New UTD rig, thoughts?

[nadwidny]

10 years down the road most of this will be as useful as cuff dumps.

I have cuff dumps....sitting on a shelf in my garage.

2 big issues I have is the upside down inflator hose and the compression factor.

Jill Heinerth just released a series of posts describing an indcident she had not long ago where the upside down inflator was a major problem. As a result she does not recommend that configuration. I know that her incident was in a cave and this is supposed to be an OW rig but one of the attractions to DIR is that a single tank OW configuration is pretty much the same as a double tank configuration. This wing does not offer that advantage.

Also for the wing to dump in a vertical orientation and also to provide 40 lbs of lift in such a small package there has to compression in the wing material. Which brings up the same drawback as bungeed wings in that a puncture can force air out of the hole no matter where it is.

And quite frankly I like to be able to shift the air in my wings. If I'm carrying something heavy on one side, I can balance it out by shifting air to the other.

However it would be interesting to try this out.

 

[FWADIVER]

I
Jill Heinerth just released a series of posts describing an indcident she had not long ago where the upside down inflator was a major problem. As a result she does not recommend that configuration. I know that her incident was in a cave and this is supposed to be an OW rig but one of the attractions to DIR is that a single tank OW configuration is pretty much the same as a double tank configuration. This wing does not offer that advantage.

Thats not true, her post indicated in this instance it caused a problem, but she had been in other situations where it was a life saver. That configuration is fairly standard among the sidemount cave/cavern divers I know.

 

[nadwidny]

Thats not true, her post indicated in this instance it caused a problem, but she had been in other situations where it was a life saver.

That's not what I got. From her blog on rebreatherpro.com. Under lesson 8. Last line is her summation-

"So, here is my particular beef... Recently, some people have chosen to route the inflator on their side mount wing from the bottom up. They reason that it is more streamlined. If the diver needs to dump gas they can use a shoulder pull dump or the inflator dump that comes up from the bottom. Now, here is the rub. Literally. My buddy was stuck in a restriction with too much gas in the wing, supporting her negative bottles. In her body position the shoulder dump would not release the gas. The inflator dump did not either. That left me behind her, seeing a full wing lodged in the ceiling with no way to assist. There was no outlet at the bottom of the wing. No pull dump. In the slightly butt up position there was no getting gas out of that thing. I was preparing to cut it when I managed to squeeze my hand on top and force the air forward, leaving me with a few cuts on the back of my hand where it had been pressed against the rocky ceiling. Not fun. How did that routing benefit her?


Things above the nipple line are much easier to control and reach and rarely snag. You might not be able to reach things lower down, but your buddy can help.
Again, don’t mistake this for a back and white statement. I just can’t see one dive in my history where that configuration would have helped me and I do see one dive where it might have cost us big. "

The UTD wing does have a pull dump on the opposite side so that is a difference.

That configuration is fairly standard among the sidemount cave/cavern divers I know.

Doesn't make it a good idea.

 

[FWADIVER]

Doesn't make it a good idea.

I would trust my buddies/mentors who have extensive experience sidemount diving in caves over a random guy on the internet. I think I have a good idea for the reason they prefer that configuration, but as I dont have experience with sidemount or cave diving i'll just leave it at that.

 

[ucfdiver]

I would trust my buddies/mentors who have extensive experience sidemount diving in caves over a random guy on the internet. I think I have a good idea for the reason they prefer that configuration, but as I dont have experience with sidemount or cave diving i'll just leave it at that.

I side mount cave dive.....


...and talk about it in the appropriate forums. This is the DIR section.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Change for the sake of change (or financial gain) isn't progression-- it's stalling, actually.

When I did training with Andrew (DIR-F/Tech 1) over a decade ago while he was still the training director for GUE, he was constantly looking forward. During dinner one night we were talking about freediving and I told him about the contact lenses that had been used by Jacques Mayol for his world-record dives. Andrew immediately questioned why were we wearing masks? The discussion quickly dismissed the viability and safety of contact lenses in place of masks for both team safety and individual ocular health, but Andrew's passion for diving has a long history of trying to improve the DIR philosophy, reduce a diver's profile, increase performance, and welcome thought and input from all divers regardless of level toward accomplishing these goals.

 

[Blackwood]

Trace - I agree with your sentiments 100%. If it weren't for pioneers with the evolutionary spirit some amazing stuff would never have been possible (including record setting dives).

I just wonder how much fussing (e.g. relocating dump valves) one can do in an attempt to decrease profile while remaining within the confines of DIR, a strong tenant of which is gear familiarity and uniformity throughout a diver's progression. I learn to dump a singles wing. When I go to doubles, I dump it the same way. When I strap on stage bottles and deco bottles, I dump it the same way. When I'm scootering, I dump it the same way. When I'm in a wreck, I dump it the same way. Blah blah.

Andrew is a smart guy. Every time I'm around him I get the impression that he's likely one of the brightest people I know, and that comes from someone who works in an industry filled with intimidatingly smart people (personally I get by more by force of will than by any innate above average mental acuity). I wouldn't want to play chess with him because he'd always be thinking 3 moves ahead of mine. So I can't know where he's going with this, or how he plans to incorporate it within the realm of his agency. But I can say what doesn't immediately sit well with me within the DIR context. I'm not concerned in the slightest that dumping from the right doesn't work - it does. Rather, I just wonder if the gains are worth the expense (in this case the aforementioned uniformity).

 

[rjack321]

When I did training with Andrew (DIR-F/Tech 1) over a decade ago while he was still the training director for GUE, he was constantly looking forward. During dinner one night we were talking about freediving and I told him about the contact lenses that had been used by Jacques Mayol for his world-record dives. Andrew immediately questioned why were we wearing masks? The discussion quickly dismissed the viability and safety of contact lenses in place of masks for both team safety and individual ocular health, but Andrew's passion for diving has a long history of trying to improve the DIR philosophy, reduce a diver's profile, increase performance, and welcome thought and input from all divers regardless of level toward accomplishing these goals.

Agree 100%, yet I am continually disturbed by the car saleman factor.

 

[Rainer]

Dumping from the right might also be a bit annoying while scootering...

 

[Blackwood]

Dumping from the right might also be a bit annoying while scootering...

Unless the power inflator dumps from the prone position.