Old steels denied fills due to store "policy"

[JackD342]

But they shouldn't be. It frustrates the heck out of me that any Eddy Current (EFD) "defects" have to be confirmed by Vis.

This is clearly because the equipment, procedure and perhaps training aren't fit for purpose.

Aluminum is the most receptive material for Eddy Current inspection, that because the defect signal differ so widely. We call it phase separation. Simply put different defect signals appear at different clock positions around a circle. A Natural defect (crack) will have a very tight signal, whereas a mechanical defect will almost have 2 lines because it's so "wide"

EFD can also spot sub surface defects and corrosion too. Why the visual plus system was accepted is beyond me. It's junk

I have never understood how I can confirm a subsurface crack visually. I will clean the threads again, repeat test, clean again, and repeat again before making a final determination.

 

[Just Anthony]

Dive stores set their own "policies". Mostly out of voo-doo and superstition.

I've heard it all over 20 years of diving.
The best one was, "I can't visually inspect your cylinder that was hydro'd last year. You must have your cylinder re-hydro'd if you have painted it [since the last hydro] cause it's the law."

Shop in Key Largo wouldn't fill our cylinders with nitrox because some of the guys didn't have nitrox stickers on them.
Their shop, their policy, I guess.

 

[Rred]

A nitrox sticker just means "We're too cheap to use premix, so we want you to have oxygen-cleaned tanks so we can hot shot your tanks."
Yeah, it is that simple, For most shops having 32 and 36 on hand, or just having 32 on hand, would be enough. Worry about oxygen cleaned tanks only if you're going to offer custom fills.

For shops with a surprise policy, like saying "We're not gonna fill that tank because the last hydro was done in a month that didn't end in an "R" "....a basic competent manager would say to the customer "Our policy won't let us fill this, but we don't want to ruin your dive, either. So we can let you have a rental tank, for just the price of the fill. Just this once..."

You can have oddball policies--and still show the customer some respect.

 

[agadiver78]

no text

 

[captain]

Like @broncobowsher I'll play devils advocate and be unpopular at the same time

The issue with cylinders, is that there is no real record of their history. Vis inspection is almost comical and incredible subjective requiring minimal training (I use the word training in the loosest possible sense). Hyro is only a go/no go based on the elastic properties of the material. It's good enough most of the time - but as you get to the extremes of age it becomes less so.

With a Steel tank (especially) you have no proof of history - even if you're the original owner. The shop has no idea if you've tumbled the tank on numerous occasions or used abrasives on the external faces to remove corrosion. They have no way to assess if the wall thickness of the tank is within limits.

You could easily do this with a simple ultrasonic inspection - but shops don't have the expertise. The time and effort to "re-cert" a tank would be more than the tank

At some point you need to accept that equipment has a finite life. 48 and 49 years of age is getting pretty much past it, So I can understand a shops reticence. Given the cost of diving new Tanks are small beer. Replace them I say.

One word, bull.

 

[Diving Dubai]

One word, bull.

I'm overwhelmed by the intelligence of your contribution

 

[Graeme Fraser]

Wow! To think, I recently recommended Force-E to someone. If they're hiring tank fill guys of this caliber, clearly they've gone downhill recently.

It's a shame.


OK, you've piqued my curiosity. I've heard of "flat earthers" before, but what is an anti-vaxxer? Personally, I like flat earthers. Any time you're in a bad mood, just look up a youtube video posted by one of those nutjobs. It's sure to put a grin on your face. Jerry Seinfeld couldn't have come up with a better comedy routine.

Is it someone who doesn't like vacuum cleaners?

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[MrVegas]

Thought of this thread -- I just had a 1962 LP72 tank hydro'd. It passed VIP, and I dove it yesterday. (It has the tapered threads -- Healthways, I think.)

 

[drbill]

My God... if it passes hydro and VIP, I don't understand their policy. I have tanks from the early 60s to the mid-70s. The only ones newer than thata re my pony bottles.

 

[OkByMe]

OLD steel SCUBA tanks [DOT 3A and 3AA] DO NOT have a "shelf life" that is only applicable to this: CFR 49/180.205

(v) For a DOT 3HT cylinder -

(A) The pressure test yields an elastic expansion exceeding the marked rejection elastic expansion (REE) value.

(B) The cylinder shows evidence of denting or bulging.

(C) The cylinder bears a manufacture or an original test date older than twenty-four years or after 4380 pressurizations, whichever occurs first. If a cylinder is refilled, on average, more than once every other day, an accurate record of the number of recharges must be maintained by the cylinder owner or the owner's agent.