No solo diving in overhead environment

[Foxfish]

I'm asking people to respond to post #80 thanks Bob.

 

[tstormdiver]

OK to answer the questions you wanted specifically:

A. Did you do an industry recognized training course for diving in overhead environments.

No. Not yet. I am a full cave diver. I am in the process of gaining the knowledge & experience needed to go the cave instructor rout... However I am an SDI Solo Diver Instructor (also an SSI AOWI).

B. What was the course title and what was the teaching agency.

I am a IANTD Cavern & Intro to cave diver, A TDI full cave diver, An SSI AOWI & an SDI OWI & solo diver instructor

C. Did the course book state one of its intended aims was to train to you to dive solo in an overhead environment.

NO. SDI (geared towards recreational diving) tries to steer the recreational student away from such activities. TDI in a round about way recommends self sufficiency (some translate to solo) within a team & that the decision must be made by the prepared, trained & equipped diver.

 

[BDSC]

No. Not yet. I am a full cave diver.

OK. I'm confused. If you are a fully certified cave diver, then doesn't that mean you have taken a course for diving in overhead environments?

 

[Jim Lapenta]

There are other threads on the pro's and con's of diving solo in an overhead environment. Evidently there are a number of divers on this forum who dive solo in overhead environments. I'm interested to find out the position the teaching agencies have taken on this matter. To that end:

A. Did you do an industry recognized training course for diving in overhead environments.

B. What was the course title and what was the teaching agency.

C. Did the course book state one of its intended aims was to train to you to dive solo in an overhead environment.

A. Yes
B. Ice with Scuba Educators International, Helitrox with Decompression (theoretical overhead) through NAUI tech
c. No, absolutely not. In fact the course was based on a team with full surface support for ice. The NAUI Class was based on team diving and never recommended solo deco dives. Even though I have done them as well as solo wreck penetration.

As for me I am an SEI Instructor, CMAS 2 star Instructor, and SDI/TDI Instructor.

 

[fsardone]

I do not have a solo certification.

I have done solo cave dives. Is that wrong?

I am not solo certified (I will be soon,but that is another story) but I did train and I have the skills. The card is for insurance coverage and to prove to a 3rd party you know how to do it and relief them from liability if they rent you equipment or bring you to a site or allow you on a site solo.
Fact is for half of my diving life I did not even have a OW certification and I was deep diving, but I was diving from my father's boat, using my own equipment and compressor. My father never got any certification (he died of hearth failure in his bed after I do not know how many dives we did not log at that time ...).

Bottom line: it is the training skills and planning (including equipment) not the card that will keep you alive.

Cheers
Fabio

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

There are other threads on the pro's and con's of diving solo in an overhead environment. Evidently there are a number of divers on this forum who dive solo in overhead environments. I'm interested to find out the position the teaching agencies have taken on this matter. To that end:

A. Did you do an industry recognized training course for diving in overhead environments.

B. What was the course title and what was the teaching agency.

C. Did the course book state one of its intended aims was to train to you to dive solo in an overhead environment.

A. Yes
B. TDI - Advanced Nitrox, Decompression Procedures; NAUI - Decompression Techniques, Trimix I, Trimix II, Wreck Penetration; NSS-CDS - Basic Cave, Apprentice Cave, Full Cave
C. None of them take a position on solo diving, either for or against ... while some of those courses taught you emergency procedures based on having a dive buddy, most of them also taught you techniques for self-rescue.

At this level of diving you no longer rely on an agency to tell you what to do ... you are expected to be competent to make your own decisions about how to do the dive.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[tstormdiver]

OK. I'm confused. If you are a fully certified cave diver, then doesn't that mean you have taken a course for diving in overhead environments?

My bad,... I misread it. Thought it asked if I were an instructor for an agency teaching overhead environments.

 

[Foxfish]

Thanks people. I think the picture is starting to become clearer.

---------- Post added February 3rd, 2014 at 09:35 AM ----------

I found this presentation from Steve Lewis. If you scroll through it you will again find the statement that SDI/TDI do not recommend solo diving in the areas I previously described out of the book regardless even if a person has technical training in those areas. As stated in the presentation, that is why the solo course is taught by SDI and not TDI.

http://www.tdisdi.com/UserFiles/SoloPresentation.pdf

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Thanks people. I think the picture is starting to become clearer.

---------- Post added February 3rd, 2014 at 09:35 AM ----------

I found this presentation from Steve Lewis. If you scroll through it you will again find the statement that SDI/TDI do not [-]recommend [/-] SANCTION solo diving in the areas I previously described out of the book regardless even if a person has technical training in those areas. As stated in the presentation, that is why the solo course is taught by SDI and not TDI.

http://www.tdisdi.com/UserFiles/SoloPresentation.pdf

(sigh) ... fixed it for you.

I think you should try to comprehend the difference between the words "recommend" and "SANCTION" ... there's a reason why Mr. Lewis emphasized that word.

The statement is a legal disclaimer, so his agency doesn't get sued if someone gets hurt or killed diving solo in an overhead and then claims that because SDI offers the class they said it was OK to do so.

The tenor of your comments in this thread provide a good example of why such a disclaimer is needed.

I really like Steve, and I've taken several SDI/TDI classes ... but I find I don't always agree with everything he says, nor every position his agency takes. And I think he'd be the first to be OK with that ... but in this case, reading through the slide presentation, it's evident that the purpose of the slide show is to present the reasons for their SDI Solo Diving class which, as I've said previously, is not intended for diving in overhead environments ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Foxfish]

I'm surprised you don't check your facts a little more carefully before making these comments Bob. The SDI solo course book used the word recommends in the same context. You clearly have not read the book properly.