Reg Config with single tank + Pony bottle

[Marcos]

I dive with a single steel 120 + a pony bottle. I just bought tanks and a new backplate/wing set up and I'm a little confused on how to config my reg with my pony bottle. Guys at my dive shop are saying to take my octo off my reg and put that on my pony bottle so I only have 2 second stages instead of 3. I'm also wondering where to put the pony reg, some put it on a necklace with the idea of donating their primary if their buddy runs out of air. Or should I just hang the pony reg as my alternate air source with a snorkel holder and if my buddy runs out of air give him that. What do you think?

 

[Doc Intrepid]

Do the words "Pandora's Box" mean anything to you?

Secondary second stage on bungee around your neck, off your backgas.

Bailout bottle like this:
http://www.diverite.com/resource/stage/index.htm

Standby for grief.

 

[Marcos]

Ok first off I have to admit I had to look up Pandora's Box on Google to catch your humor there.

After I followed your link I see your point as well. That site seemed to be geared towards tech divers with deco bottles. I am purely a recreational diver who uses a single tank with a pony bottle (air) as a reduntant air source. I'm a NJ wreck diver and most of the boats require pony bottles. I side mount the pony bottle onto the main tank with a super pony tamer (Reef Scuba). Last year I used to just add the pony bottle and pony reg to my existing single tank a reg with it's own octo. I was renting the tanks, pony, & pony reg then. This year I bought tanks, pony bottle, and pony reg. So now they're saying lose the octo from my primary reg and put it on my pony bottle, because having 3 second stages is overkill and not streamline. Now I also just bought a BP/Wing setup instead of my jacket style BC and I don't know where to put the pony second stage. It seems to be cluttered when on a D ring where I have lights, reels, goodie bags, etc. How did this get so complicated?

 

[Atticus]

I somewhat regularly end up carrying a stage bottle (pony bottle) in recreational gear. Usually its an aluminum 40.

I like to set it up as a traditional stage bottle. It has its own reg and pressure gauge (on a 6" HP hose). I then put two clips on the bottle and clip it to the left clavicle D ring and left hip D ring. This is the same way the DIR suggest if you want pictures...

I then bungee my "octo" from my main tank and use a long hose for my primary second stage.

Benefits of this setup include:
1. It's the standard way to do things these days (matches my tech setup)
2. I have two seconds on my main tank so that config doesn't change if I do/don't carry the stage.
3. The stage is a completely self contained unit, and the gear on my back is complete as well. If I need to I can hand off the stage to another diver and still have everything I need (I've done this).
4. The stage bottle can be left turned off until ready to be used. This prevents the infamous empty pony bottle dilema.

I suggest using some bungee/innertube/surgical tubing to hold the stage reg to the stage bottle. When you're ready to deploy it grab the second, pull it out, place it around the back of your head, and into your mouth. This will result in the reg being right side up

 

[Greg Barlow]

First of all, I went through the same basic process that you are going through. My path started around six years ago. I used the Pony Tamer, but was never quite enamored of the "not being able to access the cylinder" scenario. My suggestion is what I use when I am not diving doubles. Here goes: I use a SST BP/single tank adapter with a Dive Rite Venture 30lb. wing. I dive with a single reg using a 7' primary hose, and a 22" backup reg. If I am diving deep (over 70' or so) or in water that is colder than 60 degrees I use a 30ft. cylinder configured in a stage bottle position (just like the Dive Rite link, but a much smaller cylinder).

The stage bottle configuration when handled properly is very hydrodynamic. You can remove it within 10 seconds or less and pass it to another diver. You simply use restraining bands to hold the LP hose and regulator taut to the cylinder. Use a HP gauge on a 6" hose and bend it back to allow easy viewing. I'm serious...You don't even notice it is there after a few dives. If you decide later to make the trek to technical diving then you have already developed the skill that is so paramount to such dives. Plus, it costs less than $15 or so to configure it in this way.

You mentioned that you are a wreck diver....If you make penetration dives then you need to be trained in diving doubles. A pony cylinder should only be used as a bail-out system. It needs to provide enough gas to make a safe ascent from your maximum depth, and to make a 3-5 minute safety stop. For most divers, a 30ft bottle works quite well.

I would not remove the AAS from the primary reg, as I dive a Hogarthian configuration. I always donate my primay and go to the backup reg. If there is no backup reg then the pony becomes the only option. Remember, the backup reg is not for your buddy it is for YOU.

Greg Barlow
Former Science Editor for Rodale's Scuba Diving Magazine

 

[MechDiver]

It seems to be cluttered when on a D ring where I have lights, reels, goodie bags, etc. How did this get so complicated?

You have more issues than just the pony bottle, as your d-rings should not be cluttered.

That aside, Atticus and Greg gave you very good advice. Lets say you don't take our advice and you have two regs, one off your backgas, the other (your backup) off the pony. Divers comes up and rips the primary out of your mouth. No problem, you grab the backup, and then find out you forgot to turn on the pony that you can't reach.

Mounting a pony slung has nothing to do with tech, other than its the best way to use that type of tank. Leave both your regs in place on your backgas, and setup the pony like a deco bottle.

Also, as Greg said, this is not the setup to be doing wreck penetration with.

MD

 

[wmspdi]

I use a 19 or 30 ft3 pony for recreational diving. I don't make any changes to my main rig (SP Mk25 DIN, X650, S600 on a yellow hose for an octo, and a Cobra computer). I have a second rig with a SP MK20 DIN and S550 on a a 40" hose, and Mini VIP SPG for the pony. I clip the pony reg and SPG on the right side of my BCD about 8-10" below my AAS octo. I use an Ultimate Pony Bracket to mount the pony bottle on the right side of my 100 ft3 steel tank. I replaced the two metal bands used to mount the pony bottle to the bracket with a Seaquest BC/tank cam band strap, so I can reach back with my right hand and flip the lever to release the pony bottle in an emergency. By using a shortened cam band to mount the pony bottle to the bracket I can use the same bracket on any rental tank with any pony bottle, hand it off if needed, or ditch it if it snags on something. Works for me.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

In my experience, using a pony for deep/wreck diving starts an evolutioanary process that eventually ends in suitably configured doubles. Some well intentioned people are suggesting the staged pony configuration to save you the trouble of going through this process on your own. I don't agree though as I think there is a lot of learning and value in making that particular journey on your own rather than just doing it because someone said so. There is way too much of that already in diving today.

In my opinion and former experience with a pony, the octo on the primary reg creates unneeded clutter and the potential for confusion and needs to go.

You have some choice in how to route the pony second stage:

1) You can run it over your right shoulder and clip it off to a D-ring on the shoulder or to a D-ring on the waist strap (with a suitable lenght hose).

2) You can route it under the arm and clip it off like a regular octo.

3) You can mount it on a bungee necklace and use either a short or long hose for the primary.

Backmounting the tank is not popular with tech divers for reasons that have already been made obvious. But there really is nothing wrong with that approach for rec diving as long as great care is taken to ensure the pony valve is on and that the reg is functioning before every dive. You also need to be careful not to let those helpful dive boat crewmembers mess with your valves while you are on the way to the boarding ladder. A back mounted pony does allow a rec diver to remain with a familiar configuration and the pony is pretty much unnoticeable in the water.

There is some advantage in having an alternate second stage on the primary reg and this is where a Air 2 type of dual second stage/inflator really shines. It provides you with an alternate second stage in case a problem develops with the primary second stage and ensures your main air supply is still accesible. It also addresses the issue of what do you do when you get mugged for your primary second stage and discover that in fact the pony is "off".

This will of course ensure your configuration is even less acceptable to the tech crowd than before, but it does serve an effective purpose in a rec configuration by adding an alternate second that cannot be confused with the pony while eliminating the clutter of an extra hose so it is worth considering.

Again, most divers in your situation eventually discover that there is nothing a single tank and pony can do that a set of doubles cannot do a whole lot better and move in that direction. But in my opinion there is a lot of advantage to the diver coming to that conclusion on their own when they are ready to make the move.

My other suggestion is to focus more on what your buddies are doing and regard as acceptable than to worry about what someone on ScubaBoard thinks. You'll get a lot of opinions here, but they are not always the ones that count and are not a substitute for a good discussion with your buddies or with other experienced divers in your area.