Octo

[oldmossback]

I'd like to throw a screwdriver.....or big wrench into this (depends on your point of view I guess)
Vintage diving to me is using equipment from the 50-70's era's along with the diving styles of that time.......ie: minimual equipment, or homemade equip.

To me adding anything to the vintage equipment or style that is modern or used today by the general diving public would denote diving with classical equipment and modified techniques.......modern diving of course could include all the crap used today.......

Some here dive with modified vintage equipment of some sort..........yes, I would say they are not vintage diving......probably some hybrid name such as the fore amentioned Classical.....but then there will be those who disagree.........

As for the octo, I submit that it was developed to solve issues that cropped up with vintage equipment of the era toward the end of that era.....it is not true vintage in the truest sense of the word, but was developed in part for safety reasons, although not a great solution, it does work in some situations.......and dive operators get a false sense of security, with everyone equiped.

While Voit was the actual first to develop their last DH with LP/HP ports, they lost their way.
Luis Hero's and, to a lesser degree, my own development of modified 1st stages for the RAM's changed the game for doublehose diving.........bringing it into the modern realm and contributing a lot to making DH regs acceptable to modern dive operations........and then again, modified techniques have been and will have to be established for modern divers who are accustomed to current gear and training.......and "oh, guess what?".....the octo will be there in this mix........

I guess you could say, the Octo is both late vintage (as it apparently sprouted up toward the end of the vintage era and answered some issues for vintage) and modern for the foreseeable future...........with both single and double hoses..........it's a bridge that spans the two era's.

 

[Wayward Son]

I think that's a fair assessment. While not commonly in use, I recall seeing them in at least some catalogs back around 1972 - 73.

As I recall, they were originally developed by divers who needed better ways to share air, primarily cave & wreck divers. Regs were modified in private shops to allow screwing a hose into them. Later manufacturers started making regs with ports to accommodate them.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

With the input by OldMossback, I'm going to provide a bit more perspective to this discussion of the octopus regulator and buddy breathing. These will be in two different posts, as each should stand on its own.

When I took my NAUI ITC (Instructor Training Course) in 1973, Dennis Graver* was the Course Director. I got to know Dennis pretty well in that time (it was a full week, as I recall). Dennis had his own opinions, and gave us several sheets on various topics. These topics included Night Diving Techniques, What did you get? - A President's Plea, (about spearfishing and conservation), Diver's Spare Pacts Kit, Diving Safety, Reflections of a Snorkel Diver, Equipment Compression Problems, The Versatile Speargun, Waves and Surf, and Buddy Breathing--Friend or Foe. Here is that later paper:

BUDDY BREATHING - FRIEND OR FOE
BY Dennis Graver

A number of double drownings and situations in which a rescuer has become the victim gives cause for studying the exercise of buddy breathing. This skill, learned in all basic classes, is seldom completely mastered, and then almost totally unpracticed by most sport divers. Complicating this is the fact that buddy breathing is taught differently by various instructors, i.e., tandem, face-to-face, different signals, etc.

The inherent danger of the skill is that during a buddy breathing ascent one diver must hold his breath. This can, of coures, produce an air embolism or other malady. Under ordinary conditions, an experienced diver would probably never forget the important law of exhaling during ascent, but in a stress situation he may be too involved. Also, while buddy breathing, the divers usually look at each other or the regulator and are unaware of their surroundings or their rate of ascent. Let's further discuss the potential dangers: Buddy breathing in an emergency is usually initiated between two people who, seldom if ever, have practiced the skill together. It is typically begun at the end of a fairly deep dive - when the buddy has second thoughts about a swimming ascent. Here are two divers, cold and numb. They usually use the same size tank - if one tank is empty, the other should be close to it. They get arms crossed; confused; masks leak; the donor gives his regulator to the victim; neck straps, if used, won't unsnap; too long and to many breaths are taken..... We are getting closer and closer to a panic situation for one or both divers.

Perhaps the sport diver should limit his underwater activities to the depth from which he can make an emergency swimming ascent. Pony bottles, octopus rigs, and submersible pressure gauges are fine to use to avoid a possible hazardous situation.

But what if one must buddy breathe? Is there a safe way? Yes, if practiced in a pool by two divers frequently, it can be safe if you remember the following tips:

1. Signaling - be sure you know when your buddy needs air. The forefinger drawn across the throat is a widely accepted signal.

2. Donating - The donor always keeps the regulator. One person is in danger since he has no air supply. If the donor gives away his regulator, he is in danger. Hold the regulator in our right hand, graps your buddy's harness with your left hand, and allow him to guide the mouthpiece.

3. Rythm - It is important not to begin ascending immediately. Stay right where you are long enough to become calm and establish a rhythm before you compound the difficulty by swimming.

4. Taking Breaths - Two medium, quick breaths, with the emphasis on exhaling, are preferred. Also, it is not necessary to put the mouthpiece inside your mouth. By pursing your lips and pushing the mouthpiece against them, a good seal can be made. This speeds up the exercise.

5. Neck Straps - A real hazard, neck straps should be discarded. Several magazine articles have pointed this out. They are forgotten until the instant when the owner must donate, they cannot be easily unsnapped, the strap gets in the way as the regulator is passed, etc.

The secret then to successful buddy breathing lies first in avoiding a situation which could require it. Additional equipment is also a valuable asset. Most of all, buddy breathing must be studied and practiced regularly by buddy teams.

I would add to that a few more:

John Ratliff additions to Buddy Breathing - Friend or Foe for Double Hose Divers
6. Double hose regulators present special problems for Buddy Breathing. When swimming or practicing horizontally (such as swimming out of a wreck or cave, or in a swimming pool practicing), the donor must be on the left side of the buddy pair to maintain the mouthpiece with the exhaust hose down. When ascending, clearing the mouthpiece can easily be accomplished by slightly raising the regulator to free-flow the mouthpiece (when it gets over the height of the regulator), and then placing it in your or your buddy's mouth. If not possible (tank mounted too high, for instance, then tilting the head to the left, so the exhalation side of the mouthpiece is down, is important in clearing the regulator.

7. Do not depend upon the non-return valves in the mouthpiece. Some advanced double hose regulator divers routinely remove the inhalation valve for better regulator performance (myself included with some regulators). Sometimes, neither the inhalation nor the exhalation valve is present (DX Overpressure Breathing regulator has a metal mouthpiece, and the La Spiro Mistral sometimes also has a "Professional Mouthpiece" which is metal and without non-returns). With these cases, the water may flow back from the exhalation hose into the mouthpiece. Also, some non-return valves (especially neoprene ones) may be damaged and nonfunctional. This can occur quickly in hot, humid environments. Learn to clear these hose-mouthpiece systems by rolling to the left side in a complete circle. When buddy breathing, this must be coordinated and practiced.

Now, for those purist vintage divers who do not dive solo, I would advise getting in the pool with your buddy and practicing, particularly in winter when there is no good diving, this buddy breathing technique.

I will continue my practice of only using a scuba with an octo or second regulator capability when buddy diving, even when "vintage" diving with a double hose regulator. My buddy's safety is more important than being a purist vintage diver. OldMossback, I like that word "Classical" diving.

SeaRat
NAUI #2710 (retired)

*Dennis Graver was Project Manager at NAUI, and also the National Training Director of PADI for a while in the 1970s.

 

[John C. Ratliff]

Here is the second paper:

ARE CURRENT CERTIFICATION COURSES REALLY ADEQUATE FOR TODAY'S STUDENTS?
by Bret C. Gilliam

ABSTRACT -- This paper will examine several case histories of traveling sport divers of varying experience levels. Areas of training deficiencies will be identified and suggestions of ways of improvement in basic and/or advanced willbe offered. Areas of positive improvement in teaching methods will be detailed. Recommendaitons for minimum equipment standards and training in its use will be detailed extensiely. An overall follow-up to my persentation at IQ8 will show improvement in several areas of student diver performance and attitude. Itappears that training for basic students is improving in many areas and turning out a more well-rounded and competent diver.
_______________________

Last year as speaker at IQ8 in San Diego, I was very critical of the quality of sport divers that were appearing in the Caribbean as recently certified vacationers. We were experiencing divers that could not swim, did not fully understand most theory in relation to physics and physiology, were improperly equipped, and many with an infuriating disregard for local marine resource and ecological conservation policies. Things had reached such a state that we had actually canceled a group of divers in mid-week for varying combinations of the previously cited "problems".

This year I am happy to report that the overall quality of the divers that we are coming into contact with is markedly improved. The transformation is startling when one considers that only twelve months have passed since the average diver that we handled was rated "inadequately qualified" by our staff. This past season the ratings have improved to the point that at least 60% of our divers can be rated as "adequately qualified".

Why the change? We can'tbe certain but attribute it largely to popularization and consumer demand for more open water training in the basic class. This season's new divers are definitely better acquainted with surface swimming and watermanship skills. They are more confident and consequently more self-sufficient in situations that in the past would have required "hands on" assistance from a dive supervisor. In short, today's student are simply not fouling up as often or as seriously as those a year ago. It has to be because they are proportionately more experienced through their expanded basic training and are making their mistakes in basic class where the instructor has the chance to observe and correct them. Last year the newly certified divers were making serious mistakes of judgement and watermanship due to a large degree that they had not been exposed to adequate open water training under supervision.

One other area of training that seems to be on the improved level is the counseling of basic students in regard to practical equipment selection. Finally we are seeing the great majority of divirs with submersible pressure gauges attached to their regulators. The number of divers still using "safety CO2 vests" is waning with the modern buoyancy compensators gaining widespread favor and use. This alone is a major breakthrough since a large percentage of problems in the past could be directly traced to insufficient buoyancy control apparatus and related training in the proper use of such devices. Many of the false criticisms of back mounted bc systems are being exposed and discarded as these designs gain steadily in popularity. One of the biggest supporters of change intheindustry has been SKINDIVER magazin's Poul Tzimoulis and his hardline editorials stressing the urgency for instructors to adopt submersible pressure gauges, proper bc use, nd octopus equipment.

While the use of octopus units still remains the subject of hotly contested debate within national instructional agencies, the overwhelming majority of professional diving instructor/guides have embracedthe octopus as a vital and indispensable unit. Let's remember that it took NAUI until 1976 to adopt even the mildest recommendation for the use of submersible pressure gauges; change is sometimes not so slow in coming as is the official recognition of that change.

We still find that most divers forget most of what they learned in their basic classes pertaining to physics and physiology but the majority of them have retained the basic concepts as it relates to tehir use. For example, they may not be able to explain quite why a lung overpressure might occur in flowing technical jargon, but they do know emphatically not to hold their breath on ascent. Most of them can follow the tables well enough to avoid decompression problems and Isuppose that we must count these minor achievements as a success. We still need expanded teaching in emergency first ain, mouth to mouth, and cardiac massage but most goodinstructors do seem to be making corrections along these lines...

...But I must interject one note of discord. They changes as noted have taken place more or less on the initiative of the individual instructor making decisions for himself. The leadership for dramatic change and recognition of new concepts has not come from within the hierarchy of the national certification agencies who are still overly concerned with competition amongst themselves and the paranoid fear of offending members who would not support changes in training methods, even such change as is clearly called for.

Next year I sencerely hope that we will see a new and vigorous leadership emerge to implement policy as needed, not as convenient.
Gilliam, Bret C., "Are Current Certification Courses Really Adequate for Today's Students," IQ9--Proceedings of the Ninth International Conference on Underwater Education,, Sponsored by The National Association of Underwater Instructors, 1976, pages 88-90

This, to me, shows that this equipment revolution for both BCs and octopus regulators came about the middle of the 1970s. It came differently to different regions, and diver populations. I had the advantage of attending several of these conferences, and speaking on buoyancy compensation, life vests, etc., in an attempt (apparently successful--lots of other people pushing too) to move divers toward systems that allowed divers to be more comfortable and controlled in the water. So my view on "vintage" may be skewed a bit because of this effort; but it was in answer to problems that "vintage" diving presented which were costing divers their lives.

SeaRat
NAUI #2710 (Retired)