Question about buying from "non-authorized" re-sellers
- Thread starter emmagee
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Damselfish
Contributor
oh, don't worry. Been stirred many times before and will be again. Doesn't take much.emmagee:
Damselfish:
Damselfish: Yep, this thread will be back again very soon. As many already know the stores who sell via e-commerce are buying direct from most companies. Some just like to try and deceive the poor LDS folks with the "They are not authorized dealers" line. Maybe they are "not authorized" but they sure are buying a lot of gear. Most of it direct.
paulwall
Contributor
dannobee:
While I do agree that the policies enforced by certain companies (MRP,High Minimum Inventory/Order Qty, display restrictions) are detrimental to the market, it is the Dealers who have to step up to the plate and say "No More". Obviously, some dealers have, and others see some benefit to continuing this relationship.
By the way Minimum Advertised Pricing is not as onerous as Minimum Retail Pricing. The former says "Thou shalt not Advertise a price below this", the latter says "Thou shalt not sell for below this, lest you be smitten". The former allows the dealer to do some private negotiating (See divesports.com and his DiveRite disclaimer).
halocline
Contributor
Getting back to the original post, I gotta say you should really consider not retiring your MK10/D300 unless there's something really wrong with it; instead, contact DA aquamaster on this forum about getting it rebuilt and the D300 upgraded to D400 specs. When it's done you'll have one of the true classic regs of all time. If you do decide to get a new one, please PM me as I'd be interested in your old reg.
mattboy:
Well, I am basically taking your advice, and decided this before reading your response.
I still want a good backup reg setup and this D300 will be perfect for that. With that said, I just bought D400 and have already PM'ed DA Aquamaster about tuning both of these. The only decision left to make is what 1st stage to mate the D400 with. I'm leaning pretty hard toward a MK25, but may just go with another MK10.
bandit_TX
Contributor
I have never seen a reg I couldn't get service on, unless the parts have gone obsolete. Buy from LP, buy off of Ebay, buy from buddy, buy where ever you get a good deal. When they actually NEED service in 3-4 years, pay the $40-$60 for the kits. That's far less than the annual shaft you'll get to stay in warantee and get free parts.
Darryl Bowerman
Contributor
Did not want to get into this discussion but can't help myself.....
First and foremost regarding a retailer like Scuba Toys selling product they no longer represent. When Scuba Toys bought the product they were a warrantied Scubapro dealership. Any Scubapro products purchased from them should be fully warrantied by Scubapro.
I have been a manufacturers rep in this industry for 20 plus years. Currently I represent both Oceanic and AERIS in TX, LA and NM. The reality is that both MSRP and MAP pricing is in place to support the retailers not prop up pricing for the manufacturer. The reality of where a e-tailer like LP gets product is from domestic retailers choosing to roll there dice on keeping there respective dealerships by trans-shipping product to a non-warrantied reseller. Personally (and strictly my opinion) I believe that the "getting it from Europe" stansa is a cop-out. It comes from here and allows certain manufacturers to protect the big retailers who are buying and shipping to folks like LP.
OK here goes.......I've read this a hundred times myself but.......LP and e-tailers like them are strictly in business for there own selfish reasons. What do they do to support instruction? Do they teach new divers? Provide dive travel? Do they even have technicians capable of working on product at their facility on the brands they represent? Do they even fill tanks? I cannot count the number of times that customers have had problems from product sold by certain retailers which they cannot support. Yes, a savings in the short term is realized but in the long run and over time the loss in warranty and overall loss of support to the LDS is hurting this industry and has a long term effect on us all.
I will not beat this dead horse to hard but the reality of manufacturers having MAP/MARP pricing is to support the LDS. They have much greater overhead than someone just getting boxes in and shipping them out. Won't go further because if you have been following SB for years this is an old and long term discussion.
Ok, off my high horse. Reality is I am just a guy who works in this business for the love of diving......Ok, ready for the beatings.....
Darryl Bowerman
Oceanic/AERIS Regional Manager
First and foremost regarding a retailer like Scuba Toys selling product they no longer represent. When Scuba Toys bought the product they were a warrantied Scubapro dealership. Any Scubapro products purchased from them should be fully warrantied by Scubapro.
I have been a manufacturers rep in this industry for 20 plus years. Currently I represent both Oceanic and AERIS in TX, LA and NM. The reality is that both MSRP and MAP pricing is in place to support the retailers not prop up pricing for the manufacturer. The reality of where a e-tailer like LP gets product is from domestic retailers choosing to roll there dice on keeping there respective dealerships by trans-shipping product to a non-warrantied reseller. Personally (and strictly my opinion) I believe that the "getting it from Europe" stansa is a cop-out. It comes from here and allows certain manufacturers to protect the big retailers who are buying and shipping to folks like LP.
OK here goes.......I've read this a hundred times myself but.......LP and e-tailers like them are strictly in business for there own selfish reasons. What do they do to support instruction? Do they teach new divers? Provide dive travel? Do they even have technicians capable of working on product at their facility on the brands they represent? Do they even fill tanks? I cannot count the number of times that customers have had problems from product sold by certain retailers which they cannot support. Yes, a savings in the short term is realized but in the long run and over time the loss in warranty and overall loss of support to the LDS is hurting this industry and has a long term effect on us all.
I will not beat this dead horse to hard but the reality of manufacturers having MAP/MARP pricing is to support the LDS. They have much greater overhead than someone just getting boxes in and shipping them out. Won't go further because if you have been following SB for years this is an old and long term discussion.
Ok, off my high horse. Reality is I am just a guy who works in this business for the love of diving......Ok, ready for the beatings.....
Darryl Bowerman
Oceanic/AERIS Regional Manager
Actually...believe it or not...LP have a Master Instructor on staff. I met him and he is a pretty good guy. He works at the NYC store.
Now, I had no idea that Oceanic and the other manufacturers had only altruistic motives. Gee for a moment, I thought that they (like LP) were there to make money. Heck I KNOW that the LDS's are ONLY there to help divers and not make money either. That's why they need manufacturers to stop them from selling at such low prices to help us divers.
Logic abounds in the argument above. (LOL!) Just like the sorry miserable excuses from the manufacturers for price control.
Now, I had no idea that Oceanic and the other manufacturers had only altruistic motives. Gee for a moment, I thought that they (like LP) were there to make money. Heck I KNOW that the LDS's are ONLY there to help divers and not make money either. That's why they need manufacturers to stop them from selling at such low prices to help us divers.
Logic abounds in the argument above. (LOL!) Just like the sorry miserable excuses from the manufacturers for price control.
PerroneFord
Contributor
Darryl Bowerman:OK here goes.......I've read this a hundred times myself but.......LP and e-tailers like them are strictly in business for there own selfish reasons. What do they do to support instruction? Do they teach new divers? Provide dive travel? Do they even have technicians capable of working on product at their facility on the brands they represent? Do they even fill tanks? I cannot count the number of times that customers have had problems from product sold by certain retailers which they cannot support. Yes, a savings in the short term is realized but in the long run and over time the loss in warranty and overall loss of support to the LDS is hurting this industry and has a long term effect on us all. Ok, ready for the beatings.....
Darryl Bowerman
Oceanic/AERIS Regional Manager
Thank you for your comments.
I dont want further flog the horse but do want to say this:
I simply cannot understand why people in positions such as yourself cannot understand that many of us simply don't CARE what folks like LP do outside of selling products. I don't care if they handle travel, I don't care if they teach Scuba. I really don't even care if they provide service. What I care is that they offer a product at a price I want, and have it in stock. I would rather use people local, or people I trust for my servicing of product. I can manage travel on my own, and I live in Florida, I won't be taking Scuba lessons in NYC.
When I order a radio from Crutchfield, or tires from TiresOnline or wherever, I just want the product I ordered in a timely fashion. I don't need them to install my radio, or mount my tires.
If my LDS wants my business, they need to sell me the same product at a competitive price. However, some manufacturers REFUSE to allow them to do so. THAT is what is hurting them. Not me, or other consumers trying to find good prices on dive gear.
As I've stated on this subject before, I have purchased 90% or more of my gear locally. I prefer shopping that way. But I don't purchase brands that tie the hands of the LDS. I encourage shops to drop manufacturers that refuse to allow them to be comptitive. I don't need those products, and neither do other divers. It's a dangerous game of brinksmanship the big boys are playing.
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