Pervasive Fallacy about Split Fins

[J.R.]

I find it fascinating that Temple can be such an expert on fins, eficiency, thrust and how they relate to gearing etc, when according to his blog he has the sum total of 17 dives. Obviously he has surfed the web a lot to gain all his knowledge???????????

Humm... just read through this thread... must have missed something... was there a purpose to it?

 

[djanni]

Humm... just read through this thread... must have missed something... was there a purpose to it?

Yes. Read it again.

 

[djanni]

I find it fascinating that Temple can be such an expert on fins, eficiency, thrust and how they relate to gearing etc, when according to his blog he has the sum total of 17 dives. Obviously he has surfed the web a lot to gain all his knowledge???????????

Research does bring knowledge. Knowledge is power. Knowledge has more value than opinions.

 

[wettek]

Research does bring knowledge. Knowledge is power. Knowledge has more value than opinions.

Knowledge is only power when it can be used correctly. Theoretically I can learn lots of knowledge about heart surgery from surfing the net. Want to come over here and lie down and let me take a look at your ticker? Real life experience with the gear means a lot more than a number of articles Temple has read on the net or in magazines.

As for the previous post that Temple is outclassing us, I don't think so. All he is doing is talking in circles trying to sound like he is an expert and back-pedalling now that people are providing EXPERIENCED arguements against his opinion.

 

[Doubles]

Greetings ToD - I haven't read the scientific studies nor do I have much interest in them.

Here is what I do have an interest in - can I swim a set of steel double 100's to the surface with the fins I choose to wear and my wing empty?

While undergoing my deco procedures class I tried it from a depth of 30ffw with my scubapro split fins that I had bought when I was in my ow class. The results were that I never got close to the surface.

During the surface interval my instructor pulled out an old set of rockets for me to try on the next dive.

The results of the same test from 30ffw with the rockets was that my dive computer started beeping as my ascent rate was faster than 60fps and I had to bicycle a bit to make it quit. Bottom line - it was easy to swim those doubles to the surface with the rockets.

I fully understand the difference of speed through the water vs speed over ground etc etc. You can quote all of the studies that show more thrust with less exerted force that you want, but my real life experience proves to me that split fins don't cut it.

My split fins are currently ornaments in my garage - I'd be happy to sell them to a split fin "believer"

Cheers

Steve

 

[mdb]

I think the NWGRATEFUll diver had it spot on many posts ago. Take it to the water and find out for yourself. Not all paddle fins are equal, some are inexpensive thermoplastics molded for $8.00 or $9.00 a pair or less and sold with huge marketing hype. Other paddle fins are high quality using good materials and design. The same with split fins. Some work very well, others not so well. It is not just paddle vs. split. It has a lot to do with the materials used, the design of the fin itself, the kick "style" of the diver, etc. This argument will go on and on. As Bob said "Take it to the water".

 

[djanni]

Knowledge is only power when it can be used correctly. Theoretically I can learn lots of knowledge about heart surgery from surfing the net. Want to come over here and lie down and let me take a look at your ticker? Real life experience with the gear means a lot more than a number of articles Temple has read on the net or in magazines.

As for the previous post that Temple is outclassing us, I don't think so. All he is doing is talking in circles trying to sound like he is an expert and back-pedalling now that people are providing EXPERIENCED arguements against his opinion.

You may have thought I was saying TD's knowledge, regardless of how it was aquired, trumped experience. That's not what I was saying.

However, you pointed out his lack of experience and suggested surfing the web had provided it.

Knowledge is knowledge regardless of how it's aquired. Needless to say, the knowledge needs to be creditable to be worthwhile. I think a little knowledage and lot's of experience is pretty much equal to lot's of knowledge and a little experience.

I also think drysuit divers and especially those with twin tanks have different needs. While splits may work for them, they may not be ideal for the conditions they dive. The reverse is probably true as well... While short stubby and stiff paddle fins work in warm tropical waters with single tanks they may not be ideal for those conditions.

Actually I don't have a clue. I sure like my "Atomic" splits though.


EDIT: Added Atomic's

 

[wettek]

I'll stick with my Atomics. Best of both worlds in my opinion, stiff enough to feel the water, easier than solid blades.

 

[Izze]

The original post has got nothing to do with what fin is best. Rather it's an argumentation against three often seen statements in these discussions that simply aren't true.

 

[RJP]

an: Is this the right room for an argument?
Other Man: (pause) I've told you once.
Man: No you haven't!
Other Man: Yes I have.
M: When?
O: Just now.
M: No you didn't!
O: Yes I did!
M: You didn't!
O: I did!
M: You didn't!
O: I'm telling you, I did!
M: You didn't!
O: Oh I'm sorry, is this a five minute argument, or the full half hour?
M: Ah! (taking out his wallet and paying) Just the five minutes.
O: Just the five minutes. Thank you.
O: Anyway, I did.
M: You most certainly did not!
O: Now let's get one thing perfectly clear: I most definitely told you!
M: Oh no you didn't!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: Oh no you didn't!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: Oh no you didn't!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: Oh no you didn't!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: Oh no you didn't!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: Oh no you didn't!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: No you DIDN'T!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: No you DIDN'T!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: No you DIDN'T!
O: Oh yes I did!
M: Oh look, this isn't an argument!

(pause)

O: Yes it is!
M: No it isn't!

M: It's just contradiction!
O: No it isn't!
M: It IS!
O: It is NOT!
M: You just contradicted me!
O: No I didn't!
M: You DID!
O: No no no!
M: You did just then!
O: Nonsense!
M: (exasperated) Oh, this is futile!!
(pause)
O: No it isn't!
M: Yes it is!
(pause)
M: I came here for a good argument!
O: AH, no you didn't, you came here for an argument!
M: An argument isn't just contradiction.
O: Well! it CAN be!
M: No it can't!
M: An argument is a connected series of statement intended to establish a
proposition.
O: No it isn't!
M: Yes it is! 'tisn't just contradiction.
O: Look, if I *argue* with you, I must take up a contrary position!
M: Yes but it isn't just saying "no it isn't".
O: Yes it is!
M: No it isn't!
O: Yes it is!
M: No it isn't!
O: Yes it is!
M: No it ISN'T! Argument is an intellectual process. Contradiction is just
the automatic gainsaying of anything the other person says.
O: It is NOT!
M: It is!
O: Not at all!
M: It is!

The Arguer hits a bell on his desk and stops.

O: Thank you, that's it.
M: (stunned) What?
O: That's it. Good morning.
M: But I was just getting interested!
O: I'm sorry, the five minutes is up.
M: That was never five minutes!!
O: I'm afraid it was.
M: (leading on) No it wasn't.....
O: I'm sorry, I'm not allowed to argue any more.
M: WHAT??
O: If you want me to go on arguing, you'll have to pay for another five
minutes.
M: But that was never five minutes just now!
Oh Come on!
Oh this is...
This is ridiculous!
O: I told you...
I told you, I'm not allowed to argue unless you PAY!
M: Oh all right. (takes out his wallet and pays again.) There you are.
O: Thank you.
M: (clears throat) Well...
O: Well WHAT?
M: That was never five minutes just now.
O: I told you, I'm not allowed to argue unless you've paid!
M: Well I just paid!
O: No you didn't!
M: I DID!!!
O: YOU didn't!
M: I DID!!!
O: YOU didn't!
M: I DID!!!
O: YOU didn't!
M: I DID!!!
O: YOU didn't!
M: I-dbct-fd-tq! I don't want to argue about it!
O: Well I'm very sorry but you didn't pay!
M: Ah hah! Well if I didn't pay, why are you arguing??? Ah HAAAAAAHHH!
Gotcha!
O: No you haven't!
M: Yes I have!
If you're arguing, I must have paid.
O: Not necessarily.
I *could* be arguing in my spare time.
M: I've had enough of this!
O: No you haven't.
(door slam)