New Bungee / Long hose setup - Questions

[cmrangel]

Hi,
I am a new diver (AOW with 20 dives) and last year I got my first setup and went with a good primary (MK25/S600) but went somewhat cheap on the octo (what I could afford at the time). Time to change that cheapo puck octo. I am thinking of going to a long(er) hose primary to donate with a short hose bungeed octo. I don't want to start any "how long a hose" discussion, I have read a couple of posts on that. FWIW, I plan to start with a 40in hose w/90 elbow and do some practice OOA and see what works for me and if I want to go longer.

However, I do have a couple of questions.
1. Colors of regs and hoses - My primary now is black and the hose is black. since it is to be the donated reg, should it get yellow hoses? I have seen a yellow purge button kit, is that something that would make sense?f
2. Since my new octo will not be donated, will it cause confusion if it is yellow? I assume it should at least be on a black hose.

You can see from my questions, I am a bit worried about causing confusion with my buddy if a OOA situation occurs. I sometimes dive with insta-buddies. I know my buddy and I would have a conversation before the dive about OOA and which reg will be donated but, in the heat of the moment, I know things can get confusing. I have seen a Dive Rite reg set up (XT Advance Open Water kit) and it has a yellow short secondary octo w/black hose and a black long hose black reg primary..... wondering if this is the way to go color-wise.

And speaking of octo's, I was thinking of a ScubaPro R195 since I already have ScubaPro regs and I know I can have the all serviced at the same shop. Is this a good reg? I can't afford another S600 right now but can swing the R195 at about $200. I have seen both black and yellow versions. If I go with the black, I assume the dive/pre-dive can prevent it from free flowing. Not sure if the yellow one is specific for an octo and maybe detuned?

Thanks in advance!!

 

[TSandM]

If you are horizontal, the only regulator an OOA diver will see is the one you are breathing. Don't worry about the colors. Put everything on black hoses. You'll be fine.

 

[Bob DBF]

As TS&M said, go with basic black. If you have a yellow reg around your neck it may cause confusion you don't need.

If you don't spot the OOA diver and give him the reg you prefer, he will take the one he sees working. Therefore it is imperative that you practice switching regs until it is second nature to switch to the bunged reg because it is a completely different procedure than you were taught in OW, you both will be changing regs.

When diving with another diver, I point out the differences in my configuration, and the difference in procedures that goes with them. Which includes "take the reg from my mouth if I don't hand it to you first". I have not been mugged for a reg in decades, well before I used a long hose, but it was a non event for me at the time, I just switched to my backup. You need to practice, as I said above, to insure it will be a non event for you as well.

As for a backup, you can also check if your LDS an see if they have a good used second if cost is a factor. Those pucks are not up to my standards, and I dive gear some people consider antiques, or junk, dependant on the person.



Bob
------------------
I may be old, but I'm not dead yet.

 

[The Chairman]

Just learn the 84" hose set up and go with any color you want. A friend of mine just went with a long yaller hose and is getting the same color for his Hog regulator. Does it matter? It does to him, but probably not to anyone else. Do what you're comfortable with and have fun!

BTW, never cheap out on the second. Make it a clone of the one you're normally breathing on.

 

[KenGordon]

If you have a 40 inch second hose why would you breath that as a primary and be forced to swap to donate?

The 2.1m (7ft, 84 inches) long hose is ideal for donation to have room between donor and OOG diver. The fashion is to store it by looping it under a light canister and the across the chest and behind the neck and use it as a primary. The advantages are ease of storing and when multiple gases are used an OOG diver knows that the gas in the donor's mouth is breathable.

Your 40 inch octo hose and 20 dives suggest you are not going to be carrying deco gases which lead to the multiple issue or have the storage issue. It would seem to me that you are adopting a scheme with no advantage, eg a longer hose for the OOG diver, but with significant disadvantages such as confusion, the donor having to swap and the risk of a snatch.

Bob is very blasé about having a regulator taken from his mouth. He may be cool with that but if you took mine while I was inhaling I'd be taking it back ****ing hard and you'd be off my Christmas list.

 

[Ben_ca]

Hi,
FWIW, I plan to start with a 40in hose w/90 elbow and do some practice OOA and see what works for me and if I want to go longer.

Don't bother with the 90 elbow. You don't need it and it just adds to the cost.

 

[vixtor]

Indeed, don't worry about colors. Even more, don't make the one hanging under your chin yellow, because you don't want that one to attract the attention more than the one in your mouth (but normally the one making bubbles attracts the scared diver more anyway, while the calm one will just signal you he wants it).

R195 is cheap/basic indeed, but it is very reliable so if that's the budget you can afford, it should be ok.

What worries me is:
a) you speak about a 40in hose, which is (if google is right) only 1 meter. You cannot really route this hose properly (it is too short). I usually heard about 1.5 meters (5 feet) being the shortest option normally. I use a 2 meters one (the long version), and it is great in confined spaces, and extremely confortable in open water. Your 40in/1meter hose seems very short to me and the only way to wear it would be a giant loop on one side of your head, asking for being entangled.
b) if you have a normal bcd, you might find it hard to route/fix a long hose. Normally you would route it arround your canister or just tuck a loop of hose under the wing belt. Now, if you have a bcd, this will be more difficult so you have to think it properly (how ok is in terms of entanglement, how easy is to take it out fast when needed, how easy is to put it back under water).

 

[Freewillow]

I agree, without going in the discussion about the lenght of a long hose, a 40 inches is NOT a long hose by any standard

 

[Colliam7]

*

octo. I am thinking of going to a long(er) hose primary to donate with a short hose bungeed octo. . . . . FWIW, I plan to start with a 40in hose w/90 elbow and do some practice OOA and see what works for me and if I want to go longer. . . . My primary now is black and the hose is black. since it is to be the donated reg, should it get yellow hoses? I have seen a yellow purge button kit, is that something that would make sense? . . . . . Since my new octo will not be donated, will it cause confusion if it is yellow? I assume it should at least be on a black hose.

Can we presume that you currently have your 'puck' on a hose that is longer than the hose on your primary? Not infrequently, regulators are sold with the alternate (formerly referred to as an 'octo') on a 40" hose, and the primary on a 34 - 36" hose. To accomplish what you want (diving with a 'donatable' primary on a 40" hose), simply swap the second stages, so the S600 is now on the longer hose (possibly yellow?) of your current configuration, and put what is now your alternate on the shorter hose and add a bungee necklace. That is probably the easiest first step in converting to a regulator set-up that makes some sense (i.e. a diver donates the second stage that is known to be working / is in their mouth, at the time an OOA diver needs a donated reg). You don't have to change hoses, just swap second stages. If your current (40") alternate hose is yellow, fine. If it is black, fine. As several have said, color is not the issue. The best approach is a pre-dive safety check discussion with your buddy / insta-buddy.

As also suggested, don't waste money on a 90 degree adapter. If funds are a concern, invest that money in a better 'new' alternate. Frankly, a 70 degree adapter would probably be a better choice, anyway. The issue is, how to route the 40" hose - which is now your primary second stage hose, so that it is at least somewhat streamlined. I find it better to run it under my (right) arm and up to my mouth. That produces a bit of an odd angle but still works without any adapter.

As for what 'new' second stage to go with, go with one that you would be comfortable using as a primary - in an OOA situation, when you donate what is in your mouth, what is under your chin becomes your primary. The R195 is a not unreasonable choice. Go with black. A properly tuned (i.e. not needlessly de-tuned) second stage with a venturi control will not freeflow when it is on a bungee under your chin. Personally, I think Pete's comment is the keeper:

BTW, never cheap out on the second. Make it a clone of the one you're normally breathing on.

That is my individual preference and approach as well. The idea of seeing if your LDS has a used second stage that would be close to your S600 in performance, and going with that, is a good suggestion.

 

[Yoyoguy]

Hi,
I am a new diver (AOW with 20 dives) and last year I got my first setup and went with a good primary (MK25/S600) but went somewhat cheap on the octo (what I could afford at the time). Time to change that cheapo puck octo. I am thinking of going to a long(er) hose primary to donate with a short hose bungeed octo. I don't want to start any "how long a hose" discussion, I have read a couple of posts on that. FWIW, I plan to start with a 40in hose w/90 elbow and do some practice OOA and see what works for me and if I want to go longer.

However, I do have a couple of questions.
1. Colors of regs and hoses - My primary now is black and the hose is black. since it is to be the donated reg, should it get yellow hoses? I have seen a yellow purge button kit, is that something that would make sense?f
2. Since my new octo will not be donated, will it cause confusion if it is yellow? I assume it should at least be on a black hose.

You can see from my questions, I am a bit worried about causing confusion with my buddy if a OOA situation occurs. I sometimes dive with insta-buddies. I know my buddy and I would have a conversation before the dive about OOA and which reg will be donated but, in the heat of the moment, I know things can get confusing. I have seen a Dive Rite reg set up (XT Advance Open Water kit) and it has a yellow short secondary octo w/black hose and a black long hose black reg primary..... wondering if this is the way to go color-wise.

And speaking of octo's, I was thinking of a ScubaPro R195 since I already have ScubaPro regs and I know I can have the all serviced at the same shop. Is this a good reg? I can't afford another S600 right now but can swing the R195 at about $200. I have seen both black and yellow versions. If I go with the black, I assume the dive/pre-dive can prevent it from free flowing. Not sure if the yellow one is specific for an octo and maybe detuned?

Thanks in advance!!

I am a newish diver as well (50+ dives) and just went through this exact same thing. Are you in a BP/W (backplate/wing) set-up or just a regular BCD? If just a regular BCD, then id probably not go for a long hose set-up where you need to route the hose along your right side. If, however, you are in a BP/W already then I highly suggest skipping the 40in hose and just go with the 7ft (84in). It is not as long as you might think and you do NOT need a canister light on your hip to help route the hose. I have now done 15 open water dives with this setup and find it to be awesome. Does not get in the way like one might think. A simply pocket on your right hip is enough to tuck the hose behind. If you do go to a long hose set-up (no matter the length) make sure you practice out of air with your buddy a few times so you and your buddy can get used to the change. Just my two cents worth.