Perfecting my buoyancy

[IncreaseMyT]

It took me 50 dives and a bunch of pool time but I got it dialed. Time in the water helped me the most

 

[Bent Benny]

Any "perfecting buoyancy class" or similar will only help if the instructor can dive like that and teach others how to dive like that. NAUI technical instructors can all dive like that, but I don't think there are any in Maine. Many NAUI recreational instructors can teach like that as well *I am one of them, and there are many on this forum that can as well*, but just because it's a NAUI class doesn't mean that the instructor can dive like that.

Now, "arms out" is personal preference and while it makes it easier for some, many of us don't dive like that for various reasons. I dive with my arms crossed unless I am cave diving and have a scooter/light with me. Shoulder d-rings make good thumb hooks.

This is not something you can learn online, this is not something you can watch any videos or read any articles on. This is something that you have to learn by doing because it is all about learning how your body feels when it is in that type of position. The best way to do it is to get in the shallow section of a pool, with as big of a mirror as you can find, and hover in front of it and watch yourself. You know what it's supposed to look like from watching videos and seeing pictures online, now you have to make yourself look like that, and the learning process is actually how it feels when you look like that. Mirrors are the best teacher for trim and body position.
The shallow end of the pool is the cruelest mistress to learn buoyancy and if you can hover in 3ft of water, you can hover anywhere.

I always get great advice from you, thanks. It is much easier for me to get in the ocean than a pool, but I will try to find some time soon. My buoyancy/trim has been improving alot, especially since switching to BP/W, but I was just hoping to find some info about the fundamentals of perfecting my buoyancy. My OW instructor dives overweighted and told my it is fine to use your hands on the bottom. Thay is sculling, right?

I just thought if I could do some reading on this stuff then I can go practice it to actually form the skills. I don't think I'm going to read an article and magically have perfect buoyancy, but I don't think just trying to figure it out myself is a good idea either as I don't want to form bad habits.

I never did and even JJ has complemented me on my buoyancy to the point he assumed I had taken a fundies class.

First things first. Perfect buoyancy comes from having perfect trim and perfect weighting. Here's my article on Trim: Master Neutral Buoyancy: The Importance of Horizontal Trim (Simple Vector Physics) - ScubaBoard

This was very informative, though it would be better if the images/gif's worked. This is exactly the type of thing I was hoping to find. Is there a part 2 and 3? Are there any other articles written by someone else that you can recommend?

The more I learn on here the more I feel like I got gypped by my instructor/LDS owner. It sucks I really like the guy alot but maybe he just isn't a good instructor.

 

[tbone1004]

@Bent Benny sculling is fins for moving slowly around. It's basically an ankle-only frog kick. You should not use your hands for any sort of propulsion unless you are pulling against current.

in terms of what to read, the key is unfortunately just time in the water. You have to learn how the two different *three if in drysuit* bubbles work to change your displacement in the water column. If you dive overweighted, the bcd will be more full and as such more sensitive to depth changes and can cause runaway ascent/descents if you aren't on the game. Learn how your breathing patterns will change how you dive. Do you inhale relatively quickly and are a smidgen positive with a full breath, then as you slowly exhale you go to neutral then a pound or two negative? Do you slowly inhale to go from a smidgen negative on an empty lung then slowly inhale to go a pound or two positive?

That stuff unfortunately comes with time. Learning horizontal trim and proper propulsion is IMO much more important and much harder to sort out than neutral buoyancy. Get yourself good and flat and you are creating a lot of drag to move up and down and during a normal breathing cycle, you shouldn't move more than a few inches in either direction. The GUE books "beginning with the end in mind" and "doing it right, the fundamentals of better diving" are good reads, but realistically it comes back to getting in the water with a properly sorted rig and just getting hours underwater. Ideally with a mentor who knows what they're doing.

If you're not all the way out on the island and closer to Brunswick type area, try to get a hold of @Luis H who's down closer to Portland. He's a damn good diver and can help you out in more ways than you'll realize

 

[Bent Benny]

@Bent Benny sculling is fins for moving slowly around. It's basically an ankle-only frog kick. You should not use your hands for any sort of propulsion unless you are pulling against current.

in terms of what to read, the key is unfortunately just time in the water. You have to learn how the two different *three if in drysuit* bubbles work to change your displacement in the water column. If you dive overweighted, the bcd will be more full and as such more sensitive to depth changes and can cause runaway ascent/descents if you aren't on the game. Learn how your breathing patterns will change how you dive. Do you inhale relatively quickly and are a smidgen positive with a full breath, then as you slowly exhale you go to neutral then a pound or two negative? Do you slowly inhale to go from a smidgen negative on an empty lung then slowly inhale to go a pound or two positive?

That stuff unfortunately comes with time. Learning horizontal trim and proper propulsion is IMO much more important and much harder to sort out than neutral buoyancy. Get yourself good and flat and you are creating a lot of drag to move up and down and during a normal breathing cycle, you shouldn't move more than a few inches in either direction. The GUE books "beginning with the end in mind" and "doing it right, the fundamentals of better diving" are good reads, but realistically it comes back to getting in the water with a properly sorted rig and just getting hours underwater. Ideally with a mentor who knows what they're doing.

If you're not all the way out on the island and closer to Brunswick type area, try to get a hold of @Luis H who's down closer to Portland. He's a damn good diver and can help you out in more ways than you'll realize

Awesome I will buy both of those books. I've been getting in the water as much as possible I just think it will help if I have some educational material to go with it. I don't expect to be a great diver overnight.

I am pretty much on the island full time right now except a few hours on the mainland once or twice a week, but I will be back living on the mainland in another couple months. I will contact Luis H, is he an instructor or what? My mainland residence is about 1.5hrs away from Portland, but I don't mind traveling if it will help me become a better diver.

 

[eelnoraa]

want my buoyancy/trim to be like the GUE/DIR guys. I've been reading as much as I can but I'm not finding anything that starts from the ground up.

Why not take a GUE fundamental class? You will get this and way more out of it even if you decide GUE philosophy isn't for you

 

[tomfcrist]

My opinion...go dive. A lot.

Be your harshest critic, and try to improve something every time you dive.

Find a buddy that will dive with you regularly...preferably one you wish to emulate. Learn via mentoring and constructive criticism. Remember that “there are no feelings in debriefs”.

 

[tbone1004]

Awesome I will buy both of those books. I've been getting in the water as much as possible I just think it will help if I have some educational material to go with it. I don't expect to be a great diver overnight.

I am pretty much on the island full time right now except a few hours on the mainland once or twice a week, but I will be back living on the mainland in another couple months. I will contact Luis H, is he an instructor or what? My mainland residence is about 1.5hrs away from Portland, but I don't mind traveling if it will help me become a better diver.

instructor he is not. brilliant engineer and very good diver, he is

 

[Norwegian Cave Diver]

Find a highly respected cave instructor. He/She will be able to teach you Buoyancy - Trim - Propulsion.

 

[Diver0001]

I want my buoyancy/trim to be like the GUE/DIR guys. I've been reading as much as I can but I'm not finding anything that starts from the ground up.

So I have a couple questions. Will a NAUI perfecting buoyancy class really help much? Will the things I learn there be in conflict with the horizontal, arms out style that I see all the really good divers using?

The other question is more of a request. Can anyone recommend any articles or videos that will help me work on my buoyancy control/trim? Preferably some really basic or in depth stuff. I don't mind having to pay for information but the more I can learn online the better.

Thanks everyone.

For the same reason you can't become an efficient runner by reading a book about running, you can't become an efficient diver with knowledge alone.

The very first thing you need to do is go diving. I see in your profile that you're not a beginner but your level of experience is something that I generally associate with divers who are 3rd stage of learning.

BTW, the 4 stages of learning are
1) unable, unaware (ie, people with no training)
2) unable, aware (you know what you don't know)
3) able aware ( you know what you're doing but need experience)
4) able unaware ( expert)

That's a really rough throw at the concept of learning and you need to understand that this process is not a one time thing. In the process of learning to dive you'll go through that cycle over and over again (as you do with any skill in any aspect of your life).

The interesting thing to you right now is to identify the phase of learning you're in, because the four phases also correspond to the type of instructor you need. I.e.

1) unable, unaware (requires highly directive training)
2) unable, aware (requires directive training and time for self practice)
3) able aware (requires coaching)
4) able unaware (requires a mentor)

All of these terms are used on Scubaboard and misunderstanding of this model is the biggest reason why someone will say "you need this, or you need that". What I'm hoping to achieve here is to give you a tool to decide for yourself what you need.

Some courses, obviously, correspond to a certain type of training. For example the OW course (unable, unaware requires directive training) means that people (like me) who teach a LOT of OW courses are likely to be very directive. A course in advanced Trimix will only be directive as it relates to mistakes but will mostly involve learning "tips and tricks" (ie, mentoring).

See what I'm getting at?

So your question is how to improve your trim and buoyancy. You indicate yourself that you have the knowledge (you've read about it) but lack the experience. That puts you in the "unable, aware" category and maybe on the edge of the "able aware" category. So what you're looking for is an instructor who will show you what you don't know (directive) and then send you home with homework (allowing time for self study) and will come back some months later and re-evaluate and give you feedback (coaching).

I don't know of a single scuba course out there that will cover all three of these bases. However, the GUE fundamentals will cover the first step (you will probably learn a lot but still "fail" it) but after fundies you need to look for an experienced instructor in your local area who can pick up the baton from the fundies course and run with it for the next phases of learning you need.

Step 1 would be, to my way of thinking, to take a fundies course or something similar from another agency. You need to be aware that what you want isn't going to happen in one course so you need to cultivate connections with local instructors who are able to be both directive and coaching and work out some private training with them after that.

That's the short track.

The long track is to do what I did, which is to dive with divers who you look up to for 20 years and try to learn from them what you can learn organically. This is the Shaolin Kung-Fu approach. It is highly inefficient but you will also reach your goal doing that. The way my generation is "wired" the Shaolin approach was more common. The way the younger generation(s) are wired, you're going to need to pay more, spend less time on it but need multiple instructors.

Good luck.

R..

 

[Bent Benny]

Why not take a GUE fundamental class? You will get this and way more out of it even if you decide GUE philosophy isn't for you

I wish I could but I don't think there are any in my area.

My opinion...go dive. A lot.

Be your harshest critic, and try to improve something every time you dive.

Find a buddy that will dive with you regularly...preferably one you wish to emulate. Learn via mentoring and constructive criticism. Remember that “there are no feelings in debriefs”.

I have been trying to dive alot. Every time I have a couple hours free (which isn't often enough) I go for a dive. I really would like to find a mentor, but that is really hard to do living on a remote island. It seems like self teaching is my only option at this time. Hopefully in a couple months I will be in a position to find one though.