Promoting diving beyond divers skill levels

[spectrum]

All above have some good ideas. No one yet has addressed the real issue of the veteran giving bad advice. Any talk to the newbies only helps them and not the next set of victims.

I too hate confrontation, but opening a dialogue with the veteran need not be confrontational. It will have a better chance if the discussion is nonjudgmental but allows all the participants/observers to think things through. An example: Enter the conversation with a question, "The flight deck sure is interesting, but it's a bit deep for recreational divers. How do you deal with the decompression issues and the smallish amount of gas with only an AL80?" or "Sharing a .... is fine as long as everything is going right. I'm curious how you handle a problem without ... if a buddy separation occurs." "I tried that when I was a new diver and had xyz problems, how do you prevent/deal with them?

This approach lets everyone think about the issues without putting anyone, including the veteran, on the defensive.

You have a future in politics!

I agree with the need to have the veteran revisit the decision.

Equally important is to get the new diver to "think like a diver". This is a phenomenon I experieinced as I was getting started in diving and as a scubaboard junkie. You begin to look at situations with more of a risk assesement attitude and think in terms of concequences, liklihood and mitigations. I then found that same mentality spilling over into the rest of my life.

Pete

 

[raftingtigger]

You have a future in politics!

NO, NO, and NOOOOOO!!!! I hate politics.

I really like the "get the new diver to think like a diver" thought.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I would hand them a copy of Jennifer's story and ask them to read it ...

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/content/460-don-t-worry-will-ok.html

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[TMHeimer]

All above have some good ideas. No one yet has addressed the real issue of the veteran giving bad advice. Any talk to the newbies only helps them and not the next set of victims.

I too hate confrontation, but opening a dialogue with the veteran need not be confrontational. It will have a better chance if the discussion is nonjudgmental but allows all the participants/observers to think things through. An example: Enter the conversation with a question, "The flight deck sure is interesting, but it's a bit deep for recreational divers. How do you deal with the decompression issues and the smallish amount of gas with only an AL80?" or "Sharing a .... is fine as long as everything is going right. I'm curious how you handle a problem without ... if a buddy separation occurs." "I tried that when I was a new diver and had xyz problems, how do you prevent/deal with them?

This approach lets everyone think about the issues without putting anyone, including the veteran, on the defensive.

Good post. Yeah, I did think about what happens the next time the veteran gives other divers advice. Maybe you're right in tactfully bringing up points with all present. Not really sure. There can be situations throughout life with many activities other than scuba where you can overhear bad advice that could be harmful. Maybe as DMs it's our duty to do something if you hear this regarding diving. With many other things, I may take the view that "If that guy is stupid enough to do that, well..."

 

[boulderjohn]

The OP mentioned someone giving bad advice related specifically to planning to dive the Oriskany. I have only planned to dive the Oriskany on 4 occasions (actually getting to Pensacola for three of those occasions), but based on those experiences I would not do anything. Since the trip is going to be canceled because of high seas anyway, it doesn't matter what was planned.

 

[Max Speed]

AFAIK- The commercial dive boats operating on the Oriskany have standards requiring a certain number of dives and deep experience. If you meet the minimum standards you still get a guide without greater experience and certifications. Problem solved. You don't need to worry!

Regarding the warm water- I would feel obligated to present each diver with pamphlets about the dangers of brain eating amoebae. Otherwise I just couldn't sleep at night...:shocked2:

---------- Post Merged at 05:41 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 05:39 PM ----------

Since the trip is going to be canceled because of high seas anyway, it doesn't matter what was planned.

ROFL

 

[TMHeimer]

I can't recall ever overhearing bad advice as described by the OP. When I was just pushing 50 dives I was unsuccessfully seeking a buddy to do a 55' shore dive. An instructor with whom I had taken 5 courses, said "Do it solo. You know what you're doing. And you just bought a pony bottle". Granted, he had a good idea of my abilities even though my dive count was low. So I asked another instructor from the shop what she thought: "I go solo to 100' all the time. The only time I have a pony is when I collect lost ones from the bottom". Perhaps bad advice from two very well respected instructors in the area? I did the dive. I knew I could do it, but had something happened (current vicious if the tide turned) it would've been my own fault. My point with all this is while I do think it may be the right thing-- duty-wise-- for a DM or instructor, or in general for an experienced diver to intercede in some way during bad advice, I don't know how often the veteran giving such advice would change his/her ways in the future. I know from 5+ years on SB that some people are very set in their ways-- a fault of my own at times. My gut says it is more likely a pissing match would ensue. But I guess there is a chance to make everything right IF you are very diplomatically gifted.

 

[Bob DBF]

When presented with a situation like the OP described, I have gone so far as to ask if I could tag along for the entertainment.




Bob
------------------------
I may be old, but I'm not dead yet.

 

[k ellis]

Every one has given great advice. I did get the chance to speak to another diver in my area just tonight and realized that my post may be a little misleading. This is not an actual event I witnessed but it was one that I know happens on the occasion. I have witnessed divers in all parts of the world (that I have traveled too) and they do get comfortable and forget from time to time that people who are new do need a little more experience. Here locally we have alot of great divers who go out of their way to make diving safe and enjoyable. There will be divers in every location that make mistakes and we have or will have witnessed this if we dive for a long enough period of time. I just was asking what opinions are in these events.

 

[CT-Rich]

I think that if you are hearing a vetran diver telling a newbie to ignore their limits, the pissing contest has already begun. Just tell the newbie what you think and don't worry if the 'vet' hears it. Once you have had your say, it is done. they either make the dive or not, their choice. I guess it would bother me to hold my tongue and then live with the consequences of an idiot leading a newbie into a dangeroussituation, without the newbie being aware of the actual risks. If they die they at least you tried. If they thumb the dive, good. If the boat captain hears about people being idiots, even better (his boat, his rules).