New to Diving the Great Lakes

[Jim Lapenta]

Hoosier is dead on. It's the next step for the shop's cash flow. It is the next step for the diver in a handful of cases. And he outlined those. It is not to make you a better diver. My feeling is you should.be an exceptional diver before you even think about DM. Once you've gotten to that point and then have decided you want to be involved with teaching others then you can look into the professional route. Fact is there are too many DM's now who should not be, a bunch who became DM's then reality set it and the said screw it, and then there are those who are really good and should have been chosen to be one. And too many of them are getting screwed by shops and instructors, with agency blessing, by not getting paid for their efforts.
Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Doppler]

I appreciate your answer, I was always told that next is DM, and didn't know any differently....I will look more into this before getting into it. This makes me upset at the Dive Shops I've spoken with...they've all pushed it.....just like you said. Ok, thanks for giving me the truth before jumping in too far! I feel so naive...and they've just been pushing me along.

I second or third what "the lads" have already said. In the majority of instances, DM is about the business of diving and does little to improve a diver's knowledge of real-world diving or the skills she/he will need to conduct themselves safely in the water.

Jim suggested an intro-to-tech. Good call, but then Jim and I see eye-to-eye on a lot of training issues.

Consider this course even if you have absolutely no interest in "technical diving" because the awareness, planning and basic in-water skills it emphasizes will be useful to you regardless.


Oh, and by the way, diving in Great Lakes conditions can be tough... among the toughest. However, if you take it easy, walk before you try to run, there is a lot to enjoy in this area... including some of the best shipwrecks in the world. I am very fond of a bunch of wrecks in Asia, but the ones here at home are pretty special too.

 

[meagicano]

My LDS has been pushing me to sign up for DM - it's a great way for them to make money at $499 for the course and $399 for the crew pack. Apparently they pay for insurance but anytime I ask the question no one can give a straight answer - plus they think I'm paranoid for asking about it.

I've done some diving in Lake Ontario and I definitely would agree with the dry suit recommendation! It gets cold and I wouldn't want to dive outside of the summer in a wetsuit.

We have had lots of warm water divers come up here and freak out over the conditions in the St Lawrence which is quite a bit warmer than the Great Lakes so be sure to take it slowly, go with someone experienced and realize that it really will take longer to gear up. After a few dives you won't notice all the extra neoprene on you - so don't give up!

 

[Jim Lapenta]

And as far as DM goes there are other agencies. Materials for my DM class run about $200 bucks if you don't have any of them already. But anyone who has taken OW, advanced, Nav, and rescue from me and bought just a couple of the recommended books I cite in those classes will already have half of the books covered. Oh and for my DMC's, I pay for their air, provide lunch and dinner when assisting with classes, they ride with me, and if they do need to bring their own car they will get gas money to cover that. I expect them to have their own gear. Once they are DM's they will get paid. I don't create slaves.

And if I would want them in gear I sell for some crazy reason, I will provide it. They will not have to pay anything for it. But I see no reason to do that if the gear they have is safe and in good shape.

Sent from my DROID X2 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Divin'Papaw]

And as far as DM goes there are other agencies. Materials for my DM class run about $200 bucks if you don't have any of them already. But anyone who has taken OW, advanced, Nav, and rescue from me and bought just a couple of the recommended books I cite in those classes will already have half of the books covered. Oh and for my DMC's, I pay for their air, provide lunch and dinner when assisting with classes, they ride with me, and if they do need to bring their own car they will get gas money to cover that. I expect them to have their own gear. Once they are DM's they will get paid. I don't create slaves.

And if I would want them in gear I sell for some crazy reason, I will provide it. They will not have to pay anything for it. But I see no reason to do that if the gear they have is safe and in good shape.

Can you relocate to Indiana ... or maybe Michigan or Ohio. They would be close enough. I kinda miss DMing

 

[flots am]

My LDS has been pushing me to sign up for DM - it's a great way for them to make money at $499 for the course and $399 for the crew pack. Apparently they pay for insurance but anytime I ask the question no one can give a straight answer - plus they think I'm paranoid for asking about it.

If you're actually on their insurance, you'll receive a certificate from their insurance company stating this.

If you don't have a piece of paper, you're not insured, and the first person who gets hurt, killed or just pissed off while you're working will clean you out.

Being a professional is all about the business. They have either insured you or not, and telling you "you're paranoid" means they haven't and is just a smokescreen to save them money. If they don't think it's a big deal, tell them you're not going to bother with having people sign liability releases, since "they're just being paranoid," and see how they like that.

flots.

 

[Doppler]

Can you relocate to Indiana ... or maybe Michigan or Ohio. They would be close enough. I kinda miss DMing

You can DM for me next time I am at Gilboa or Haigh!

 

[Divin'Papaw]

You can DM for me next time I am at Gilboa or Haigh!

That would certainly be an honor!

 

[olphart]

You can DM for me next time I am at Gilboa or Haigh!

Gee! I'm at Gilboa fairly often. Can I DM for you?...just kidding, I let my PADI insurance lapse and given up any idea of going down that road.

I too was talked into taking the DM course though I was unsure of my abilities. I did OK on the course, handled the stamina, skills and book learnin' just fine for an old fart. I had one hiccup when I went on the open water dives and thought like a student, not a DM, so spent my time watching the instructor instead of the students. The instructor was NOT impressed when he saw a student surface before I did.
Did MUCH better the next weekend when I had the expectations sorted out. I really enjoyed helping new divers master their skills, and got as much of a kick out of it as they did.

I found out as soon as the course was over that being a DM meant squat and that I had paid my money, got my course and that was that, unless I wanted another course or to buy more gear. Fair enough I suppose, but if I had foreseen all that, I would have gone to Intro to Tech or some such, since I mainly wanted to be a REALLY good diver.

Long story, but main point is to make sure that the course is going to do what you want, and if you're going to be a DM, what are you gong to do next?

 

[tracydr]

I appreciate your answer, I was always told that next is DM, and didn't know any differently....I will look more into this before getting into it. This makes me upset at the Dive Shops I've spoken with...they've all pushed it.....just like you said. Ok, thanks for giving me the truth before jumping in too far! I feel so naive...and they've just been pushing me along.

This is just because PADI doesn't really have much of a Tec program, and also because they push divers to become pros, which PADI more money from the pro membership annual fees.
At this stage, unless you want to become a pro, the logical step is what Jim Lapenta recommended. Leave the PADI path and start on the more technical path.
I would, however take a drysuit certification. You're going to love a drysuit, compared to diving in a 7mm wetsuit and getting out of the water in bad weather,soaking wet, chilly. In a drysuit, the topside weather won't be as much of a factor, extending the months you can dive.
You can even dive under ice comfortably, with the right undergarments.