Nord Stream Pipeline Video

[admikar]

Looking at the results of the explosion, posted on ScubaBoard and elsewhere, it appears to be a pipeline pig explosion from inside the pipeline.

How you accomplish that if there is no flow?

Russia had no problem with a third world Kleptocracy on it's border, it was a Russia aligned kleptocracy. The Ukrainians had other ideas and voted out the massively corrupt government and elected TV comic. Russia has already invaded two other former republics and had a low level war with Ukraine since 2014. I wouldn't say US expansionism is the central cause of Russia invading Ukraine. The Ukrainians don't want to be part of Russia and with good reason. The Russians have a long history of genocide in Ukraine.

If you think current Ukrainian government is not corrupt, I have a nice estate to sell you near Pripyat.
Zelenski has closed media that was criticizing him. We still need to see what was happening within that deal between Bidens and Ukraine. Only in last year or so, they actually did something about corruption.
Yes, Russians did harm Ukraine, but that was during Stallin era. Which a lot of Ukrainians paid back during WW2. You might want to think about how much of modern Ukraine is actually built with Russian help (or, technically, USSR help).

Mexico has lots of issues with crime, drugs and corruption and the US has not invaded in the last hundred years (Trump did talk about it a couple of times).

Are you really going to try and evade it like this? MidOH didn't say that USA would invade Mexico over their crime levels, but that USA would comsider it as a threat if Russians used it to launder money.
As much as West would like to have only one reason that can be used to blame Russia for invasion, truth is that there is a multitude of reasons they invaded. How good those reasons are, I have no idea.

 

[Vicko]

I find it interesting that in peoples mind US invading sovereign nations somehow gives other nations the right to not only invade but genocide others.
I just hope none of you have to live in a country that is currently being bombarded and worry for months not knowing if you cousins ended up in shallow grave or not just because they spoke the wrong language.

 

[CT-Rich]

OMG, please spare me the CNN's talking points. Just do me a favor, understand, that there is no such thing as a unified mass of Ukrainians who all think collectively in unison. Some are pro-Western, some are pro-Russian, some do not give a damn. Instead of lecturing me on Russian history, try to read Paul Pillar's Why America Misunderstands The World, maybe you'll learn something.

The Ukrainians voted overwhelmingly to leave the Soviet Union.

1991 Ukrainian independence referendum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Even 55% of the ethnic Russians wanted out. Yes some people would have been pro-russian, some not give a damn. Once the bombs start falling, people usually pick a side. The Russians are sh*tty friends to have. The only country that ever invaded the Warsaw Pact was the USSR.

Russia has had a hand in Ukrainian Kleptocracy. When Victor Yanukovych (the guy who hired Paul Manafort) fled, where did he run? Moscow. I am not saying Ukraine is some garden spot of democracy. But, they certainly seemed to have had enough of Putin and Russia. Zelenski has made moves against corruption. We won't know if they are serious about it for sometime, but the people doing the fight there are probably not going to be super tolerant of business as usual when it comes to rebuilding Ukraine. And Western dollars are not likely to be flowing if it stays a blackhole of corruption.

By the way, if you think people just forget about a mass genocide that happened in the 1930s and little mistakes like Chernobyl are not going to hold a grudge or at least form a lot term hatred. you will never understand the BLM movement..

 

[tech_diver]

OMG, please spare me the CNN's talking points. Just do me a favor, understand, that there is no such thing as a unified mass of Ukrainians who all think collectively in unison. Some are pro-Western, some are pro-Russian, some do not give a damn. Instead of lecturing me on Russian history, try to read Paul Pillar's Why America Misunderstands The World, maybe you'll learn something.

Many Ukrainians take pride in a history going back centuries before Russia. If they wanted to be part of Russia they would have joined long ago.

The invasion of Ukraine is not about a small European country run by a Jewish comedy actor being a Naxi threat to an entire continent. Even most Russians know this isn't true. This is about Putin reconstituting the Soviet Union, making Russia great again.. Trump gave them Crimea and wanted to give them Ukraine, Moldova is next. The people of Estonia and Latvia know they are also targeted. Europe does not want to fall to the Soviet Union.
The Republicans are supporting Russia's expansion in Europe because Russia will support them in the next election.

Venezuela used to be an American ally but they are now a Russian nation state. Russia took over Venezuela with no missiles, bullets or soldiers. They flooded the national medias with divisive disinformation and got their public to elect a bunch of corrupt Pro-Russia politicians who changed the laws so it will be hard to un-elect them. The same thing is happening here.

Spare me the Putin talking points. I don't watch CNN. But if you enjoy Fox Broadcasting you can now watch Tucker Carlson's videos on Russia's state media, RT.ru.

 

[admikar]

I find it interesting that in peoples mind US invading sovereign nations somehow gives other nations the right to not only invade but genocide others.
I just hope none of you have to live in a country that is currently being bombarded and worry for months not knowing if you cousins ended up in shallow grave or not just because they spoke the wrong language.

No one said Russia is doing the right thing. What some of us don't like is imaginary high moral position some of Western people show here.
Remember, this thread is about blown up pipeline. Some of Americans are adamant that Russians did it, even though the only reason "why?" that they can produce is "because they are Russians".

 

[Manatee Diver]

Trump gave them Crimea

You do realize that happened during the Obama Administration? And that the Russian had controlled the region for 3 years before Trump entered office. Sure he could've fought it harder, but at that point what done was done.

 

[tarponchik]

The Ukrainians voted overwhelmingly to leave the Soviet Union.

1991 Ukrainian independence referendum - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Even 55% of the ethnic Russians wanted out. Yes some people would have been pro-russian, some not give a damn. Once the bombs start falling, people usually pick a side. The Russians are sh*tty friends to have. The only country that ever invaded the Warsaw Pact was the USSR.

Russia has had a hand in Ukrainian Kleptocracy. When Victor Yanukovych (the guy who hired Paul Manafort) fled, where did he run? Moscow. I am not saying Ukraine is some garden spot of democracy. But, they certainly seemed to have had enough of Putin and Russia. Zelenski has made moves against corruption. We won't know if they are serious about it for sometime, but the people doing the fight there are probably not going to be super tolerant of business as usual when it comes to rebuilding Ukraine. And Western dollars are not likely to be flowing if it stays a blackhole of corruption.

By the way, if you think people just forget about a mass genocide that happened in the 1930s and little mistakes like Chernobyl are not going to hold a grudge or at least form a lot term hatred. you will never understand the BLM movement..

Sure, they voted out because they were promised prosperity. The slogan of the day was "Enough of feeding Moscow!" They had no clue they'd end up feeding their own brand of oligarchs. And then the Western Ukrainians began to take their daily life over, refusing to grant Russian language any room. So the central government refused to grant any autonomy for Crimea and the Eastern districts that are predominantly Russian speaking and this eventually lead to break-up of the country. I understand why California is friendly to Spanish language but if Californians were forced to use Spanish in all documents and to speak Spanish only in places like McDonald's and public libraries, you'll get a riot.
As for the hunger of the 1932-3, this was not a "genocide" because the South of Russia also suffered, in the Kuban', Rostov and Stavropol area where about 20% of the excessive deaths were encountered, by estimates.

 

[tarponchik]

Many Ukrainians take pride in a history going back centuries before Russia. If they wanted to be part of Russia they would have joined long ago.

The invasion of Ukraine is not about a small European country run by a Jewish comedy actor being a Naxi threat to an entire continent. Even most Russians know this isn't true. This is about Putin reconstituting the Soviet Union, making Russia great again.. Trump gave them Crimea and wanted to give them Ukraine, Moldova is next. The people of Estonia and Latvia know they are also targeted. Europe does not want to fall to the Soviet Union.
The Republicans are supporting Russia's expansion in Europe because Russia will support them in the next election.

Venezuela used to be an American ally but they are now a Russian nation state. Russia took over Venezuela with no missiles, bullets or soldiers. They flooded the national medias with divisive disinformation and got their public to elect a bunch of corrupt Pro-Russia politicians who changed the laws so it will be hard to un-elect them. The same thing is happening here.

Spare me the Putin talking points. I don't watch CNN. But if you enjoy Fox Broadcasting you can now watch Tucker Carlson's videos on Russia's state media, RT.ru.

Most of Ukraine's history has been invented in modern times. They use a simple trick of counting everyone who ever lived within the borders of modern Ukraine as a "Ukrainian", though many of such characters would disagree. Mazeppa, one of the heroes in modern Ukraine, was a Russian-speaking Cossack, and if you called him a "Ukrainian" he would likely take this as an insult and chop you to pieces with his sable.

That Putin wants to rebuilt Soviet Union is another myth. If he did, he'd start with Middle Asian Snackistans and Caucasus. These countries are out for grabs, but Putin is doing nothing, watching passively as China's and Turkey's influence there grows day by day. I've been watching Putin since his 1st day in office and it is obvious for me that he is not an active player but a retroactive one. He reacts to threats when they come but he never had any major goals or master plans.

 

[HalcyonDaze]

I'm not so sure the US did that deed, but that is the type of mission the Carter was built to accomplish. As for threading the needle, it's been done before.

That's a really small needle. By my count (I was bored at work today) there are five sea routes into the Baltic. I think we can rule out the Kiel Canal, the Little Belt, and Copenhagen itself as submerged transit routes right off the bat. That leaves the Øresund and Great Belt, both of which have tunnel/suspension bridge crossings. Looking online, max vessel draft under those bridges is 17-18 meters. Going to file that under "nope."

Just as a note folks, I suspect the mods are looking on this thread; keeping a lid on the political whataboutism is probably wise to avoid it being locked.

 

[Bob DBF]

That's a really small needle. By my count (I was bored at work today) there are five sea routes into the Baltic. I think we can rule out the Kiel Canal, the Little Belt, and Copenhagen itself as submerged transit routes right off the bat. That leaves the Øresund and Great Belt, both of which have tunnel/suspension bridge crossings. Looking online, max vessel draft under those bridges is 17-18 meters. Going to file that under "nope."

Just as a note folks, I suspect the mods are looking on this thread; keeping a lid on the political whataboutism is probably wise to avoid it being locked.

I wasn’t that bored so I was only looking around the pipeline, didn’t think about getting there, won’t make that mistake again. Getting to look more like local talent, or an inside job.