I took my Sherwood Magnum regulator in for service to the only local Sherwood Service Center to have it serviced last Aug. I have dive plans for Grand Cayman, Belize, Roatan and Cozumel in September, along with a two week stay in Bonaire in October. This is the same place I've been taking my regs for service since I bought them (used) in 2007.
I found the second stage to be very difficult breathing. I have two Magnum second stages, one that was harder and wet breathing that came with the first stage, and another I had just bought that was supposedly new-old stock (NOS) and never used. I didn't take the NOS in for servicing, and that second stage seemed to breath better. I have my reg configured, for single tank diving, with the old (just serviced) first stage attached to a 7' long hose to the old (just serviced) second. I have the NOS second stage attached to a short hose bungee that I wear around my neck.
So I took the original (recently serviced) first and second stage back and told the owner of the LDS my concern. He said he'd have his tech look at it. I asked what they set the inhalation (cracking pressure) to, and he said they don't have a magnahelic so just set it so it doesn't free flow. I week or so later, the tech called to say he didn't find anything wrong. I asked about cracking pressure and he said he doesn't adjust that, since it requires bending parts, but it doesn't need adjustment after set at the factory. I went in to pick up my reg and was charge again for a service job. I asked why I had to pay when the tech said he didn't do anything, and was told "the tech charged the store, so they have to charge me". I paid and immediately sought advice on another, reputable regulator repair shop.
I settled on one back east, and they found the IP too low to check the second stage, so they set out to find out why. They disassembled the first stage and found it full of water (note that I didn't dive it since I got it from the LDS). They found that they could not remove the Flow Restrictor Assembly and filter. They believed a partially clogged filter was the culprit. When they called me with this information, I asked why it couldn't be removed, and they said it was seized, and appeared to have not been touched for years. I asked for options, and they said that the regulator body would need replacing (at a cost of well over $100). I asked if they would try removing the Restrictor Assembly, with excess force if necessary, as there wasn't anything to loose by doing so. They tried, but it didn't work.
I had the shop rework the second stage and return both to me. They found the second to be slightly maladjusted (adjusted more for an octo versus for primary). Of course I paid for this service and shipping both ways.
Well, I finally got up the courage to approach the LDS owner regarding this today. I showed him the parts list, which he didn't understand regarding what part was the Flow Restrictor Assembly (this is part number 18 in my illustrated parts breakdown, and Sherwood Part Numbers 5105-13, -14 and -15. After I brought in the old reg body and showed him where it goes, he went back and brought out a repair parts kit and challenged me to find those parts in the repair kit. I acknowledged that they were not routine replacement parts, but the Sherwood Manual instructs you to remove them and replace if it doesn't have 13-27 cc/min flow. My LDS owner says that is not needed, and that that piece has no effect on the performance of the regulator. He said it is only to allow flow to the Bleed Valve. This doesn't make sense to me.
In any case, I presented the fact that his tech didn't follow the service manual in servicing my reg, and he countered that they wouldn't if removal would damage the regulator. I agreed that was a good procedure, but I should have been notified that the regulator was unserviceable at that time, instead of returning it to me as serviced and charging me for the service. It is not clear to me (or to him) if the tech attempted to remove the Flow Restrictor Assembly in any case, since there were no parts in the repair kit to install. I'm not sure if the body was cleaned or not, but if it was, it was in violation of the service manual which clearly in bold print not to clean the flow control element.
I believe at a minimum, the tech was lazy and didn't follow the service manual. He either didn't try to remove or didn't let me know he couldn't remove the flow restrictor assembly. Further, he didn't clean the metal parts, per the manual, or he cleaned them with the flow restrictor, a violation of the manual. I was not notified that there was any problems with the servicing of the regulator. As the filter got further restricted (possibly by cleaning the body with it still installed), the volume of air allowed to pass decreased, reducing the IP and causing hard breathing. This is what the east coast reg shop says.
When I presented this to the LDS owner, he got loud and defensive, saying that he and his tech knew a lot more about servicing regs than I did. I admitted freely that was true, that is why I brought it to him in the first place. But I said I had an independent party attempt to service them and they found these problems. He said that they went to the same Regulator School as he and his tech did, so they don't know any more than he and his tech. His emphatically stated that the flow restrictor assembly has no affect on the performance of the regulator and if that wasn't good enough, not to bother coming back to his shop again. Well, needless to say, I won't be. But, I need to satisfy my own curiosity, and owe this LDS owner an apology, if what he states is correct...that the flow restrictor assembly has no purpose.
So, are there any Sherwood Authorized Service Instructors (those authorized to teach repair techs) that can set the record straight? Or, would there be someone or some place I can write Sherwood (who would give a dam) and get an official response. The reg is toast. I can't fix that, nor is it worth trying to recover any damages, I just want to know which reg shop (if either) is correct.
I found the second stage to be very difficult breathing. I have two Magnum second stages, one that was harder and wet breathing that came with the first stage, and another I had just bought that was supposedly new-old stock (NOS) and never used. I didn't take the NOS in for servicing, and that second stage seemed to breath better. I have my reg configured, for single tank diving, with the old (just serviced) first stage attached to a 7' long hose to the old (just serviced) second. I have the NOS second stage attached to a short hose bungee that I wear around my neck.
So I took the original (recently serviced) first and second stage back and told the owner of the LDS my concern. He said he'd have his tech look at it. I asked what they set the inhalation (cracking pressure) to, and he said they don't have a magnahelic so just set it so it doesn't free flow. I week or so later, the tech called to say he didn't find anything wrong. I asked about cracking pressure and he said he doesn't adjust that, since it requires bending parts, but it doesn't need adjustment after set at the factory. I went in to pick up my reg and was charge again for a service job. I asked why I had to pay when the tech said he didn't do anything, and was told "the tech charged the store, so they have to charge me". I paid and immediately sought advice on another, reputable regulator repair shop.
I settled on one back east, and they found the IP too low to check the second stage, so they set out to find out why. They disassembled the first stage and found it full of water (note that I didn't dive it since I got it from the LDS). They found that they could not remove the Flow Restrictor Assembly and filter. They believed a partially clogged filter was the culprit. When they called me with this information, I asked why it couldn't be removed, and they said it was seized, and appeared to have not been touched for years. I asked for options, and they said that the regulator body would need replacing (at a cost of well over $100). I asked if they would try removing the Restrictor Assembly, with excess force if necessary, as there wasn't anything to loose by doing so. They tried, but it didn't work.
I had the shop rework the second stage and return both to me. They found the second to be slightly maladjusted (adjusted more for an octo versus for primary). Of course I paid for this service and shipping both ways.
Well, I finally got up the courage to approach the LDS owner regarding this today. I showed him the parts list, which he didn't understand regarding what part was the Flow Restrictor Assembly (this is part number 18 in my illustrated parts breakdown, and Sherwood Part Numbers 5105-13, -14 and -15. After I brought in the old reg body and showed him where it goes, he went back and brought out a repair parts kit and challenged me to find those parts in the repair kit. I acknowledged that they were not routine replacement parts, but the Sherwood Manual instructs you to remove them and replace if it doesn't have 13-27 cc/min flow. My LDS owner says that is not needed, and that that piece has no effect on the performance of the regulator. He said it is only to allow flow to the Bleed Valve. This doesn't make sense to me.
In any case, I presented the fact that his tech didn't follow the service manual in servicing my reg, and he countered that they wouldn't if removal would damage the regulator. I agreed that was a good procedure, but I should have been notified that the regulator was unserviceable at that time, instead of returning it to me as serviced and charging me for the service. It is not clear to me (or to him) if the tech attempted to remove the Flow Restrictor Assembly in any case, since there were no parts in the repair kit to install. I'm not sure if the body was cleaned or not, but if it was, it was in violation of the service manual which clearly in bold print not to clean the flow control element.
I believe at a minimum, the tech was lazy and didn't follow the service manual. He either didn't try to remove or didn't let me know he couldn't remove the flow restrictor assembly. Further, he didn't clean the metal parts, per the manual, or he cleaned them with the flow restrictor, a violation of the manual. I was not notified that there was any problems with the servicing of the regulator. As the filter got further restricted (possibly by cleaning the body with it still installed), the volume of air allowed to pass decreased, reducing the IP and causing hard breathing. This is what the east coast reg shop says.
When I presented this to the LDS owner, he got loud and defensive, saying that he and his tech knew a lot more about servicing regs than I did. I admitted freely that was true, that is why I brought it to him in the first place. But I said I had an independent party attempt to service them and they found these problems. He said that they went to the same Regulator School as he and his tech did, so they don't know any more than he and his tech. His emphatically stated that the flow restrictor assembly has no affect on the performance of the regulator and if that wasn't good enough, not to bother coming back to his shop again. Well, needless to say, I won't be. But, I need to satisfy my own curiosity, and owe this LDS owner an apology, if what he states is correct...that the flow restrictor assembly has no purpose.
So, are there any Sherwood Authorized Service Instructors (those authorized to teach repair techs) that can set the record straight? Or, would there be someone or some place I can write Sherwood (who would give a dam) and get an official response. The reg is toast. I can't fix that, nor is it worth trying to recover any damages, I just want to know which reg shop (if either) is correct.
