New divers need equipment help.
- Thread starter GuysDigDirt
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ams511
Contributor
You also say it is high grade stuff but never give a reason why. The construction of the wing is average, the price is average, and it is manufactured by a small company where the owner has a reputation of being not very friendly. There is no reason to recommend this product to anyone.
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high quality materials go a long way in quality construction. I've given full reasoning previously, just don't see a point in giving it unless someone asks
That said, the biggest driver for me are the backplates. If I did not own a DSS backplate, I would not be able to dive a one piece harness in backmount. The normal pattern plates cut circulation off in my arms very quickly. The different length backplates are not something that any other manufacturers offer *aside from a small few offering short plates*. The ability to actually purchase a backplate that is the proper length is huge. The kydex plates are also vastly superior to aluminum plates, especially if you are diving doubles where the aluminum plates like to round out fairly quickly from the bolt holes.
ams511
Contributor
It is unrealistic to expect the OP (or anyone) else to search your 12,000 + posts to find where you talk about how great DSS wings are. Also the wings and the plates use no more high quality materials than any other manufacturer.
Other manufacturers offers plates in different sizes. Before there was DSS you had Fred T and others that made different size plates. As you mentioned, others such as Halcyon and Oxycheq make smaller plates. However, you are recommending a product based on very narrow criteria. Most people do just fine with medium plates, you are the exception. For singles, a kydex plate has no advantage over an aluminum plate, I own both. Personally I would not recommend either, if weight is an issue than use either the dog bone plate from Golem or the Dive Rite cut out plate, neither are very expensive.
In closing, you are doing new divers a disservice by blindly recommending DSS products. You give it a blanket recommendation on how great the products are, and then walk it back that you like the plates, and then further walk it back that you like that the plates come in different sizes. I have no idea why a plate should cut off your circulation in the water because underwater the tanks weigh next to nothing, but I guess it is possible. You could have also tried using another type of harness like a transplate harness or maybe a Hollis Switchback. If you want to recommend a product then be more specific about why you are recommending it. Don't expect someone to search your previous posts.
Everyone is giving his/her own opinion. No more and no less. So I won't take it personal.
I really do not see the point of buying recreational dive computer worth more than US$200.00 nowadays. My ancient Uwatec Aladin Pro Nitrox cost a lot more back in 1998 but I am still using it. It doesn't even come with back light and I have to shine light on it in poor vis or in night dive. It has everything, ndl, max depth and dive time etc, that I need for recreational dive.
My work horse is Apeks DS4 + TX50 since also 1998.
For my baby tec dive, 2 bottom timers + pre dive plan on a slate are my standard since 1999.
I really do not see the point of buying recreational dive computer worth more than US$200.00 nowadays. My ancient Uwatec Aladin Pro Nitrox cost a lot more back in 1998 but I am still using it. It doesn't even come with back light and I have to shine light on it in poor vis or in night dive. It has everything, ndl, max depth and dive time etc, that I need for recreational dive.
My work horse is Apeks DS4 + TX50 since also 1998.
For my baby tec dive, 2 bottom timers + pre dive plan on a slate are my standard since 1999.
woodcarver
Contributor
@GuysDigDirt Welcome to SB! I would agree with @HeliMech, buy the best quality your budget allows.
If you know what direction you think you want to go in diving, it can help you figure out if spending a little extra on something is worth it, like the Perdix. For instance, I have a tendency to overindulge my hobbies, but have no interest in tech diving or deep wrecks, so I didn't buy a Perdix. I do like the big, easy to read display though. It's more computer than I think I need, so I bought a D4i. Some people don't like Suunto because of the algorithm. It's worked fine for me so far. I like the AI feature, but that puts it higher on the price spectrum. For me, the display is ok, a little small, but I can see all the pertinent info underwater.
BCDs vs BP/W is another ongoing discussion, in a lot of threads, all the time. SB has a lot of advocates for BP/W, with good reason. They are versatile. Best option is to try out as many different styles as you can before you spend your money. I've used an AL Dimension i3 for the last 4 years and like it, but decided to get an AL Outlaw recently. Haven't used it outside of a pool yet, but like it so far. Nothing wrong with the i3, just wanted to try the Outlaw as a lighter travel option.
I have AL Legend regs. Bought because they were highly recommended. They've been good, no complaints. There are definitely regs out there that are just as reliable for less money. There's also some that are a lot more.
Buy your wetsuit first. It's probably the most personal piece of gear and you want one that fits well. Base it on where you think you'll dive most as far as thickness, and your cold tolerance.
If you stick around on SB, you'll find a wealth of knowledge available just for the price of asking. Well, almost that cheap. You will need to wade through a number of tangents (common) and disagreements (occasionally) on some threads, but the help available to learn is there. Hope this helps. Dive Safe!
If you know what direction you think you want to go in diving, it can help you figure out if spending a little extra on something is worth it, like the Perdix. For instance, I have a tendency to overindulge my hobbies, but have no interest in tech diving or deep wrecks, so I didn't buy a Perdix. I do like the big, easy to read display though. It's more computer than I think I need, so I bought a D4i. Some people don't like Suunto because of the algorithm. It's worked fine for me so far. I like the AI feature, but that puts it higher on the price spectrum. For me, the display is ok, a little small, but I can see all the pertinent info underwater.
BCDs vs BP/W is another ongoing discussion, in a lot of threads, all the time. SB has a lot of advocates for BP/W, with good reason. They are versatile. Best option is to try out as many different styles as you can before you spend your money. I've used an AL Dimension i3 for the last 4 years and like it, but decided to get an AL Outlaw recently. Haven't used it outside of a pool yet, but like it so far. Nothing wrong with the i3, just wanted to try the Outlaw as a lighter travel option.
I have AL Legend regs. Bought because they were highly recommended. They've been good, no complaints. There are definitely regs out there that are just as reliable for less money. There's also some that are a lot more.
Buy your wetsuit first. It's probably the most personal piece of gear and you want one that fits well. Base it on where you think you'll dive most as far as thickness, and your cold tolerance.
If you stick around on SB, you'll find a wealth of knowledge available just for the price of asking. Well, almost that cheap. You will need to wade through a number of tangents (common) and disagreements (occasionally) on some threads, but the help available to learn is there. Hope this helps. Dive Safe!
ams511
Contributor
That is true, everyone can have their own opinion but they cannot have their own "facts". New divers need to be educated to cut through marketing BS. The OP does not dive because he wants to buy equipment but is afraid of buying the wrong stuff. This is sad but probably not uncommon. Our infighting does not help matters either.
If someone wants to recommend a product, they should be able to form a logical argument for why the recommended product is superior to others. Making broad statements or saying they replaced an item soon after purchase are not very helpful to anyone.
Jack Hammer
Contributor
Welcome to the strongly opinionated area.
My take is to consider renting or borrowing equipment for a bit to see what you really like or don't like and what kind of diving you truly enjoy most. This will affect the type of gear you decide upon (recreational, resort, vacation only, local quarry, boat diving, shore diving, deep, shallow, warm, cold, reefs, wrecks, etc). Of all the gear I bought in my first year or so of active diving, the only thing I still use (occasionally) is the computer (as a back up and only then as a bottom timer and even only then because it's paid for). The majority of money I spent on regs, fins, mask, bc, exposure protection, gimmicks and gadgets, etc, was wasted. And in retrospect cost me a lot more than it would have cost to rent or buy used or discounted gear to learn with and find "my way".
Talk to, find, or join your local dive club. There is always people looking to unload gear they no longer need or have upgraded.
I do recommend Atomic regulators, they have regulators at different prices point and they are the best in their price points. Although I don't remember the context of where I brought up the M1 but it is my favorite regulators at $700 (not $1200) and is a great value and not the most expensive. I don't recall recommending the Tx version but it depends on the context which I don't recall at all, if you have it, please remind me so that it will be close to a fair discussion. I often recommend the Z2 for all of the features of Atomic regulators and their outstanding performance, without the rotating turret, at a reasonable price, do you recall this part??
Pissing matches aside, Jack Hammer gave the best advice for you in this thread, not that many of the other recommendations are bad, you haven’t been diving since certification so it may serve you much better to rent for a while and talk to local divers about what they use in your home waters. Living In SoCal you have some great diving available to you.
Renting is throwing money away but overall you’ll save a bunch over buying if you find you don’t get around to diving much.
You can spend a lot or a lot more buying equipment but you’ll save money thinking long term, an honest assessment of how much or how little diving you’ll do, proceed accordingly.
Renting is throwing money away but overall you’ll save a bunch over buying if you find you don’t get around to diving much.
You can spend a lot or a lot more buying equipment but you’ll save money thinking long term, an honest assessment of how much or how little diving you’ll do, proceed accordingly.
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