Out of air emergency at 105 feet

[nuts4corals]

I think you did just fine. I wasn't criticizing you, I was making a general statement for those asserting that the theoretically-correct answer was to skip the safey stop. A dive master is supposed to be in charge, and when he directs you to skip the safety stop, I can see how that's what most people would do.

I understand that it's a stressful situation. I have been OOA at depth from an uncontrollable free-flow when I was a new diver.

It's important to remember that once everyone has got a regulator in their mouth and they're breathing again, the emergency is over. Relax, take a deep breath, and get to the surface in a safe, controlled manner. There's no reason to omit a safety stop when coming up from 100 feet if you've the gas to make the stop.

I highly recommend the book "Deco for Divers," as mentioned above. The data on bubbles and safety stops is quite interesting. Even during no-deco dives, a controlled ascent rate and safety stops are important to prevent bubble formation and DCI.

I know you weren't critisizing me and even if you were that would be ok because I'm here to learn as much as I can always. I think your point though is well made and believe me if I had the choice to do the safety stop, I would. But as many have mentioned here that changes when you have a panicked diver in tow... I wish that everyone would listen to your advice about relaxing once you start to get air. i would imagine thats a hard thing to do though. It must be a scary thing to have happen. i think the real issue that most of the great suggestions that people made here is that given this particular situation, when you have another diver who is either panicked or has some other issue... do you risk his life and yours struggling at 20 feet for a safety stop or do you take him to the surface and ensure his safety and probably yours too. I don't thing that anyone is suggesting that we skip safety stops or skip it on an emergency (air permitting). The real question is at what point do you waive off the safety stop and go top side or abandon your OOA diver? This is a hard question to answer because every situation may be differant but for me under these circumstances I chose to take him to the surface as I really didn't think that the emergency was over for this guy after he got air.

 

[nuts4corals]

I posted some info. in my profile for those interested. Someone asked me to do it and just got around to it.

 

[DandyDon]

this was my 11th dive for the week... I dove every morning twice (repetative dive). As I understood it and my computer showed it that Nitrogen loading was zero by the next morning. Can you explain what you mean? Is there residual nitrogen that our computers dont indicate? Or is this statement purely a safety minded one. Thanks

Two air dives a day doesn't add up much, but yeah some that the puter won't show - other than this reflection...

N4C your computer probably showed no nitrogen but I bet if you looked at your No-Fly-Time it would still be counting down. So while you were probably pretty clean N2 wise there was still some residual N2 in your system.

 

[drdaddy]

I posted some info. in my profile for those interested. Someone asked me to do it and just got around to it.

Thank you for this post. It really helped me think through "what would I do". You are probably right - taking along your own equipment, which you are experienced operating, does set you apart from other vacation divers. Your quality scuba set would be noticed by any experienced diver, and can even make someone think that you know what you are doing.

Thanks for the update of your profile.

 

[Walter]

You've got to remember that once you donate your octo and the OOA diver is breathing fine, the emergency is over.

The emergency is over only when both divers are calm and comfortable. Unless both divers are calm and comfortable there is an emergency.

 

[Alucard]

I really want to thank the OP and all others who have contributed to this thread. I think there are some really valuable lessons to be picked up here, and reading this has helped my understanding and thinking about what I would do in a similar situation. hte idea of saving someone's life is a huge thing, and I congratulate the OP for kepeing a cool head and making sound decisions. I hope that I am that calm when and if a similar thing happens to me.

I have a question, though - if you are in an OOA where you are helping someone and have them on your Octo, how do you know for sure that the emergency is over? How do you know that they don't have some other condition that isn't visible to you that makes it imperative for him to get to the surface and require your help once they get there?

I think in a situation where the person is communicating well (or as well as possible underwater) and does the shaky hand, then points at their head, chest, whatever, it's a clear indication that something is wrong, but if they are wide-eyed and just not communicating, but determined to get to the surface, then I think that I would assume that there was something else wrong other than the OOA and go with them. I would stay with them until they were back on the boat, too, assuming that the emergency wasn't over. But this is from someone with under 100 dives, so I wpould like to hear opinions from more experienced divers.

 

[Walter]

Alucard, you pretty much nailed it.

 

[Web Monkey]

I have a question, though - if you are in an OOA where you are helping someone and have them on your Octo, how do you know for sure that the emergency is over?

The emergency is over when the victim is sitting on the boat being taken care of by someone else. My personal rule is to never allow anybody more than one chance to kill themselves on any dive.

If someone has messed up badly enough to need rescuing, you can't count on them making good decisions.

I think in a situation where the person is communicating well (or as well as possible underwater) and does the shaky hand, then points at their head, chest, whatever, it's a clear indication that something is wrong, but if they are wide-eyed and just not communicating, but determined to get to the surface, then I think that I would assume that there was something else wrong other than the OOA and go with them. I would stay with them until they were back on the boat, too, assuming that the emergency wasn't over. But this is from someone with under 100 dives, so I wpould like to hear opinions from more experienced divers.

The reasons might be nice to know, but the response is the same.

You and the victim share air if necessary, ascend safely and return to the boat/exit point.

Terry

 

[TSandM]

"Once you have gas, the emergency is over." This is really for the benefit of the OOG diver, who should realize that, once he has gas, the two of them have time to get settled and proceed with a controlled, calm ascent. In practice, I would doubt that many people who run out of gas simmer down that fast, which is one of the reasons why "rock bottom" (the reserve gas you need to carry to get you and your buddy to the surface, making all appropriate stops) is calculated using a stressed gas consumption rate.

For the donor, the emergency is over when the OOG diver is rational and calm, but that may well not be until they are on the boat. Part of being a rescuer is continuous assessment of the situation, and changing strategy based on how things are evolving.

 

[nuts4corals]

I really want to thank the OP and all others who have contributed to this thread. I think there are some really valuable lessons to be picked up here, and reading this has helped my understanding and thinking about what I would do in a similar situation. hte idea of saving someone's life is a huge thing, and I congratulate the OP for kepeing a cool head and making sound decisions. I hope that I am that calm when and if a similar thing happens to me.

I have a question, though - if you are in an OOA where you are helping someone and have them on your Octo, how do you know for sure that the emergency is over? How do you know that they don't have some other condition that isn't visible to you that makes it imperative for him to get to the surface and require your help once they get there?

I think in a situation where the person is communicating well (or as well as possible underwater) and does the shaky hand, then points at their head, chest, whatever, it's a clear indication that something is wrong, but if they are wide-eyed and just not communicating, but determined to get to the surface, then I think that I would assume that there was something else wrong other than the OOA and go with them. I would stay with them until they were back on the boat, too, assuming that the emergency wasn't over. But this is from someone with under 100 dives, so I would like to hear opinions from more experienced divers.

Like you I'm not as expierienced as others on this board but i can tell you what my assesment of the situation has tought me...

How do you know the emergency is over... Believe me you'd know. that is if you (the rescuer) is calm enough to notice and pay attention to the victims body language. for example, my OOA DM was panicked at first prior to receiving air and than i felt he simmered down as he was responding to an all OK ect. even on our ascent to the surface he was ascending slowly until 40 feet where he started to fin harder I knew it because his thigh was at my shoulders and he was looking straight up to the surface and not responding to me even when i was jerking down on his arm. When we got to 20 feet and he finally looked down to me he had similar fearful eyes and when he waived off his safety stop p he didn't even bother to wait to see what I was going to do and started finning to the surface again.

i think a guy who is as calm and collected after receiving air on an emergency would be making regular eye contact, responding to signs, communicating intension and most importantly acting rationally.

The real question is as a rescuer you must be able to calm the individual as much as possible or that person can turn one emergency into two.