Purchasing own equipment online/lds?

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I'm happier when my dollars are in my own pocket. I have a family to feed myself.

And even online dealers are people, too.

If LDS are going out of business right and left then apparently they are failing to adapt. The sob stories and scare tactics have not been working and will not ever work. When you're getting your clock cleaned by the competition, maybe it's time to learn a lesson from them rather than trying to teach them a lesson.

Listening to the typical arguments from the LDS shills only make me more appreciative of my online shopping experiences.
 
I dont see why the LDSs dont go online...its not like they cant....If you look at the prices of an Authorized Online dealer, like scubatoys, and look at my online prices, they are the same.....you go to my store...and again they are the same. Your only really saving alot of money, depending on the shop and if they are out of hand with MSRP, if you go with an Unauthorized dealer. Like others have said though, why give them your money if they are not good to you. So to the shops that complain about the online, its useless......if you can get the same thing at the same price either online or at your lds(that you like) which would you guys buy from?? From responses so far I think its obvious....LDS.......so if the other stores would just stop trying to get MSRP from all their customers and be realistic, as well as being a fun customer oriented shop, they will retain their customers and prosper
 
Dive Right In Scuba:
I dont see why the LDSs dont go online...its not like they cant....If you look at the prices of an Authorized Online dealer, like scubatoys, and look at my online prices, they are the same.....you go to my store...and again they are the same. Your only really saving alot of money, depending on the shop and if they are out of hand with MSRP, if you go with an Unauthorized dealer. Like others have said though, why give them your money if they are not good to you. So to the shops that complain about the online, its useless......if you can get the same thing at the same price either online or at your lds(that you like) which would you guys buy from?? From responses so far I think its obvious....LDS.......so if the other stores would just stop trying to get MSRP from all their customers and be realistic, as well as being a fun customer oriented shop, they will retain their customers and prosper

Mike,

Amen. Amen. And, Amen.

I think you hit on the head what all of us have been asking for. As long as my LDS is realistic about their pricing and keep it in line with what others are selling it for online, they will continue to have me as a customer. I will happily pay sales tax in exchange for the conveniences of being able to walk out of the LDS with my new toys in my hot little hands. Heck, I really see sales tax and shipping costs to pretty much be a wash anyway, so that never really enters my decision making process anyway. What does enter the process is when my LDS is charging me 25% above what I can get it from an authorized retailer online.
 
I understand and that is rediculous....I dont see why they want full retail....just being greedy.....so swanny....just move to Illinois and I will take care of you....and give you free access to my pool(which hasnt even started being built yet) :D but will be done in a few months
 
Swan1172:
Mike,

Amen. Amen. And, Amen.

I think you hit on the head what all of us have been asking for. As long as my LDS is realistic about their pricing and keep it in line with what others are selling it for online, they will continue to have me as a customer. I will happily pay sales tax in exchange for the conveniences of being able to walk out of the LDS with my new toys in my hot little hands. Heck, I really see sales tax and shipping costs to pretty much be a wash anyway, so that never really enters my decision making process anyway. What does enter the process is when my LDS is charging me 25% above what I can get it from an authorized retailer online.
Ditto!! I've seen in some shops sell items for 40% more than I saw it online from an authorized dealer, it's ridiculous, why should I continue to support such business practices, I wouldn't do it when buying anything else from groceries to a car, why should my scuba purchases be any different. I also consider sales tax and shipping a wash, so as long as it's close, I'd be happy to support my local economy. I'd love to walk away with a purchase in my hot little hand that day, that is one of the advantages to me at least that an LDS has over an online shop, wish they'd realize it. Another thing that bugs when is when they say they can "special" order it! Well so can I buddy, probably cheaper and I'll probably receive it faster and not have to drive my *** all the way back down here to pick it up :D Tell you what I'll save you the phone call...

-Garrett
 
Not to mention the dive shops that charge 40% more and don't even have it in stock ...
 
LittleBug:
There are MANY reasons to support your local dive shop:

1. You can't get air online. If you don't support your shop in other ways, they won't be around to fill your tanks.


Here where I live most lds does not give air at all because they want to sell their day trips.


2. If something goes wrong with the equipment, and it has to go back to the manufacturer for repairs, THEY will run interference with the manufacturer. That's their job. They will negotiate for you, and do all that needs to be done so the equipment either gets repaired or replaced. Less hassle for you.


Thats true!


3. If they are a good shop they've researched the gear they carry, and can tell you a great deal about it's benefits and disadvantages.


One of the LDS once told me: "Don't buy that reg. we have so many comming back with problems" Thats an very value information


4. Running the shop is their job. It's how they feed their family. Support your local economy, and help a local business person stay in business. Don't send your dollars out of state. It's the same idea as corporations outsourcing jobs overseas. Sure it's cheaper, but it doesn't help the American public. Sure it's cheaper to buy online, but you aren't helping your local businesses by sending your dollars elsewhere.


thats not only for Americans thats also for Europeans: The LDS owner and staff buy localy new cars, the car shop drink better wine, the wine farmer get enough money to start scuba........
If we produce and do everything in China, we soon don't have the money to buy a regulator.

abcdef
 
The shops around here seem to push through a pretty low volume in merchandise. I realize they're running on razor thin profit margins, but I'd forego my equipment sales profits and compete with the internet prices, and focus on selling my trips, training, more training, customer service, repeat business, etc.

And even though I have an auqalung legend and love it, I'd avoid carrying that line simply becuase with their minimum pricing I wouldn't be able to compete with the grey market.

I'd also sell something else to make up for scuba in the slow seasons.
 
Dive Right In Scuba:
.......so if the other stores would just stop trying to get MSRP from all their customers and be realistic, as well as being a fun customer oriented shop, they will retain their customers and prosper

I think thats the key to this business model that they are using. They don't really expect to retain customers. The assumtion is that most will drop out of diving anyway so they try to make the most from the new recruits. None of the shops around here try to compete with the internet at all and they seem to be doing ok.
 
As those of us who have been around here for a while know, this argument comes up over and over, with seemingly no solution in sight. But the solution is CURRENTLY in the process of being implemented.

We did a recent survey of search engine results for this Christmas season v last season. The number of brick and mortar store that now have online stores has risen by a factor of about 13 or 14. Many brick and mortar stores are starting to expand their market through internet sales. This is the REAL beginning of solving the problem.......no opening an internet store, but EXPANDING their market through whatever means is availalbe. However, we must never forget that we are in a basically free economy and a free economy has some basic rules by which it must operate. I am going to offer a few of them, applicable to both merchants and consumers.

1. There is no logical argument for being "loyal" to any particular merchant, regardless of what they sell. The concept of loyality is primarily an emotional concept, not an economic or intellectual one. Loyality to an enterprise that is doing the wrong things, being uncompetitive, and refusing to adapt to the times is damaging to both the consumer and the merchant.

2. The fact that some local scuba stores (and grocery stores, and pharmacies, and office supply stores, and hardware stores, and etc, etc) close due to an inability to succeed in the market is a good thing, not a bad thing, when viewed in the aggregate. Now, I realize that the closing of a single store is traumatic to the individuals involved, but on the whole, the general concept is good. As the weak and uncompetitive are moved aside, they are replaced by stronger, more knowledgable merchants.

3. Despite attempts at "customer control", such as is exercised by the major scuba manufacturers and their co-conspirators (the small local scuba stores) is a mistake on so many fronts, I don't know where to start. We have to learn that CUSTOMERS decide how the market will work and how goods will be delivered. It doesn't matter what PADI, SSI, Mares, Aqua Lung, Oceanic of anyone else thinks. The consumer will determine the method of delivery of the goods and services of the future. I am a 55 year old baby boomer. My parents had little choice on cost, quality, and delivery of the goods they needed. They were forced to accept what was offered locally, good or bad. In my generation, we have an increasing number of choices....we can buy locally, we can order from catalogs, we can order online. But the REAL change is coming from my childrens generation. This is the first, TRUE internet generation. These are the kids that the local scuba store will make their living on for the upcoming 15 or 20 years. These kids, when given a choice between the store next door and the internet, will likely choose the internet. Hell, the telephone companies are frantically trying to figure a replacement for the yellow page, because this new generation would prefer to use the internet. In the years to come, phone books will be a thing of the past. Movie DVD's will be a thing of the past. I can even forsee the time when music record producers produce the latest hit albums by the latest stars, and never product a sindle music CD! Their target consumers prefer to pay and download. Given these facts, why in the WORLD would ANYONE in the scuba industry continue to resist the internet?

4. This new internet generation has access to MUCH more product information than could ever be delivered in the past. It no longer matters what a manufacture says about his product. Buyers will get their information from a variety of less partisan sources.....this website is such an example. Armed with their personal research on price, features, and product to product comparisons, the local scuba store (or any merchant) will be forced to be competitive on all arenas......cost, product quality, and availability. They must adapt. Remember, the CUSTOMER will get to decide how a product is delivered.

5. The fear tactics that have held the scuba industry together for oh so many years are no longer working. When a brand new diver comes to this board, the influence of a local scuba store is evident....they spout all of the fear terms we have become associated with from the "old style" scuba store.....where will you get you air? who will maintain your equipment? how will you dive if I am forced out of business? These tactics must stop. If there is a local demand for air fills, some smart merchant will fill the void. If repairs on equipment of needed and profitable, someone will be there to do those repairs. But hardest of all, when the local scuba store is gone (after all, this is the threat) serious scuba divers will continue to dive.

Anyway, just my ramblings as a free-trader. Thanks.

Phil Ellis
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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