leah:
You are definitely my quote of the week! I LOVE THIS!
Purchasing own equipment online/lds?
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You are definitely my quote of the week! I LOVE THIS!
What's more expensive? 2-3 people on the floor for 10 hrs a day (20-30 hrs of paid labor) or having the same 2-3 answering phones and packing in non-overlapping schedules?leah:
It comes down to insurance. A warehouse with no costumers coming gets to pay a lot less. Also, rent for industrial locations is cheaper than retail space.leah:
Good point. Retail stores do not incur this expense... at least nowhere near close to what online stores pay.leah:
leah:
A storerage warehouse has to pay a lot less in terms of heating. You do not need to keep the whole thing warm for costumers. Electricity? Doesn't need to be on during all operation hours. usually restricted to a time frame when stuff is getting stocked or shipped.
leah:
Your argument would get a better response if you presented it in a more reasonable andless combative manner. As far as online vs. LDS it comes down to much cheaper rent, much cheaper insurance, quite a bit cheaper labor (compared to an LDS that does the same volume of business or course... it's not fair to say scuba.com pays more labor yet still comes up ahead. places like that can only afford so much labor because they do THAT much business). You know what? That's the competitive advantage of an online store. Great for them! It's good to see them putting that advantage to good use. The fact remains... an online store is cheaper to run than an LDS of comparable transaction volume - no fairies needed.
shoupart
Contributor
Given these rules, it makes me wonder why most LDS carry so much gear and equipment for sale, especially when they can't beat most online prices.
Earlier in the thread, somebody pointed out that most LDS's make their money on training and servicing equipment. They also mentioned that LDS's don't really make money on equipment sales.
Which raises the question- would an LDS be in a better place financially if it concentrated less selling BCs and regs and other things that are usually going to be obtained for less elsewhere? Perhaps they could instead use their capital to focus their real efforts on mostly training, travel, airfills, servicing gear, airfills, etc?
I'd suggest they carry less of bigger items like BC's, regs, computers, and concentrate on smaller or more personal things- equipment like masks, fins, possibly wetsuits, and various dive accessories like clips, retractors, etc; you know, the little things that I diver is going to need to complement his basic gear.
So the way I see it, why spend money on major inventory that you're going to have to mark down in order just to compete with other stores?
If dive shops were to focus on more customer services and less on tangible expensive products, they will have such an advantage over online stores any day because they'll be selling something completely different than what an online store sells.
Earlier in the thread, somebody pointed out that most LDS's make their money on training and servicing equipment. They also mentioned that LDS's don't really make money on equipment sales.
Which raises the question- would an LDS be in a better place financially if it concentrated less selling BCs and regs and other things that are usually going to be obtained for less elsewhere? Perhaps they could instead use their capital to focus their real efforts on mostly training, travel, airfills, servicing gear, airfills, etc?
I'd suggest they carry less of bigger items like BC's, regs, computers, and concentrate on smaller or more personal things- equipment like masks, fins, possibly wetsuits, and various dive accessories like clips, retractors, etc; you know, the little things that I diver is going to need to complement his basic gear.
So the way I see it, why spend money on major inventory that you're going to have to mark down in order just to compete with other stores?
If dive shops were to focus on more customer services and less on tangible expensive products, they will have such an advantage over online stores any day because they'll be selling something completely different than what an online store sells.
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shoupart:Given these rules, it makes me wonder why most LDS carry so much gear and equipment for sale, especially when they can't beat most online prices.
Earlier in the thread, somebody pointed out that most LDS's make their money on training and servicing equipment. They also mentioned that LDS's don't really make money on equipment sales.
Which raises the question- would an LDS be in a better place financially if it concentrated less selling BCs and regs and other things that are usually going to be obtained for less elsewhere? Perhaps they could instead use their capital to focus their real efforts on mostly training, travel, airfills, servicing gear, airfills, etc?
I'd suggest they carry less of bigger items like BC's, regs, computers, and concentrate on smaller or more personal things- equipment like masks, fins, possibly wetsuits, and various dive accessories like clips, retractors, etc; you know, the little things that I diver is going to need to complement his basic gear.
So the way I see it, why spend money on major inventory that you're going to have to mark down in order just to compete with other stores?
.......Then when people cant get the help they want from the online store and want it at there LDS they cant get it......Sorry thats not gonna happen and I promise you if your LDS did that you would be mad when you went in there and couldnt get what you wanted........
shoupart
Contributor
No, my point is that my version of an LDS wouldn't be to sell gear. Go let that customer go to some other store to buy it and they can make the tiny profit. My model store would instead be geared for everything else that a diver needs.
Here's what I don't get: say you as a store order a $200 BC on wholesale prices. Some online place is selling the same for $300, and with your overhead, you're selling it for $500. Say you REALLY need to sell it for $350 minimum to have any profit when you factor in all your overhead. Why are you going to go alllll that trouble to make a thin profit? If you're not really making money on equipment sales, why not just let some other local shop struggle with that while you concentrate on a completely different niche?
Here's what I don't get: say you as a store order a $200 BC on wholesale prices. Some online place is selling the same for $300, and with your overhead, you're selling it for $500. Say you REALLY need to sell it for $350 minimum to have any profit when you factor in all your overhead. Why are you going to go alllll that trouble to make a thin profit? If you're not really making money on equipment sales, why not just let some other local shop struggle with that while you concentrate on a completely different niche?
MichaelBaranows
Contributor
After reading threads like this I don't see why anyone would want to own a dive shop. Since it seems like no one want service and would rather buy stuff online w/o warrenty and have to pay shipping cost to send stuff back if it is the wrong size.
I know I pay a little more at my LDS but mine stands behind what they sale. My dad had a computer good down a day before a trip and our LDS gave him a computer do use why his was getting repair. I don't think a online store is going to be able to send you a computer to use for a trip in the next day and until your computer is returned to you after repair.
There has been more than one time my shop said open late so I could get tanks filled for trip the next day.
Maybe I am just lucky having a good LDS.
I know I pay a little more at my LDS but mine stands behind what they sale. My dad had a computer good down a day before a trip and our LDS gave him a computer do use why his was getting repair. I don't think a online store is going to be able to send you a computer to use for a trip in the next day and until your computer is returned to you after repair.
There has been more than one time my shop said open late so I could get tanks filled for trip the next day.
Maybe I am just lucky having a good LDS.
shoupart
Contributor
Hey Mike,
Since you're in the know more than me about the financial details, I'm curious if you can clear something up.
In what areas does your shop make the most money? What's your most profitable section- is it training, selling gear, etc?
If this is too confidential, I totally understand if you don't want to disclose it.
Since you're in the know more than me about the financial details, I'm curious if you can clear something up.
In what areas does your shop make the most money? What's your most profitable section- is it training, selling gear, etc?
If this is too confidential, I totally understand if you don't want to disclose it.
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Its all Profitable Sorry I started to answer your question but dont feel I can comfortably explain it...........
Sorry I started to answer your question but dont feel I can comfortably explain it...........
shoupart
Contributor
So what's your model- do you guys concentrate on any specific areas? Do you feel there's any threat or problems with the online store competition?
One thing to keep in mind when purchasing online is where does it really come from?
Case in point: I often purchase gear online - for recreational stuff I lean towards LeisurePro and have had nothing but good experiences with that company. However, fairly recently I purchased a pair of Zeagle ZX/ Flathead-VI regs from them and was unhappy with the behavior of one of them - (there was a distinct 'pause' during inhale before full gas delivery) and returned it for another. Then I discovered that the breathing resistance was much higher than I thought it should be on the other original and brought the pair in to my LDS, with whom I have a good relationship with and know that they are excellent with gear repair. The shop's owner asked if I had purchased them used as the inside of the first stage on one of them was all scratched up, a cover plate was bent, as was the finger on the valve of the primary 2nd stage. And he couldn't get the breathing resistance down on one of the pair. (I ended up having to replace the 2nd stage spring on that reg). Definitely didn't sound like those regs were new, though LP stated otherwise.
Finally, after all that, the HP seat on one of the 1st stages recently blew as I was setting them up for twins. After some research, I discovered there had been a recall by Zeagle on this reg for defective HP seats (they are replaceable, which was a selling point) - but the S/Ns on my regs were higher than the recall range. Anyway - I had my LDS replace both HP seats because I didn't relish the thought of one of those suckers blowing on a deco dive...
I guess to sum it up - buyer beware when you purchase online. I think LP is a straight-up outfit, and I will buy from them again, but never regs.
John
Case in point: I often purchase gear online - for recreational stuff I lean towards LeisurePro and have had nothing but good experiences with that company. However, fairly recently I purchased a pair of Zeagle ZX/ Flathead-VI regs from them and was unhappy with the behavior of one of them - (there was a distinct 'pause' during inhale before full gas delivery) and returned it for another. Then I discovered that the breathing resistance was much higher than I thought it should be on the other original and brought the pair in to my LDS, with whom I have a good relationship with and know that they are excellent with gear repair. The shop's owner asked if I had purchased them used as the inside of the first stage on one of them was all scratched up, a cover plate was bent, as was the finger on the valve of the primary 2nd stage. And he couldn't get the breathing resistance down on one of the pair. (I ended up having to replace the 2nd stage spring on that reg). Definitely didn't sound like those regs were new, though LP stated otherwise.
Finally, after all that, the HP seat on one of the 1st stages recently blew as I was setting them up for twins. After some research, I discovered there had been a recall by Zeagle on this reg for defective HP seats (they are replaceable, which was a selling point) - but the S/Ns on my regs were higher than the recall range. Anyway - I had my LDS replace both HP seats because I didn't relish the thought of one of those suckers blowing on a deco dive...
I guess to sum it up - buyer beware when you purchase online. I think LP is a straight-up outfit, and I will buy from them again, but never regs.
John
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