Save me from myself (Too "safe"?)

[Jim Lapenta]

SMB - Prefer a DSMB that you can shoot from depth. In case you lose the down or anchor line. Provides a visual and tactile reference that is quite useful in low vis. My preferred one is the 36 inch HOG one I sell with a 100 ft spool or small reel. I actually sell these (SMB and Spool) in a package with a line cutter, wet notes or wrist slate .


Slate - Slate is useful but I do prefer wet notes. I have two. One for teaching and recreational dives and one for tech dives. They have checklists, pages of deco schedules or words and phrases I use often. With heavy gloves on hand signals can get fuzzy.

Spare mask/snorkel -Mask, yes. Snorkel no. Rarely even take a snorkel unless I'm practically sure I'll use it or required to for teaching a class.

Spare Air/Pony - Spare air? No, it's a bailout for pilots. Marketed as ok for scuba but I won't allow them in any class. Pony bottle? Yes if you are trained to sling it properly and to use it. My own belief is if you are carrying one it's your back up gas so each diver should have their own.

Spare light - If I carry one light I carry two. Usually in our conditions three. Primary and two back ups. At least one back up. Back ups do not have to be expensive. I do carry a 160.00 Morph back up with me in addition to my can lights (either a 12 watt LED or 21 watt HID), but I also have a 45.00 one that is in my pocket as well.

 

[uncfnp]

My take, your number one peice of safety equipment is you. You are on top of the Buddy skills, now work on your self reliant skills. And take rescue, your son too if he meets the requirement.

Next piece of safety gear, your basic kit. Inspect it often. Before, after and between dives. Learn simple maintaince and repairs.

After that and more to your question, I would add ...

A simple SMB, one that can be inflated at the surface. As your diving changes, then consider a larger DSMB with reel/spool.

A knife, I like the Eezecut.

Consider a whistle, no weight and essentially takes up no space. And a mirror.

I like to carry a light on all dives, mine has a strobe function.

Given your dive plans with a reliable buddy (your son) forget the spare mask, snorkel (I don't carry one at all) and the redundant gas. Reconsider the redundancy if you start diving without a reliable buddy or doing more advanced dives or hunting.

 

[freewillie]

I dive with my 14 y.o. daughter. Although I'm no an expert dive here is my $0.02. Safety gear I carry:

- SMB. I clip one to the back of my BC and hers. For all dives, especially boat but including shore dives.
- Neither of us carry either spare mask and neither of us dive with a snorkel. I lose more folding snorkels so ditched that too.
- I have a line cutter clipped to BC but no knife.
- Personally not a big believer in spare air or pony bottles. I think they foster false sense of security. We both check our gas often and frequently.
- We normally carry lights even on day dives but only carry spare/back ups on night dives. I do carry an inexpensive hiking signaling mirror in my BC pocket on boat dives. Cheap, no batteries required, and can be seen by miles during the day.
- Whistles are attached on shoulder of both of our BC's. Much louder and easier to hear than shouting.

 

[tbone1004]

fair enough regarding the pony bottle, have a weird skew due to the size of people in my family, so 14 for us was a very different experience, and an al30 is pretty small....

I do understand about H valves vs. doubles, though I will have to respectfully disagree on the AL6. AL13 is pretty much bare minimum for an 80ft dive, assuming you still take the precautionary stop, and ascent normally and taking into account the elevated SAC rate of 1.0, it takes 10+cf for a safe ascent, gets awfully close to the limit for 13cf. An al30 weighs less than 15lbs full with regulator, so it's a bit more than twice the weight of an AL13, but if they are diving as much of a team system as the OP claims, then it is fine for him to carry an AL30 or 40 for the both of them, and in a first stage failure for his son, at least he would have his own gas source. For recreational profiles, team bailout is perfectly fine, especially if the bottle is slung and can be passed off if need be.

Pony bottles are a very personal thing, and we all have our own preferences, I prefer true redundancy and prefer pony bottles to H valves, and doubles to either, even small doubles like LP45's or 50's which are only a few pounds heavier than a single AL80, offer more air, and are much more stable under water than singles. LP72's are my preferred recreational setup which are only about 70lbs full vs the LP50's or 45's at around 50ish lbs total. About the same weight as an AL80 and an AL30, but better overall imho. In this situation I would still recommend the dad carry an al30 either slung or mounted to his bottle and use that as share air contingency especially since the #1 reg failure is HP seat failure for the first stage, and #2 is someone doesn't pay attention to their gas supply, so the pony bottle gives them a lot more freedom for gas planning, safe ascent for two under stressful ascent from 80ft with 3 minute safety stop requires about 900psi, so having a pony bottle as either an AL19, or a 30/40 gives you a lot more freedom in that situation.

 

[Nemrod]

You seek safety by layering yourself with equipment, with the exception of the SMB, which you intuitively know (for your diving as described) add no appreciable benefit.

If in diving lava tubes you could encounter a situation where you are diving beyond your skill/training, then an extra flashlight is not the answer, not going there to begin with is the answer or getting the correct training and then employing the correct equipment for that diving type.

There is no guarantee of safety in this life, it can be a noble goal or a fools journey, your choice.

N

 

[Max Speed]

If further away from land than I think I can swim, or over 60 feet deep, or deco obligation, or overhead then I will carry the following stuff. If I am diving with my wife then we can split most of it between us.

3 regs, at least two tanks (one can be small depending on deco and plan)
Two masks
3 cutters
3 lights
2-4 reels (depends on plan)
2 smb with reels (above) already attached
2 computers (one can be in gauge mode)
Air / nitrox table with accelerated table
Two glow sticks or similar lights
Sea dye
Mirror
Horn
nautilus radio

If I'm in a shallow quarry: tank, reg, usually fins and a mask.

 

[rivers]

What I have every sea dive:
DSMB and spool x2
Primary light
back-up lights x2
Spare mask
wetnotes
knife and cutter

 

[Bigd2722]

What I carry on each dive:
13cf pony
Lanyard (tucked into pocket with quick release) that has a whistle, mirror, shears, and light
Nautilus Lifeline and green laser light on lanyard (tucked into other pocket with quick release)
Trilobite line cutter
Big ass knife
Air alert
DSMB
Pocket snorkel
Compass
I carry a spare mask on the trip, but not on the dive
The light on my lanyard is never used for anything but an emergency (never had to use it so far) If I need a light for the dive, it is a different light than my emergency light.

I put the lanyards in my integrated weight pockets so I can pull the release and get to the tools quickly and easily (I wear a weight belt for bouancy)
The snorkel is bungied to my back plate.
The big ass knife is strapped to my right leg (easy to reach with my left hand ok to reach with my right hand)
The line cutter is velcroed to my pocket (reasonably easy to reach with either hand)
MY pony is clipped to my plate (I don't pass off the tank)
My DMSB has a 30' line attached to a homemade reel and is clipped off to a d ring on my harness (hangs loosely and swings just a little bit, but never gets in the way)

I do most of my diving in Jupiter in currents. Occasionally, I will leave the compass on board because I don't plan to have to navigate (most dives are drift dives)
If I am out of country or plan several days of repetitive diving, I will use my spare computer. (This is not for safety, but to save dives if the primary computer goes belly up)

 

[Diver0001]

Where I am having problems
The more I dive and the more time I spend on SB, the more questions I have regarding safety equipment. I don't like to carry a lot of Sh!t that will just hang off me or look like a Scuba Christmas tree. But there is a reason for each piece of ADDITIONAL safety equipment. Most, if not all of our diving for the next few years will be in groups and probably 50% of those dives will be vacation dives with guides. So, could you all help me determine the benefits/drawbacks of carry any/all of the following. Which do you determine to be necessary vs. nice to have.

I'm going to say this from a certain point of view and to try to give you a handle to make these decisions yourself. Bit of context. I've been diving for 30 years. I'm an instructor and a technical diver and therefore no stranger to the risks and options when it comes to gear and safety. None of this is to brag, just to give you a context to understand who is writing this, since we don't know each other yet.

Principle #1 : Reduction

this is a principle that comes from technical diving. When you're already loaded down with gear the last thing you want to do is make your Christmas tree any worse. There is a long standing philosophy in technical areas to "take only what you *need*" with you. The guy who first put it to words was called "Bill Hogarth Main". Bill is an incredibly humble individual who (sadly) isn't very active on internet. He's a superstar in the diving community but still thinks of himself as "just another diver". Bill takes this idea to the extreme, even removing things like hose protectors and extraneous D-rings from his gear. His configuration is such a model of simplicity that many technical divers use it, including the DIR community, who use it as a baseline configuration. Not surprisingly, that configuration is called "Hogarthian".

This idea is something I apply on every dive. Bringing it back to the recreational context, let's talk about snorkels as an example. If I'm diving from a boat and I believe that there is a chance that I could need to spend an extended time on the surface, then I will have a snorkel with me, maybe in a pocket. If I'm making a dive in rough conditions with a lot of chop and swell on the surface, I may even attach it to my mask (although I prefer not to). If I'm diving in calm conditions close to shore, then it stays in the car. People who tell you that a snorkel is always/never needed aren't thinking it through.

The point being, to make a conscious choice about it and not to just do everything all the time. The everything/all the time philosophy will lead to you carrying a bunch of unnecessary bells and whistles on every dive. This is what you want to avoid.

Principle #2 redundancy :

This seems to be more the question you're asking. when do you need an extra X....?

My thinking is this. When you're in an "overhead" position your situation is very different from when you are in a situation where you have clear access to the surface. In some situations you will *need* to solve the problem under water. Other times, not so much.

For example. Locally our water is turbid and it's dark down there..... When I'm making a dive to depth and I'm likely to have a significant deco obligation (a virtual ceiling) then it would be a major PITA if my light crapped out and I needed to try making an ascent in darkness. Whenever I'm diving to a depth where I can't read my instruments without shining a light on them, I carry an extra light. In caves, divers generally carry 3. If you're diving in a context where you have enough ambient light to read instruments and you can surface without a ceiling then an extra light is a luxury, not a requirement.

Principle #3 contingency :

In a recreational context..... your buddy has your backup gas. If you think there is a significant risk of losing them AND a significant risk of something else happening that would complicate ending the dive then you might consider a stage/pony. If you think there is a chance of getting separated from a boat and you need visibility on the surface, then you should carry a light, DSMB, mirror or EPIRB. etc. etc.

point here remains... think it through.

Summary:

There are three main principles:

1) reduction
2) redundancy
3) contingency

R..

 

[diver 85]

I've got 3 basic rules(that I tell all non-divers when they ask---esp.--years ago when SCUBA wasn't as popular) that I follow........

--NEVER hold your breath..

--DON'T run out of air(check your gauge like you'd check your car fuel gauge)...

--DON'T come up too fast(they always liked the little bubble thingy I'd share with them)...

Now, as we all know, there are many others--BUT--in the heat of battle these along with a little common sense goes a long way, always have come home without a hospital --or morgue--visit in over 2k dives AND plan on doing the same over the next 2k+ dives....Was, though, more of a challenge back in the day when it was the 5 of us(myself, wife, & 3 children--all certified when they were 12 YO, ages when the last one was certified 12, 15, & 17)diving together...I'd basically put me in the middle with 2 on each side(as dive buddies with me being the '3rd wheel' of their pairings)& catch myself always looking left & right.......To this day, wife & 2 outta 3 of the kids still dive with the middle one becoming a DM & instructor @ age 19 with over 5k+ dives 'under his belt'(got 'out of the business' about 4 years ago & only does recreational diving now)....

KISS has/& always will be my motto........

EDIT:.........maybe a 4th one needs to be added(& can classify it as ??part of your 'standard gear'??)-----BLEAUX & GEAUX, remember it & never leave home without it......