Quarry Rangers! Divemasters?

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

Frankly, I'd rather dive with someone who learned in cold, murky fresh water pit than with someone who did all their work in warm water with 100' vis all the time. While they may not be the best when it comes to currents, their other skills will be sharp.
 
Guba:
To which I replied, "Let me get this straight. Where I typically dive, I'm doing good to see my fin tips. I have on every stitch of neoprene because the water is 65 degrees below the thermocline at 12 feet, and I have to juggle a big light at noon because it's DARK. Here in the Gulf, the water is 85 degrees and I'm in a lightweight shorty, vis is 150 feet, and I can see my partner so well I can read his thoughts by looking at his eyes. WHAT STRESSES ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?"

:rofl3: :rofl3:
 
A few months ago I was on a dive boat in Cayman and i was talking to the "Divemaster" he told me he was from Canada and had just arrived to do his "Divemaster internship" and he had all of 21 dives when he arrived.On one dive there were only 7 people on the boat 4 of us were instructors with one newly certified diver and him and his Girl friend who was the same "level". It boggles my mind that someone with so little experience can be in a DM intern program.I do not know exactly what that internship consists of and didn't want to know.Just thought it was not such a great situation for anyone having to rely on them in an emergency.
 
EastEndDiver:
A few months ago I was on a dive boat in Cayman and i was talking to the "Divemaster" he told me he was from Canada and had just arrived to do his "Divemaster internship" and he had all of 21 dives when he arrived.On one dive there were only 7 people on the boat 4 of us were instructors with one newly certified diver and him and his Girl friend who was the same "level". It boggles my mind that someone with so little experience can be in a DM intern program.I do not know exactly what that internship consists of and didn't want to know.Just thought it was not such a great situation for anyone having to rely on them in an emergency.

Well you have to start somewhere and I guess this guy was on the first day of his internship.

Internships generally (in my experience) are where you get a candidate the experience of doing the job, by doing the job under supervision.

There is a big difference between doing a divemaster course and being a divemaster for real.
 
Last year, most of my diving was fresh water, and in that water, I taught myself how to be a competent, qualified diver. All the fundamentals of weighting, trim, and buoyancy are universal (even if subject to slight differences in magnitude). Other aspects -- visibility, temperature,... drysuit management -- have been significantly more complicated in the freshwater sites.

This year, however, I've been spending significantly more time out in the Gulf on saltwater trips. The skills I've honed in fresh water have made the saltwater trips quite relaxing and enjoyable. The worst visibility we've had in the Gulf has been about what I'd consider a rather good day in many lakes. (So much so, in fact, that I was surprised when I was hanging out at the shop and heard the owner tell someone that the visibility was absolutely horrible. :biggrin:) I've even had the honor of being complimented on my diving by our instructors (one who cave dives even said I had great form).

Still, while my freshwater skills apply just as much to saltwater diving, I have also noted interesting differences. In most fresh water, usually there's either a significant current (such as river diving) or basically no current. In some of the salt water areas we dive, on the other hand, subtle currents are often present. You don't really notice them unless you're paying attention, but they can complicate your dive, and when they're highly depth-variant they can really bring it sometimes. (A DM in saltwater needs to be more adept at reading the water.)

Another subtlety might be the problem of great visibility. When a diver can only see 20 feet or so, they're not likely to be far from their buddy, but when they can see 100 feet or more, they tend to stray. In lower vis, when they can't see their buddy, they know something's off, but in great vis, they may be too far from each other to be able to be of any help in an emergency, but since they can see each other so well, they never notice. (A DM in great vis has to be an external influence to keep the divers together, as the water doesn't do that by itself.)

And of course, there's the whole *boat* thing. The time I've spent out on dive boats has certainly helped me acclimate myself to the process of diving from real boats. Half of that is getting used to reading ladders and handling all your gear, but the other half for a DM is getting used to reading divers on a boat. It's just a whole different world when you compare boat diving (especially larger mass-diving boats) to shore diving -- everything becomes compressed on boats, as you're limited in space and things tend to all happen at once.

Anyway, for diving skills, I highly recommend quarries and lakes. They're great experience builders, and they'll certainly test *most* of your skills. A DM who has only been in quarries and lakes can easily have exceptional diving skills in form, navigation, and so on, but he will still be a new diver when he gets in the big tub. Acclimating to new diving conditions is like playing new musical instruments -- the first is hardest, and the more you add, the easier the next becomes. If you've been diving in a dozen quarries, lakes, and rivers, adding a new set of conditions that happens to have salt in the water shouldn't be *that* difficult (although I'm certainly not blockheaded enough to think it'd be a good idea for me to jump in off New Jersey or over at Monastery without learning the local knowledge).

(To quote NAUI's web page summary of DM requirements, "Dives shall be varied in environment, depth and activities." If you're only going to work as a DM in freshwater lakes and quarries, you can be perfectly adequate for that without having saltwater experience, but whatever additional experience you gain will only help make you a more valuable DM for those around you.)
 
I was on a dive trip this year with a DMC who got her 50th dive while on the trip. I'm not sure if she had ever dived in saltwater before.

I was also on a dive trip this year with a DMC who could only get 30 minutes out of an 80cf tank -- on dives where I was deeper than him and was returning to the boat after 1:00 - 1:15 with 1000+ psi left.

PADI requires 60 dives by the time you complete the DM program. You don't have to complete any specialties. You earn OW, AOW, Rescue -- then you're qualified to begin the DM program. You gain A LOT of knowledge while in the program. It's up to the DMC to gain experience and the DM's instructor to make sure the DMC has earned the DM certification.
 
diverbob:
Its also much safer than a DM from the tropics trying to convert to a DM in the quarries.

Guba:
To which I replied, "Let me get this straight. Where I typically dive, I'm doing good to see my fin tips. I have on every stitch of neoprene because the water is 65 degrees below the thermocline at 12 feet, and I have to juggle a big light at noon because it's DARK. Here in the Gulf, the water is 85 degrees and I'm in a lightweight shorty, vis is 150 feet, and I can see my partner so well I can read his thoughts by looking at his eyes. WHAT STRESSES ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?".


I beg to differ.
Tropical ocean diving is not always the colorful great visibility and warm. It consists of great variety of dive, you need more samples before you can judge the characteristics.

- Temperature can reach up to 60 degrees in certain area, for example, Bali.
70-75 degrees is quite common.

- Visibility can range from excellent to elbow length. Diving in 'mud' is not a myth, especially during rainy season.

- Currents can be very very serious factor. Encounter down current that can send you to 40 meter from 5-10 meter, it's not everyday you can see bubble blowing down. Up current is as dangerous, can bring you up and risk the life. Washing Machine and Toilet Flush are types of very respected current you don't want to be at. On the good side, there are 'Superman' current that carry you to joyride.

- Numerous poisonous marine lifes.

- Aggressive predators.

- Boats with their propellers above your head on high diving traffics.

- My latest addition : dynamite fisherman.


I just want to say as divers we have to respect every medium of water. They have their own advantages and disadvantages. Being a quarry diver doesn't mean you have more than ocean diver and vice versa, there are all the environments that human are not created to live in.

I agree that DM should have enough experience in the type of water they are required to do their job. And experience doesn't mean few dives or been there done that. It's a wide range of varieties, wide range of different experiences and wide range of scenarios.
 
I think you have to consider what these divematers will do as divemasters. A diver who lives inland and becomes a DM will most likely end up assisting with classes at their local shop. They'll be helping out in the pool and on OW days at the local quarry. If they get really involved they may get the chance to help ou during some specialty courses or something on a trip someplace. Most of those trips are likely to be the anual type trips that so many shops take...a Feb trip with an OW class to Vortex with maybe a graduation dive on the Gulf.

I've not only known divemasters who had never dived outside of a quarry, I've known instructors who have only dived in quarries. It isn't at all uncommon. I'd even say that the inland divers who are most likely to become a DM or instructor are the divers who really like diving and dive training but who, for whatever reason, don't do much traveling.

It's good to have some ocean experience because lots of students are on their way to Cozumel but good solid local (quarry) experience is what these divers need in order to be able to assist during local courses.

AND...some people just like diving fresh water. It tastes better and the fish look like fish. LOL
 
I understand everything you are saying and do not disagree at all...hence my disclaimer at the end of my previous post. However, we were diving the Flower Gardens, and the program directors knew what we were headed for, more or less. And Cozumel diving didn't really do that much to prepare me for "stresses". The lake dives came much closer in helping me cope with anything remotely resembling something that could cause tension. While lake dives cannot prepare one for all the hazards in tropical seas, it can cause divers to hone valuable skills that will enable him/her to cope with situations that might be found there. The rest has to come with continued education, training, and experience.
 
I agree with my lake divers...I know that there are major concerns with ocean diving...but anytime I had to deal with a fear while underwater it was in a quarry...overweighted, low vis, silt billowing up around you at 80 ft, cold water...and some have been at altitude. When I dive saltwater, I feel more comfortable. I agree with an earlier post...20 ft vis in saltwater...that is good vis to me!!!!
 

Back
Top Bottom