Developing new specialties.

[Belzelbub]

I think you are probably luckier in Florida when it comes to common sense. IDK, it seems like when the lionfish thing first hit all the rules to get them were effective immediately. They had derbies, restaurants could serve them, etc. Here it would have been 10 years of study and then a bunch of red tape to make anything happen…at a glacial pace.

Yeah, that's probably true. They did react pretty quickly, and set up an organization to get the word out and start encouraging divers to harvest. Currently no fishing license is required if harvesting lion fish with certain gear. No bag limit or size limit, and they even allow harvesting from MPAs in some sanctioned events.

Also, it doesn't hurt that they are really tasty. While restaurants can serve them, they still seem to be fairly rare on the menu.

I know at least some urchin are edible, but I've heard mixed reviews on how they taste, so getting them on the menu may be a more difficult task.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

Yeah, that's probably true. They did react pretty quickly, and set up an organization to get the word out and start encouraging divers to harvest. Currently no fishing license is required if harvesting lion fish with certain gear. No bag limit or size limit, and they even allow harvesting from MPAs in some sanctioned events.

Also, it doesn't hurt that they are really tasty. While restaurants can serve them, they still seem to be fairly rare on the menu.

I know at least some urchin are edible, but I've heard mixed reviews on how they taste, so getting them on the menu may be a more difficult task.

I guess the other thing is lionfish are invasive where purple urchins are native. The problem is purps are out of balance right now with no predators and their populations have exploded.
We have to be the predators to replace the giant sunflower stars that used to go around and eat them.
Uni (urchin roe) is actually a pretty popular food in asian restaurants and sushi bars. We have a pretty large asian community in the Bay Area along with Pacific Islanders which are also big fans and to them uni a delicacy. Uni is considered a superfood, it’s loaded with all sorts of vitamins minerals anti oxidants ani cancer fighting compounds a lot of high quality protein, etc.
The nutrition breakdown is pretty impressive.
It’s an acquired taste, which I have acquired. I like it and consume it regularly.
Normally it’s the larger red urchins that would be the market urchins. When then reds are healthy they are huge and the roe packs are big and plump. So the effort to yield ratio is better.
Purples to me and many others actually have the best flavor but they are smaller, so it takes more of them to get the same amount if roe as the reds. There are several sea food suppliers that have adopted purples into their product line. One commercial diver harvests purples carefully by hand then sells them to a place that fattens them up in tanks then they sell them retail and to restaurants. Getting commercial permits to do anything with urchins is very difficult, that needs to change.

 

[Belzelbub]

It’s an acquired taste, which I have acquired. I like it and consume it regularly.
Normally it’s the larger red urchins that would be the market urchins. When then reds are healthy they are huge and the roe packs are big and plump. So the effort to yield ratio is better.
Purples to me and many others actually have the best flavor but they are smaller, so it takes more of them to get the same amount if roe as the reds.

That's kind of what I thought. I've never had it, but wouldn't be opposed to trying it. My comments were from talking with someone recently who considered it awful. I guess that's the acquired part of it.

There are several sea food suppliers that have adopted purples into their product line. One commercial diver harvests purples carefully by hand then sells them to a place that fattens them up in tanks then they sell them retail and to restaurants. Getting commercial permits to do anything with urchins is very difficult, that needs to change.

Yeah, that seems to be one of the approaches that FL is taking with the invasives, but it will still take some time. There are a handful of restaurants that are serving lionfish, iguana, and tegu, but it's still far from widespread. If there is a market for them, the harvesters will follow.

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

That's kind of what I thought. I've never had it, but wouldn't be opposed to trying it. My comments were from talking with someone recently who considered it awful. I guess that's the acquired part of it.

Yeah, that seems to be one of the approaches that FL is taking with the invasives, but it will still take some time. There are a handful of restaurants that are serving lionfish, iguana, and tegu, but it's still far from widespread. If there is a market for them, the harvesters will follow.

Urchins will take on the flavor of whatever they’ve been eating. If they eat sardines they will taste like sardines. The best tasting ones graze on sweet sea lettuces and different kelps. There were some reds harvested years ago that we heard about that were taken near a private campground that had a sewage outflow problem and guess what they smelled like when they were cracked open? Pretty gross! They have since rectified the sewage problem.
Some urchins which have resorted to grinding away at rocks to burrow a hole to go zombie have a bitter flavor and are gritty. When they starve the roe is brown and bitter, horrible! Or they have no roe at all.
Roe should be full with bright yellow to a golden orange color, no brown. Good roe is sweet with no bitterness and shouldn’t have a funky flavor, it should be sweet and taste like clean ocean water. It can almost resemble sweet creamy avocado infused with the sea.

 

[JohnN]

Urchins will take on the flavor of whatever they’ve been eating. If they eat sardines they will taste like sardines. The best tasting ones graze on sweet sea lettuces and different kelps. There were some reds harvested years ago that we heard about that were taken near a private campground that had a sewage outflow problem and guess what they smelled like when they were cracked open? Pretty gross! They have since rectified the sewage problem.
Some urchins which have resorted to grinding away at rocks to burrow a hole to ho zombie and have a bitter flavor and are gritty. When they starve the roe is brown and bitter, horrible! Or they have no roe.
Roe should be full with bright yellow to a golden orange color, no brown. Good roe is sweet with no bitterness and shouldn’t have a funky flavor, it should be sweet and taste like clean ocean water. It can almost resemble sweet creamy avocado infused with the sea.
View attachment 858099

Yes please

 

[happy-diver]

Doesn't look so appetising on a 65" monitor, yuck!

Fifteen yrs ago ScubaBoard was on a 12" B&W CRT

 

[johndiver999]

I think Eric should be commended for his efforts! I wish him good luck in his endeavor.

The tasks you describe sound relatively simple, assuming the diver can handle the environment and the gear and the cold water and the shore break etc. What sounds somewhat tricky to me, would be the use of the lift bags or smb's to handle the heavy bags. I would think that PADI would be looking very hard at that aspect of the certification, since it has the potential for someone getting tangled and hurt. Also I would assume they would want very specific information about diver buoyancy control and how they should (or shouldn't) use their BC while working.

I would think that preparing several videos on how exactly to accomplish all the tasks would be extremely beneficial in that it would help formalize the instructional content, give people a good idea of what they are getting into and they might be very useful on a stand alone basis, should certification not be required in all settings.

If you do get a course developed? Are you prepared to REQUIRE certification for participation in the collection efforts?

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

I think Eric should be commended for his efforts! I wish him good luck in his endeavor.

The tasks you describe sound relatively simple, assuming the diver can handle the environment and the gear and the cold water and the shore break etc. What sounds somewhat tricky to me, would be the use of the lift bags or smb's to handle the heavy bags. I would think that PADI would be looking very hard at that aspect of the certification, since it has the potential for someone getting tangled and hurt. Also I would assume they would want very specific information about diver buoyancy control and how they should (or shouldn't) use their BC while working.

I would think that preparing several videos on how exactly to accomplish all the tasks would be extremely beneficial in that it would help formalize the instructional content, give people a good idea of what they are getting into and they might be very useful on a stand alone basis, should certification not be required in all settings.

If you do get a course developed? Are you prepared to REQUIRE certification for participation in the collection efforts?

I don’t know about a ‘hard’ requirement, but it would be strongly urged for those that are new to diving (and to our area) and new to urchin removal just to insure that they are not a complete train wreck underwater. We/I have no idea who some of these people are or their skill level or local experience. It wouldn’t necessarily be a requirement for those already participating and who have it figured out.
I would have a class and pool portion one day, and two open ocean collection dives the second day.
The pool portion would be use of lift bags and lifting stuff up from the deep end which is about the same depth we are working at. There’s a pattern that needs to be followed and I’d like them to be somewhat fluent at it before hitting the ocean. The only thing I can’t simulate in the pool is the cold and the surge. That’s also why I’d like them to have a few local dives in so they know what to expect. The ocean training dives would help with that while under the supervision of the instructor.
And yes there are rules using lift bags. A person can get hurt if they don’t know what they’re doing.

 

[Belzelbub]

I don’t know about a ‘hard’ requirement, but it would be strongly urged for those that are new to diving (and to our area) and new to urchin removal just to insure that they are not a complete train wreck underwater.

Good point. I was thinking about this a bit.

You don't want to turn away potential capable volunteers, but you want to make sure they are able to do the removal safely. A certification requirement could do just that. A lot of people may want to help, but they could see this as a barrier. Perhaps the certification is more of an "Or" type requirement. Not the only path.

I used to volunteer at an aquarium. In order to be added to the team as a volunteer diver, there were some prerequisites that needed to take place. For starters, we had to all be First Aid and CPR certified. Then, once that was confirmed, they would schedule an initial checkout. The checkout would include a swim portion and a dive portion. This allows them to schedule a group of potential volunteers in a controlled environment without just simply turning them loose.

Perhaps that may be an option. Have volunteers sign-up (maybe use something online like Signup Genius). If they have done the dives before (successfully), then they can sign-up. If they are new, then they could supply proof of the Purple Urchin Removal cert OR signup for a checkout dive done when there are enough to make it worthwhile to schedule a checkout. You mentioned that these dives were often done in conjunction with some of the LDS dives, so this may be a route that can ensure that the divers are capable of doing the work without turning too many divers away due to a cert barrier.

 

[Boarderguy]

Everyone seems to be going high and right on this imo. I wouldn't do this if a cert was required, simply put. I think having a card available as kind of a "look what we do" is neat while also providing good optics for the situation. If someone wants to come out and help, great! If someone wants the cert before doing it so they're better prepared, great! If someone wants the cert after having done this so they can add to their collection, great!

I do cleanup dives in my area a few times a year. My first one I was given a "Dive Against Debris Diver" cert for having participated in that event. I thought it was neat. I wasn't expecting anything. I wouldn't have participated had this been a requirement.