Question AOW

[Alvin Slovinsky]

Now why would I try something that we both know I would fail?... and probably horribly... I only use the term merit badge because I feel like the internet could teach me everything I ever wanted to know about the fishes. I don't personally do well in a class setting and I like to figure things out on my own.

Obviously I'm just razzing you about the merit badges I get it. You're 100% correct, I don't know my fish... we were talking about DS's and AOW, both of which I don't think you need a cert. for. If someone could choose between 20 dives out of OW @ a benign dive site or AOW I think just about everyone would feel better hitting dive #20 then they would dive #5 in AOW. That's been my experience.

Just my 2 cents, I am by no means an expert on anything!! And my experience is for sure not the only way or even right for everyone.



Your classes have always sounded top notch,... but that's not the norm. We see it on SB all the time. AOW was merely 5 more measly dives with an instructor. I don't know of anyone I've met (which is somewhat limited) that got anything out of AOW. You (among others) are the exception, not the norm.

I enjoy diving and want to improve my knowledge and skills and insure that I go over what’s required before diving and I read as much information as possible to be aware of things that can happen and how to insure when we dive my dive buddy and I are safe. I believe in reading over course material just too insure it’s fresh in my mind as well. I also believe the more you practice something the better you get at it that’s what the training courses are for but some of them are common sense .

 

[rob.mwpropane]

@rob.mwpropane

You think the drysuit cert is worthless? Try renting a drysuit without it. Won’t happen.

No, not worthless... maybe inessential is a better word. There was a time when divers didn't have a class for every little thing that we do... right? How did people learn? I'm sure this rubs some the wrong way... not really my intention. I think we're all entitled to our opinions. Dive and let dive and all that.

Look I'm sure anyone who ever took the class learned something... did they really need it? I guess it's up to the individual. I'm just sharing my experience. It wasn't worth it to take AOW, but I didn't know what I didn't know until after I took it. I remember leaving the quarry thinking "what the hell did I just pay for?".

 

[Alvin Slovinsky]

I totally disagree. DS is a good start in a pool, but needs depth and associated buoyancy-control issues you can't do in a pool. AOW must have Deep and Navigation, neither of which you even begin with in a pool. Not to mention Fish ID!

I appreciate your response to this question but you can only learn so much from a course book it’s the time in the water when your practicing these skills whether it’s in a 20 foot pool or at 40-60 feet in a lake it’s still time in the water doing it. The difference is in a Drysuit you have another buoyancy device besides your BCD and possibly more weight especially neoprene suits.

 

[Marie13]

No, not worthless... maybe inessential is a better word. There was a time when divers didn't have a class for every little thing that we do... right? How did people learn? I'm sure this rubs some the wrong way... not really my intention. I think we're all entitled to our opinions. Dive and let dive and all that.

Look I'm sure anyone who ever took the class learned something... did they really need it? I guess it's up to the individual. I'm just sharing my experience. It wasn't worth it to take AOW, but I didn't know what I didn't know until after I took it. I remember leaving the quarry thinking "what the hell did I just pay for?".

You must have had really crappy instructors. That was not my experience, plus I didn’t do the sampler platter AOW. My Advanced was four specialties done over four months.

 

[Alvin Slovinsky]

No, not worthless... maybe inessential is a better word. There was a time when divers didn't have a class for every little thing that we do... right? How did people learn? I'm sure this rubs some the wrong way... not really my intention. I think we're all entitled to our opinions. Dive and let dive and all that.

Look I'm sure anyone who ever took the class learned something... did they really need it? I guess it's up to the individual. I'm just sharing my experience. It wasn't worth it to take AOW, but I didn't know what I didn't know until after I took it. I remember leaving the quarry thinking "what the hell did I just pay for?".

I appreciate your input on this question I want to better myself as a diver and be more knowledgeable if my instructor can tech me skills I haven’t learned yet it’s money well spent. I believe you never stop learning in life it’s a choice we make

 

[tursiops]

I appreciate your response to this question but you can only learn so much from a course book it’s the time in the water when your practicing these skills whether it’s in a 20 foot pool or at 40-60 feet in a lake it’s still time in the water doing it. The difference is in a Drysuit you have another buoyancy device besides your BCD and possibly more weight especially neoprene suits.

Time-in-the-water needs to be in the kind of water that the course is about, otherwise you are just wet, not practicing the critical skills. I was not suggesting you could learn these things from a book; I was stating -- strongly -- that a pool does not replace depth (thus narcosis and breathing rate and gas consumption and Boyle's Law) , or topography (thus Search and Recovery or Navigation), or low visibility, or animal/plant life. Adjusting the buoyancy of your BCE+DS at 13 ft in a pool isquite different than doing it at 60 ft in open water, for example.

 

[rob.mwpropane]

You must have had really crappy instructors. That was not my experience, plus I didn’t do the sampler platter AOW. My Advanced was four specialties done over four months.

YES! WE finally agree on something!!

It was an abysmal sample platter.. to me it was the definition of a money grab.

 

[Alvin Slovinsky]

I do understand that and will be talking to my instructor before my dive if he/ she can offer any advice or assistance before the dive I do appreciate you taking the time responding to the question I appreciate everyone’s input on this question.

 

[Alvin Slovinsky]

You must have had really crappy instructors. That was not my experience, plus I didn’t do the sampler platter AOW. My Advanced was four specialties done over four months.

I appreciate you responding to my question thank you for taking the time.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

After my open water course (where I was firmly cratered on the bottom with 36 lbs of lead), I picked up a dry suit and just started diving with it. However, I was diving with a friend who was an instructor. After diving and teaching for a number of years, I realized what I had missed. I have picked up helpful tips from other instructors to help students develop a feel for their trim depending on the amount of gas put in their wing/bcd versus their dry suit. In the pool, I recommend having students get neutrally buoyant and "transfer" gas from their BCD to their dry suit and vice versa (obviously this means adding to one and dumping from the other) and have them pay attention to if they become head/foot heavy and how easy/hard it is to stay horizontal. This is one tip I received from @custureri who has a DIR background. I never heard from any WRSTC agencies who do this who didn't have at least some DIR training. So there is more than "just take the class." There are differences in performance requirements in different agencies that you may wish to consider.

As always, proper weighting is paramount: just enough to keep you at your safety stop with an empty wing/bcd and a dry suit as empty to remain comfortable with a nearly empty cylinder, and no more.

The road to diving comfortably with a dry suit is hampered if the dry suit doesn't fit well. I can't emphasize this enough. I taught through a shop that consistently gave my students poorly fitted dry suits, and their ability to overcome that obstacle was seriously impaired. Once they got a properly fitting dry suit, it was magic.

I really don't see the point of PADI's AOW course or other agencies' Adventure Diver, unless you just want the card for dive charters that require it. It is better to get AOW certification by taking full courses, and when you complete the five (PADI) or whatever number another agency requires, you will be better off. Just find instructors who will challenge you beyond minimum standards (without violating standards of course).

I say this as someone who would have done training dramatically different with what I know now. Everyone knows which course I'd take after open water, so I won't say it to avoid the collective groan and request that I shut up with it!