Preparing for fundamentals / intro to tech

[Imla]

The geist of this convo is as follows...
Of the people who HAVE done Fundies, the general sounding advice is: do a lot of diving. Get comfortable in the watercolumn. Have fun while diving, but leave the teaching of specific GUE SOPs to your instructor. It is what you pay them for.

Of the people who HAVE NOT done Fundies... are where you find "the other advice".

I know who I would listen to specifically with regards to GUE classes.
With regards to the other part of the OPS question, someone who has done that class would have to chime in.

Personally... I'd advice you to inflate a buoy. Tie to 10m. Do ascents. Stopping at every 3 meters. Bring a lead or some other object to toss to each other. Get comfortable on the line. Other than that, just dive, have fun, and leave the worrying to your instructor!

 

[berndo]

It seems (almost) all the people who teach scuba here, including one who has been the director of training for TDI, IIRC disagree with you.

All of which coincidentally happen to be fans of same club ... how strange that they all have the same opinion on everything.

These aren't open water courses. It happens all the time.

How many people get turned down for a fundi class? Or any other class. In real life, hardly any instructor is going to turn down money... same with every other business.

 

[Lorenzoid]

It never occurred to you that kicking, especially in current, is easier when you're in trim?

Dude, I'll repeat, NO--I never gave much thought to my position in the water other than what is my depth. When finning, I might have been more horizontal than some of those people I still see at a 45 degree angle, kicking furiously, almost certainly because they're overweighted, but I never gave trim and propulsion serious thought until, well, it was Fundies in my case. I'm beginning to wonder whether you make too many assumptions about the skill level of the average tropical reef diver.

This doesn't seem to apply to the OP, who is apparently is starting from a somewhat better foundation than I had. This is not my thread, so let's get back to the OP's case.

 

[kierentec]

All of which coincidentally happen to be fans of same club ... how strange that they all have the same opinion on everything.


How many people get turned down for a fundi class? Or any other class. In real life, hardly any instructor is going to turn down money... same with every other business.

Entry level class like fundamentals? not often. But as it has been said, higher level classes all the time. I turn down a couple a month at least. I'm sure Tracy has turned down a few, I know for a fact @kensuf turns students away until they have a reasonable amount of experience. You can argue and ask "how many?" and feel like you're winning an argument because it's impossible for anyone to quantify. But you have verification of at least 2 instructors here already telling you it happens. And do you really not know any business owners who would turn away a customer who doesn't need their product or service?

 

[Tracy]

How many people get turned down for a fundi class? Or any other class. In real life, hardly any instructor is going to turn down money... same with every other business.

Fundamentals is an intro course. That is where you go first. So no, that would be like turning down students for open water courses.
Students get turned down from cave courses fairly regularly. I have turned down CCR students.
I have turned ANDP courses into intro to tech courses because they weren't at the level they thought they were.
It happens.

 

[berndo]

I'm beginning to wonder whether you make too many assumptions about the skill level of the average tropical reef diver.

I'm beginning to wonder if this is an issue with mostly american divers. I've worked as an instructor in several tropical locations and most (European) vacation divers I have seen aren't anywhere near as bad as you and other make it sound like. Many use too much weight but are doing ok, considering many don't dive regularly.
This assumption that nobody can figure anything and doesn't ever think about anything unless they get tec training or hand holding is not what I have seen. The people I see who are actually diving in a 45 degree angle are a tiny minority.

 

[VikingDives]

All of which coincidentally happen to be fans of same club ... how strange that they all have the same opinion on everything.


How many people get turned down for a fundi class? Or any other class. In real life, hardly any instructor is going to turn down money... same with every other business.

I'm no GUE fanboy. I've never taken a class from them. I don't have a dog in that fight, but I am a fan of good training. I've dived with a number of GUE divers and instructors, and trained students that are GUE trained. As a rule of thumb, sight unseen, I'd choose to dive with any random GUE trained diver than I would a random diver from any other agency (including the ones I teach for) because they're better divers on average.

You really add nothing to these discussions, so I generally leave you on ignore, but I'd invite you to explain your training, experience instructing, and overall experience. Others have asked you and you continue to ignore the questions.

Since you've never answered why you hate GUE so much, I just assume you couldn't get a pass on some course you took in the past. Am I wrong about that? What's been your experience?

Maybe you could add something to the discussion instead of arguing with folks that have a different viewpoint than you do? You may have something to add here, but generally you taint yourself as a close-minded ***hat when you engage in these discussions. Everyone gets that you don't like GUE. Let it go.

 

[berndo]

... any business owners who would turn away a customer who doesn't need their product or service?

I can't think of any.

I diving, the student might fail in a class or quit but not being allowed to start, a class, I've hardly ever heard actually happening. Especially not enrty level classes.
Only because you might do that doesn't mean it's normal in the dive industry... the dive industry is largely a **** show.

 

[kierentec]

. …the dive industry is largely a **** show.

well, we agree on something. But even so, yes, absolutely, lots of technical, ccr, and cave instructors turn students down all the time. Almost all of my friends are dive professionals and it’s been my life for over 15 years. No question, students get turned down.

 

[berndo]

Since you've never answered why you hate GUE so much, I just assume you couldn't get a pass on some course you took in the past.

That's a very apple-fan thing to say... you're not a fan so you hate it. I'm annoyed by the constant one-sided plugging of their product. If in every single 'what computer to buy' thread the same 5 people would yap on and on about how AMAZING the new apple watch is and how everything else sucks, I would be equally annoyed.