Question for you Tech Divers

[lamont]

You are aware the main deck of the Saskatchewan sits at about 80-90ft. You sure you we're breathing nitrous oxide?

We hit 118 and 116 on those dives. We also were definitely narced at 80-90 when we dropped down on the deck. Me and my buddy both started okaying each other with our lights 'yes, i'm okay', 'yes, i'm okay', 'i'm okay dammit!', 'stop, dammit, i'm okay!', 'goddamit, quit asking me if i'm okay!', i'm okay already!', etc...

I was probably taking a bit of a CO2 hit from the excitement at the time (dive #60) or I've just built up the mythical "tolerance to narcosis" -- 118 on that dive definitely started making me "comfortably numb", while I've been to 120 on EAN more recently and its just made me a little dumber than usual...

 

[wdunne311]

So here is another question for you tech divers. You guys ever do Monastery with all that equipment? Seems like doubles, your 2 deco tanks (or however many you guys carry), and all that other (forgive the term) "crap" you guys take might make it difficult to get up and down that beach, unless you're superman. Just curious. Or for that matter, where do most tech divers around Monterey dive?

 

[wedivebc]

We hit 118 and 116 on those dives. We also were definitely narced at 80-90 when we dropped down on the deck. Me and my buddy both started okaying each other with our lights 'yes, i'm okay', 'yes, i'm okay', 'i'm okay dammit!', 'stop, dammit, i'm okay!', 'goddamit, quit asking me if i'm okay!', i'm okay already!', etc...
...

That is too funny

I was probably taking a bit of a CO2 hit from the excitement at the time (dive #60) or I've just built up the mythical "tolerance to narcosis" -- 118 on that dive definitely started making me "comfortably numb", while I've been to 120 on EAN more recently and its just made me a little dumber than usual...

That is a very interesting observation. I also believe that so-called narcosis tolerance is a result of better breathing techniques which reduce CO2 retention.

 

[TSandM]

That is a very interesting observation. I also believe that so-called narcosis tolerance is a result of better breathing techniques which reduce CO2 retention.

Interesting idea. I've noted that the depths/sites where I had horrible narcosis problems early on don't seem to bother me much at all any more, although I'm quite apprehensive when I approach them, watching for the onset of symptoms. It can't be habituation, because I do those depths very seldom.

 

[lamont]

Interesting idea. I've noted that the depths/sites where I had horrible narcosis problems early on don't seem to bother me much at all any more, although I'm quite apprehensive when I approach them, watching for the onset of symptoms. It can't be habituation, because I do those depths very seldom.

Yeah, you just need to dive them more often. The I-beams used to freak me out. Then I got used to the I-beams, but Olive's Den would freak me out (all of about 10 fsw deeper, but creepier for some reason), then I got comfortable enough that all that was good, but I did get creeped out the first time I went on the north line and got out of my comfort zone and went into deco a bit. Now I've been in the worst viz you could imagine at 100-120 fsw scooter along out there and as long as the team is managing to stick together I'm all good...

Its just conditioning. You go to 100 fsw the first time and take a bit of a CO2 hit and get a dark narc and get a little scared and then you stay a little scared on future dives. And its so situationally dependent that I can get used to dives to the I-beams while being a little creeped out by Olive's den. After awhile your comfort zone expands and the anxiety goes away... I've also learned to tell the first signs of CO2 affecting me (typically when I start edging towards skip-breathing while scootering), so I can usually notice that I'm starting to daydream about weird stuff and adjust my breathing patterns to have a larger tidal volume before I ever experience CO2-driven anxiety...

Oh yeah, I got creeped out the first time we swam from the I-beams to the Monolith... I just kept saying to myself in my head "trust the gas plan, trust the gas plan, trust the gas plan..." That is the dive that also sold me on scootering... 20 minutes swimming across endless mud and silt to find the monolith -- 5 minutes across mud by scooter...

 

[Adobo]

So here is another question for you tech divers. You guys ever do Monastery with all that equipment? Seems like doubles, your 2 deco tanks (or however many you guys carry), and all that other (forgive the term) "crap" you guys take might make it difficult to get up and down that beach, unless you're superman. Just curious. Or for that matter, where do most tech divers around Monterey dive?

re: Carrying gear at Monastery or any other beach dive
You don't have to carry all that gear into the water at the same time. Most of the times, people set up a float and bring stage/deco bottles and scooters in and clip them off to the float. Then they get out and gear up with doubles. So essentially, the most gear you have to carry is your doubles rig on your back.

re: where to tech dive in MoCal
What do you consider a tech dive?
Doubles - A pretty sizable portion of the DIR community dive doubles almost exclusively in Monterey and Carmel.
Scooters - Some guys will almost refuse to get into the water without a scooter (even in the bunny hill sites like the breakwater).
Stage bottles - Some people dive with stage bottles even at the breakwater. It just depends on how much bottom time you are trying to get.
Deep diving - lots of sites accessible by boat. For beach dives, North Monastery and many sites at Pt. Lobos get deep quick. Gas choice is up to each person. Certainly, there are people diving sites that are >100ft using trimix.
Deco obligation - Isn't every dive a deco dive?

 

[TSandM]

From personal experience, hauling doubles up the beach at Monastery IS difficult, and following the DIR principles of "if you need it, take two" you require at least TWO buddies who are capable of picking you up in the surf . . .

 

[Adobo]

From personal experience, hauling doubles up the beach at Monastery IS difficult, and following the DIR principles of "if you need it, take two" you require at least TWO buddies who are capable of picking you up in the surf . . .

Really good point.... A lot of beach dives in Monterey have sufficient amount of people who could help in an emergency. However, a few of the sites in Carmel like Monastery and CRB have very few people. Learning to be picky about when to dive these sites is absolutely crucial.

 

[SDAnderson]

Yes but I notice you didn't define the line your self.

Welcome to the thread. If you start from the beginning, you'll find this.​

The point people are trying to make is that the curve up to tech diving is a gradual slope for many and not a sharp delineation.

Slippery, too, it would seem.​

So in that respect it is just it is just diving in that one has to answer the question, Do I have the skills, knowledge, equipment and experience to plan and execute this dive?"

Kumbaya, my Lord, kumbayah. Though what any of this has to do with defining technical diving, I don't know.​

This question all have to be answered for a 30' reef dive, a dive to 120' or a dive to 300'.

What's the frequency, Kenneth?​

[/QUOTE]

 

[Adobo]

Welcome to the thread. If you start from the beginning, you'll find this.​

This link points to the beginning of the thread. So are you saying that if KMD starts from the beginning of the thread, he will find.. the beginning of the thread?

Perhaps you are referring to the post that has this tidbit?

The best quick definition I've heard defines technical diving as involving an overhead environment, either real (caves, wrecks, ice, etc.) or virtual (decompression.) It tends to be very gear intensive but there are a lot of fusterclucks out there staggering around under the load of all the gear that's dripping off them that will never qualify as technical divers. Personally, I think tec should involve unified team protocols (DIR/Hog) but a dive to 300 feet is still a tec dive, even if you do it in a bathing suit on air.

The real overhead stuff is not pertinent as they are almost non-existent in MoCal. The deco part is the one that is relevant for this discussion, I believe. Which goes back to, isn't every dive a deco dive?