People who don't like BP/W?

[DennisS]

I used to dive a scubapro classic, I got a transpac with travel wings and a BP with dive rite wings. I gave the classic to my brother and used it last time I visited. I still like it. Its a good BC. I'd use either for single tanks. I got the BP wing for double 80s, which is the original reason I switched from the classic to a transpac. I don't see much difference for singles.

 

[Hallmac]

Well I'll add my name to the people who use the bp for tech dives and a back inflate for rec. I find the Back inflate more comfortable in a shorty than the BP but it may be to the fact that I use regular weight belt webbing that is pretty darn stiff. As far as in the water I don't feel any difference. Getting out of the gear is when I see the difference. I like the fact that I can loosen the left shoulder strap and get the extra clearance for the dump valve on my dry suit. When in warm water if it wasn't for the stiff webbing I don't think it would matter much what I wore. On the surface I'm usually on my back floating so that heads forward thing I can't speak on. As for the increased drag and torso crushing air around ribs commonly addressed when talking about jacket BCs, I'm of the "you are overweighted and using to much air belief myself". While I own a jacket style Pro QD I haven't dove it in several years. Just too much material under the arms for me.

Hallmac

 

[DivesWithTurtles]

Read the thread again, there are 7 of us here.

Eh, so I count funny.

Walter, I've noticed that you seem to be the only one that prefers a jacket for doubles. (BTW, I wasn't counting those that said they use a jacket for singles and a BP for doubles.) I've never used doubles. But I'm surprised that you don't find the BP more stable for dubs. I know that you've got lots of experience. Do you do much diving with dubs? Is it a matter of preferring to keep your gear consistent, or are you actually more comfortable in the jacket with dubs?

 

[Walter]

"Do you do much diving with dubs?"

That depends on how you define "much." I have about 700 - 800 dives with twins. I use my vest (I've never seen a jacket BC) with them and while I've used a BP/wings with twins I really don't notice any difference. The BP/wings is a fine set up, but they have no advantage I can see in my diving.

 

[-hh]

If someone wants to give me a BP/W I'll evaluate it and tell you if I want to stick with it or not.

You can buy mine if you want...PM me with your offer of what % of what I paid you're willing to buy it for, and other details.

I've not "gone back" to a Jacket yet, but I do plan on doing so...just need to warm up the wife to the expense (...and find a buyer

My rec diving is mostly travel-based, which means that I want to minimize the weight of my travel gear (so a weighted BP is out), and the tank is going to typically be a single AL80.

Between the positive buoyancy of that AL80 tank at the end of a dive and the negative buoyancy of my UW camera system (Nikonos, held in front of me), the two conspire with the wing design to provide a nasty "face down" torque. No amount of adjustment with weights and/or tank height/placement has resulted in what I consider an equal-to-my-old-jacket's "upright on surface" orientation/performance.

The implication is that for dives that may result in longer surface floats, IMO, the Wing's "face down" problem is less acceptable than a Jacket's "squeeze" problem...my choice is the lesser of two evils.

If I were to drop the UW camera and switch to twin LP steels, I might like what I have...but if I drop the camera, I'm not going to be interested in going diving, and the greater weight of twins represents a risk of a repeat back injury that I need to try to avoid. So while a wing may be optimal for others, its not going to be for me, either today or the future.


-hh

 

[Walter]

"IMO, the Wing's "face down" problem is less acceptable than than a Jacket's "squeeze" problem...my choice is the lesser of two evils."

Don't connect the chest strap on your vest and there is no "squeeze" problem.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I don't have either problem with my wing.

 

[Walter]

"I don't have either problem with my wing."

I agree, a well designed wing is an excellent BC, comparable to a well designed vest.

 

[-hh]

"IMO, the Wing's "face down" problem is less acceptable than than a Jacket's "squeeze" problem...my choice is the lesser of two evils."

Don't connect the chest strap on your vest and there is no "squeeze" problem.

Exactly. FWIW, the only time I've had noticable jacket squeeze has been in a heavy coldwater configuration with two tanks at the beginning of a dive. The sum of the tanks' air and the like put the jacket's bladder at nearly 100% of its rated capacity.


Re: Mike's "I don't have either problem with my wing." all I can say is YMMV. I will say that for dives where I come right up under the boat, pop up 5ft away and I'm out of the water in 30 seconds, I'd agree that its not a problem.

What made me recognize the difference were back-to-back trips with drift diving with longish surface wait times until the chase boat retrieved us. The conditions were a 2-3ft chop for 15-30 minutes (Galapagos, Bequia). I found that there was a clear difference in the required level of effort, that its hard to spot the boat trying to find you if you're face-down on snorkel , and that the Jacket was clearly better overall than the Wing, "rolling onto your back" option notwithstanding.

Now it is possible that the negative buoyancy of my UW camera was "just enough" to upset the balance and cause the forward tip to be significant, but as I said before, diving without a camera simply isn't an option for me. If this means that I need to tailor my equipment to be "camera compatible", so be it.


-hh

 

[OneBrightGator]

I'm not trying to pick a fight, I promise. HH, have you tried rearranging your weight to offset the moment created by your camera? I would think it would effect your diving/floating no matter what type of BC you had.

Ben