Pacific Trash Vortex! Wow! I had no idea it was this bad!

[Jupiter31]

PS I'm refering in my post above to the small bottles of coke, sprite,etc, you see packaged in the small glass bottles on the grocery shelf- designed to remind us of the small glass 6.5 oz bottles of coke common years back.

 

[Shaka Doug]

:uwphotographer:

Hey Drew, got a request for ya! While you're out there on the Algalita, look real hard for a camera. I know of lot's of divers who have lost them on dives over the years and I'm sure you do too. They usually float and I'll bet some have made it into the vortex by now. It would be interesting to get the film developed or pictures printed out. Some may even provide evidence of where and when they were lost. That could be some very interesting data. Imagine if you found one that was there for twenty years or so and you could still see the images? Imagine if it came from a place halfway around the globe? Maybe it was only lost last year and it came from halfway around the globe...that would be valuable info too.

Speaking of cameras. I'd like to ask everyone here in the Hawaiian Islands to go to their windward side and capture some photographic evidence of plastic debris that has washed up on the shore. We have already seen photos of Kamilo Beach on the Big Island but it seems as though many islanders have no idea that we all have similar beaches on our own islands. I know the southwestern part of Koki Beach out near Hana, Maui gets a lot of flotsam. I've seen it with my own eyes but have no photos to post. If people see this firsthand it will make them more sympathetic to our problem and increase their desire to help out. Anyone want to take charge and do this? Kauai? Maui? Oahu? Ni'ihau? Big Island? Let's see what you got! Show us your TRASH!!

 

[psychocabbage]

hmmm there are always other sides of the fence here.. You can get every single person in the US to not discard things but will it do any good?
NO.

There are people in other countries with real problems. Like eating that day. Do you think they worry about where their trash goes?

I am one of those realistic people that just dont care. You can say its going to affect us left and right but in the grand scheme of things, I wont be affected. My kids MAY be affected but thats not for certain either.

Its like blaming cars for global warming when its cows that make most of our pollutants. The planet will do just fine without us interfering.. Eventually, it will remove us and all of our "stuff" and start over.

 

[Jupiter31]

Re your 1st paragraph; actually, it would do a lot of good, because the US produces a disproportional amount of garbage, pollutants, etc - of course, we also have the worlds highest level of industrial production. But no one - not even Al Gore - is suggesting its realistic for the USA to eliminate all polution. I don't want to go back to the stone age either!

3rd world countries use more of what they have (food, for example), waste less out of necessity, and therefore throw out less - I remember as a kid my mother telling us to eat all on our plates b/c "people were starving in Europe"!

But I'm not ready to compare all our automotive environmental/pollution
at the feet - or butt ends - of cows.

And while the great thing about apathy is you don't have to care, I would think you might want to do all possible to make - or leave - the world a better place for your children.

 

[Kyzzle]

hmmm there are always other sides of the fence here.. You can get every single person in the US to not discard things but will it do any good?
NO.

There are people in other countries with real problems. Like eating that day. Do you think they worry about where their trash goes?

I am one of those realistic people that just dont care. You can say its going to affect us left and right but in the grand scheme of things, I wont be affected. My kids MAY be affected but thats not for certain either.

Its like blaming cars for global warming when its cows that make most of our pollutants. The planet will do just fine without us interfering.. Eventually, it will remove us and all of our "stuff" and start over.

That is an interesting point of view, and one that I can kinda see where you come from, but I would have to say that it sounds like a cop-out. Honestly, don't you think it has to start somewhere? It is reminiscent of the argument that people shouldn't vote because their vote doesn't matter, and it won't make any change...
The change has to start somewhere and I think it needs to start within ourselves. And within our way of thinking. Do I have THE solution? I sure don't, but I wish I did. I am no expert by any means on this topic, diving, or lots of topics for that matter. But I am an individual that can do my part... we all are. Will we see any difference in our lifetime or our childrens lifetime? I can't answer that either. But would doing something at all help... I think it would. However, neither one of us has any proof that it would or wouldn't. I think we both agree that it won't get any better... so why not TRY? What's it going to hurt?

Yes there are other countries out there with "real" problems as you say. Should we send money and food to them? Why? We have "real" people in this country who have "real" problems and some are "really" starving too. They wake up too not knowing where they are going to get there next meal. I wish we could feed the worlds hungry, solve the worlds financial crisis and live in world peace. But that isn't going to happen if we can't/don't do it for our own people, and our own country. And this pollution issue happens to be one of our own "real" problems too. It's all to easy to put the blame on someone or something else just so we can make it someones elses problem instead of our own. We oughta do something for the cause, and not just be the cause.

 

[ScubaSarus]

Someone asks in the other thread "how can it be fixed"?

My reply is similar to a title of a playstation video game "Destroy All Humans" giving or taking the few that care. Sad

 

[socaldiver77]

Wow!!! Thanks for bringing this up. Amazing and I was not aware of the second batch of garbage east of Japan. This definitely needs more exposure!!!

CB

 

[Shaka Doug]

HEY PSYCHOCABBAGE! ***?? Did I just read what you just wrote? Really? How many others are there like you? Thanks for speaking up. Pretty pathetic to think that it's not a problem or not our problem. We are the generation making all this trash. Accept responsibility and do something for once damn it! Don't you get it??? Quit being so selfish. There are endless generations destined to come after us. Did you forget about them? What? You die and the world ends as we know it? Come on.....you should rethink your future while you still have a chance. No civilization to date has done more damage than ours. What does that mean for the future of planet earth?....want to buy some nice resort property on Mars??? Might be your best bet but I'm 100% positive you can't afford it. Get real and chip in.

 

[ScubaSarus]

There are people in other countries with real problems. Like eating that day. Do you think they worry about where their trash goes?

Well if this keeps up, we will interrupt the food chain to such large degree, it will be even harder to get food as a lot of poor nations depend on the sea for food.

 

[psychocabbage]

That is an interesting point of view, and one that I can kinda see where you come from, but I would have to say that it sounds like a cop-out.

Not a cop out at all.. Just being realistic.
Say average Joe has a normal life in the US. He works for a living, has a wife who works for a living and has 2.3 kids or whatever. In any case, he is up by 6am and home by 6pm. In bed by 10pm. Thats 4 hours to eat, foster relationship with kids and wife and maybe the family pet then back to bed. Where does this guy have time and in more cases $ to devote to "saving the world"?

Now, do I want to spend the few hours I have of "down time" working to save the world or would I rather spend it with my kids? *Ohh, and I wont be spending it with my kids to save the world. Thats just not fun. I get no joy from picking up trash. I get no joy or feeling of "WOW! I did a good thing!" from putting plastics in a recycling container. I do get a joy out of taking the kids to race cars or bikes (not spectate but participate) or to go out shooting or maybe even diving on the weekends at the local quarries. (ever notice that there is trash in a quarry? and its supposed to be mainly divers there. Who is putting the trash in there? Maybe everyone is not on the same page...)

I dont litter and I dont let the kids litter. I dont throw my gum out the window. I throw it in a trash can when I can. But I am not about to throw my $ at a cause nor spend my time (worth $$) trying to clean up someone elses mess.

Its definately not a cop out its a frame of mind. Is my time more valuable than yours? Its all about perspective. To me YES. I have to live my life everyday and really dont care about other peoples as they are not directly affecting mine. I dont have to feel compassion for the worlds hungry. If they would stop reproducing, they wouldnt be so hungry. I may seem cold but to those that know me, they know me how I am with people in my "world". And like most everything, its not a problem until I say its a problem.


Most people here are divers, and many have been to Cozumel. Have you looked around that island? We love it there and go a few times a year. But its full of trash. Venture away from the "resorts" and go into where the people live and you will see the poverty and the trash lined streets.. Does that make it into the nearby water? I would say YES.

HEY PSYCHOCABBAGE! ***?? Did I just read what you just wrote? Really? How many others are there like you? Thanks for speaking up. Pretty pathetic to think that it's not a problem or not our problem. We are the generation making all this trash. Accept responsibility and do something for once damn it! Don't you get it??? Quit being so selfish. There are endless generations destined to come after us. Did you forget about them? What? You die and the world ends as we know it? Come on.....you should rethink your future while you still have a chance. No civilization to date has done more damage than ours. What does that mean for the future of planet earth?....want to buy some nice resort property on Mars??? Might be your best bet but I'm 100% positive you can't afford it. Get real and chip in.

So you want to blame our Generation because we created the plastic and used the plastic and appearantly we didnt care about where to throw it so it went into the ocean. Interesting.

As for being selfish, why wouldnt I be? Last I checked, the only persons responsible for us making our house payments, our car payments, feeding our kids, dogs and fish are US. I focus on US here in the house and not the rest of the world because I can certainly affect US. Its being REAL and not being Dilusional. Why are you so worried about the planet? Meteors have hit this rock and it kept spinning. Dinosaurs walked and ate here and they are no more. So think about it really. Are you really worried about the planet or are you really just worried about it sustaining human life?? I think thats the root. Humans and their "desire" to not become extict and just another spec in time. A happening. Sooo much is out of your control and so few people have the common sense to understand that we are all very insignificant. You are on this planet for a brief flash of time. Enjoy it while you can. It will pass quickly. I live every day like it may be my last because there are nor guarantees given. I definately wont lose sleep over plastics floating in the ocean..

Well if this keeps up, we will interrupt the food chain to such large degree, it will be even harder to get food as a lot of poor nations depend on the sea for food.

And that may just be part of the cycle. They will die off and their land can return to a healthy state over a long period of time. Or, like many places, we can deem it unsuitable to sustain human life. There are tons of places that humans should not live but for some stupid reason, we choose to try. When you spend a part of your life shoveling snow because you "like the view" every day, that makes 0 sense to me. Definately not worth it.. Fly in. visit.. leave. but dont live in that kind of environment.

I dont like the Hurricanes but I dont really have any problems with water and no Hurricane has destoryed any our homes so for me, maybe we are lucky or maybe its just how it is in my world.

To each his or her own. I wont stop people from helping the "world" but I certainly wont be "pitching in". I do my thing. I dont throw things out the windows. I have even chased down wrappers taken out of my hand by the wind. but once its in the trash can, its definately not my problem.

Maybe you should contact the landfils and waste management companies and get them overhauled.. Its really them that have cause any issue here in the US.. but as for the oceans.. Last I checked, there have been quite a few natural disasters where water has swept through civilized locations and taken almost everything it touched back out to sea.. so, maybe, just maybe, a lot of this "trash" was actually swept out because of a natural disaster.. OMG.. Could that be a cause as well? Then maybe we need to stop all natural disasters..

Being realistic works for me. Keeps food on the table, and the family happy. We travel and learn daily. At the end of the day, we sleep well.

You choose how to live your own life. Thats fine. Its all any of us can do. Some choose to devote their lives to saving "humanity". I dont think its within any humans power to do so. Perspective is everything.