Procedures

[James]

Hi

Question is : If a boat leaves its divers in the water and sails off by accident, then theyre stuffed. What procedures are in place to stop this from happening would it come under the diving NGB's such as PADI to stop this from happening or would it be the responsibility of the boats NGBs such as the RYA ?

Also what is the Queensland (Austrailia) equivalent of the RYA ?

Thanks - James

 

[Walter]

What do NGB & RYA mean? Your question might be answered better if we understand it.

 

[Phil TK]

James once bubbled...
Hi

Question is : If a boat leaves its divers in the water and sails off by accident, then theyre stuffed. What procedures are in place to stop this from happening would it come under the diving NGB's such as PADI to stop this from happening or would it be the responsibility of the boats NGBs such as the RYA ?

Also what is the Queensland (Austrailia) equivalent of the RYA ?

Thanks - James

Is this a reference to that unfortunate incident off Port Douglas a few years ago? Two divers left behind as the boat merrily sped back to port?
From what I recall, the skipper was held culpable and had the book thrown at him, but there were suspicions later on that it was all faked by the two lost divers.
I should imagine that the DM in charge of the dive would have got into trouble though.
My apologise if you are not refering to that incident James, but if someone can dig up a link explaining that story you'll find out what happened legally speaking.

Phil TK

 

[James]

Meanings of NGB + RYA : Sorry Walter, I think these might be just British terms. NGB means National Governing Body and example of this would be the Royal Yachting Association (RYA) who are officially recognised legally in the UK as the body in charge of Yachting and Powerboating. I am trying to find out the name of the Austrailian equivalent.

Phil, It was the incident off Port Douglas that first prompted me to look into how this can happen. However if anyone has any other examples of divers being left and particularly the legal case that followed I would be intrested to hear of them.

Also do PADI guidelines reccomend that a head count be taken just before the dive vessel leaves for Port ?

Thanks to Walter + Phil

 

[Walter]

I don't know about Austrailia, but in my travels, I've seen many different methods, most are ineffective.

A head count is one of the absolute worst methods.

The best method I've seen is a roll call, if done correctly.

Correct method is:

1. No one does anything during the roll call except pay attention.

2. No one answers for anyone else.

3. Roll call is at the dock before begining the trip and after each dive.

4. Person doing the roll call hears an answer and sees the person responding.

PADI is not an NGB, it is merely a marketing company which issues certifications. In the US, there is no NGB for diving, Austrailia may or may not have one.

 

[James]

Thankyou Walter - Do you mind me asking what your qualifications and experiences are so I can referance some of what you say for a university project i'm doing?
Also why is a head count a poor system to use when diving ?

Thankyou

 

[Walter]

A head count is a poor method (except for very small groups) because people get counted twice. When 10 - 40 people are milling around on a boat, an accurate count is nearly impossible. In areas when several charter boats are operating, it is easy to pick up a diver off another boat and leave your diver in the water.

When I'm on a boat that is not using a proper roll call, I'll talk to another person on the boat with whom I'm not diving. I make a deal, you make sure I'm on the boat before it leaves and I'll make sure you're on board.

My credentials and experience:

YMCA Gold Instructor (former instructor trainer)
Divemaster/Captain at a charter boat operation (Tavernier Dive Center) in the Florida Keys from 1985 - 1992. (6½ years)

 

[Welshman]

I've seen this happen in circumstances where no method would have worked. A long tail boat from Chalong in Phuket takes two divers out to Anemone Reef/King Cruiser. Divers get in the water. Boatman then gets going on the weed. Boatman then falls asleep. Boat drifts away. Divers surface - no long tail and no boatman who is till firmly in the Land of the Weed. One diver was picked up quite quickly but the other was swept away and not picked up for about 2 hours. I would not have liked to be the boatman when those divers caught up with him!

Having said that Walter's roll call method has to be the most advisable.

 

[Cave Diver]

I have been out to the Texas Flower Gardens aboard the Sea Searcher II twice, and found thier method to be very effective.

During the breifing and waiver signing on the trip out, every diver is assigned a number.

During the dives, before a diver is allowed in the water they must give the DM in charge their number. The DM then writes their time in on a dry erase board next to their corresponding number.

When the diver gets back on the boat, the diver gives their number again, as well as max depth and both are recorded next to their number on the board.

This allows them to make sure that every diver is accounted for, and it also lets them monitor dive time and max depth. That way they can plan S.I.'s accordingly. They are also pretty stringent on their rules. If you break the depth limit, your diving is done.

I can't say their system is perfect, but it seems a lot better than most I have seen.

 

[wazza]

Ok guys I think I can help with only this part only:
What procedures are in place to stop this from happening?


What I use to do :

1. I boat list with all the name of the divers,
2. Certification level
3. What course are they taking
4. How deep and how long
5. Who is there Instructor or Divemaster if they r only coming for a fun dive
And each Instructor or Divemaster is responsible of his group, that means
They take the diver in the water at the same the rest of the staff on the boat are looking at the sea all the time to see is some one went to the surface and if they need help , as soon as the divers are coming the divemaster start to ask every one how deep and who long did they stay in the waster and he or she write down next to his name and in the end u ask the instructor if there is any one in the water from his students yet or not, but u can see from the boat list the every one have the how deep and how long so u know that they are all in the boat ,or who is in the boat and who is not .
Some time we are with 30 Divers in the same boat and if u r not in control a lot of things could happen more then leaving a diver in the water.

Concerning the tekkie diver I sit with them before the dive and I take there plan and I keep a copy with me to know when they are going to jump and how long they need to come back and how deep they are going and when they are going to send the SMB and if its red that means its ok and if its yellow that means they need help so we send the support divers in the water as well .and even more things to do then this.
so the answer for your question is a good MANAGEMENT and of course experience, our job is a great job having fun all day with new divers and diving 2 or 4 time per day some time but in the other hand there is a lot of stress and responsibility than it looks. Take care guys