what an incredable story. Im glad they edited the clip and removed the most distressing parts.
Raising the Dead.
- Thread starter PaulSmithTek
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I agree with the sticky post in this very forum, entitled "If I should die while diving". I'll have a copy of that with my papers.
When I was in high school we had driver safety films like "Blood on the highway!" and similar to impress on you the deadly consequences of mistakes. There was a reason for that. Sure it made me nauseous but it served a long-term good. Yes I watched the video, quite chilling. I also rode in a van once with a couple of cave-divers, one on them on an accident-investigation committee. 6 hours of stories about how people died will definitely heighten awareness and preparedness. I signed up for Rescue Diver and otherwise improved my skill level after that.
So I would argue against censorship or self-censorship. If I suffer some mishap and there is data (even video), I would expect it to be posted. If it makes the people who know me uncomfortable, or anyone else, well they shouldn't look at that information. Other people who never met me, sure go right ahead.
When I was in high school we had driver safety films like "Blood on the highway!" and similar to impress on you the deadly consequences of mistakes. There was a reason for that. Sure it made me nauseous but it served a long-term good. Yes I watched the video, quite chilling. I also rode in a van once with a couple of cave-divers, one on them on an accident-investigation committee. 6 hours of stories about how people died will definitely heighten awareness and preparedness. I signed up for Rescue Diver and otherwise improved my skill level after that.
So I would argue against censorship or self-censorship. If I suffer some mishap and there is data (even video), I would expect it to be posted. If it makes the people who know me uncomfortable, or anyone else, well they shouldn't look at that information. Other people who never met me, sure go right ahead.
my 02PSI...to quote ShoaldiverSA....
To quote Rob Davie (BigJetDriver) from one of the original threads discussing this tragedy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJetDriver
Folks,
This thread has deteriorated completely from its original intent and purview. Discussion of the pro's and con's of choosing to do such an incredibly deep and difficult dive should be left to those who have the experience in rebreathers to know what they are talking about.
Dave Shaw was a good man, a great rebreather diver, and a daring explorer. The dive world is a much poorer place without him, and without individuals such as he was.
...
Cheers,
Andrew
They said it best.
K
To quote Rob Davie (BigJetDriver) from one of the original threads discussing this tragedy:
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJetDriver
Folks,
This thread has deteriorated completely from its original intent and purview. Discussion of the pro's and con's of choosing to do such an incredibly deep and difficult dive should be left to those who have the experience in rebreathers to know what they are talking about.
Dave Shaw was a good man, a great rebreather diver, and a daring explorer. The dive world is a much poorer place without him, and without individuals such as he was.
...
Cheers,
Andrew
They said it best.
K
As much as I respect these folks for their knowledge/abilities using rebreather technology, I feel they missed the boat when it came to planning this recovery, for the simple fact that they ( likely ) didn't consult deepsea divers who regularly work at great depths to learn something of what it's like to perform work in such environments. If they had, perhaps they would have called it off, or at least changed the plan to a much simpler, quicker recovery. Thing is, while these depths are new territory for rebreathers, their old news for the commercial diving industry.
My advice to any others planning deep work is to talk to the pros who work there on a regular basis...
...it may be the best conversation you'll have.
Regards,
DSD
My advice to any others planning deep work is to talk to the pros who work there on a regular basis...
...it may be the best conversation you'll have.
Regards,
DSD
dk2943
Contributor
I read that story a few weeks ago, and I was horrified. Just watched the video and it sent shivers down my spine.
stepup
Contributor
I am not a very emotional person and that story made me want to cry. That was a very sad and tragic story. Wheather the plan he had or not had was right I am sure there was alot more planning that went into that dive than what was told in the magazine article. The people that are on here being dicks about what he did is completely useless to be done. You can say he did this and that but what does it matter. It will do nothing it is over and it doesn't matter what you think should have been done or could have been done it didn't help. But as for the story I feel like he was a very brave man and what he was doing was very courageous even if there were reasons other than the dive for the family. Just my 0.02
stepup:
On the outside chance that I might be one of the "Dicks" you refer to, know this: What matters is learning from tradgedy. If you're going to put your butt on the line, it makes sense to try & cover all the bases. The reason I don't think these folks consulted deep working professionals is the simple fact that they tried to do what they did the way they did it. No pro I know would have endorsed that plan. I don't think the team realized how difficult an undertaking it was to try & "bag a body" at that depth, with that technology. Ego is a powerful force. Sometimes it takes brunt reality explained by someone who's been there to make people step back & rethink a problem.
We don't need to know all the facts to discuss possible solutions that future risk-takers might benefit from. I doubt the chap that perished would mind. There is no disrespect in our intention.
DSD
DSD,
Your point is well taken! Learning is key; no one is diminishing the intent or spirit of what was being undertaken.
I personally learned a lot from this thread and feel very much for all those involved. Honest and respectful discussion should always be encouraged.
Arizona
Your point is well taken! Learning is key; no one is diminishing the intent or spirit of what was being undertaken.
I personally learned a lot from this thread and feel very much for all those involved. Honest and respectful discussion should always be encouraged.
Arizona
adza
Contributor
If talking about learning from a mistake, then the only thing I would have done different (now - in heinsight, but not knowing nearly as much about diving as Dave and his team), would have been to raise the body first - and let it go to the top of the cave. (As if I recall correctly, their was an overhead environment, and then they had to swim sideways, and up again before getting out)
This way - Dave, or someone else could work on putting the body into the bag at a much shallower depth, greatly redusing deco time (or maybe doing it during deco time), and then pass the body to the opening, on to the parents and media.
Would I have thought of that before I knew the outcome - hmm... probably not. Are their other problems with that scenario - possibly. I don't have all the facts, and can only work with what I have (which includes my limited experience)
On a personal note - I don't think Dave was stupid or careless. He (like most of us) - weighed up the risks involved, and then made a decision. We all take risks when diving (or other sports), and we all decide the level of risk we're going to take with our current experience and knowledge. What I consider a stupid risk may not be what someone else considers stupid. We all have the ability to make our own minds up. However, I do have a hard time with people who like to have digs at Dave for what he did.
So let's learn from Dave's (or any other divers) tragic mistake, while making constructive critisisms. As long as we don't resorting to any disrespect - I see no problems in challenging/discussing what Dave did, as long as we keep it respectful.
This way - Dave, or someone else could work on putting the body into the bag at a much shallower depth, greatly redusing deco time (or maybe doing it during deco time), and then pass the body to the opening, on to the parents and media.
Would I have thought of that before I knew the outcome - hmm... probably not. Are their other problems with that scenario - possibly. I don't have all the facts, and can only work with what I have (which includes my limited experience)
On a personal note - I don't think Dave was stupid or careless. He (like most of us) - weighed up the risks involved, and then made a decision. We all take risks when diving (or other sports), and we all decide the level of risk we're going to take with our current experience and knowledge. What I consider a stupid risk may not be what someone else considers stupid. We all have the ability to make our own minds up. However, I do have a hard time with people who like to have digs at Dave for what he did.
So let's learn from Dave's (or any other divers) tragic mistake, while making constructive critisisms. As long as we don't resorting to any disrespect - I see no problems in challenging/discussing what Dave did, as long as we keep it respectful.
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