at least you will be able to write articles

Awww shucks. Thanks Mike!

(there might have been alcohol involved in the first draft, hence the flights of fancy...)

 

[justleesa]

One other thing, vintage is not about cheap, it is entirely possible to spend more money to put together a vintage outfit than a good modern rig. It is entirely possible to have more money into a RAM or the other super doublehoser, the Trieste II, than in a Legend or Apecks complete rig.

Now ain't that the truth


From aaaaaalllll the regs Roger has I enjoy diving the Triest...wearing a vintage suit, mask, depth gauge, HUGE knife and fins just finishes the whole deal off

 

[Walter]

Darlin', that is a beautiful photo.

 

[justleesa]

Thank you Walter :blush: My Sweet took it....

 

[Nemrod]

That BP/wing thing you talking of---they are not ideal for double hose. You can make them work quite well but you have to change things up. Most modern divers swim around with their tanks up behind their heads and the wing often has more lift towards the bottom which results in a head low position. I see it, it happens to me, look in pictures on this very site. This position in the water will result in POOR breathing with a double hose. Your head needs to come up and your rear down a few degrees. The BP and wing may fight you on this. Also, it is not uncommon for double hose divers to swim rolled slightly to one side. It become a habit that to them is not noticeable--they just do it from practice without thinking about it. What ever you work out the idea is to get the diaphram down so that it is as nearly in the same position vertically in the water column as the center of your lungs. If you swim through the water in a slightly head high position then you can begin to understand why having the tank close to your back and lower in the harness helps the breathing response. The ideal positioning is with the center of the can centered in the small of your back which is much lower than people wear their tanks now.

Since I do use a BP/wing I have run into several obstacles with them. I have mentioned how they tend to put you actually head down. OK, you may have to lengthen the shoulder straps to let the plate drop down so that the bottom edge is down on your hips. My Hammerhead has a rolled bottom corners. In fact, I am pretty sure you need to lengthen the straps. Next, with a double hose you may find, especially with a doubles set up that the can wants to hit the BP on it's bottom edge. You have two choices, live with it or cut a semi-circle in the plate. If you look back you will see that there were backplates in the 60s and some of them came with a semi circle upper edge to allow the can to nest in and down. I have not had to cut my plate but I do have it pushed WAY down. I mentioned drilling another hole for the top STA so that when the tank is pushed down the upper band does not fall off the tank shoulder--if you are not using an STA then it may be that you have to open the slot deeper. This you will have to figure out.

Also, again, lol, if that Halycon thing you have has the hose connection to the bag centered then it will interfere with the cans I betcha.

The ideal wing for double hose would have a larger upper area, would not be a circle but have the still common semi circle design, it would have the bag connection off center. Why not a circle, it causes your rear to float up and head down. You may be able to stop this or even cinch a strap or bungee to compress that area to reduce the lift there and keep it more forward.

As you can see, I have run into numerous problems with a BP that had to be accounted for to get good performance with a double hose regulator.

Oh yeah, you need an oval mask.

N

 

[Walter]

BP/W with a double hose? I'm not advocating it, but with a double hose, I don't use a BC at all.