Need A Couple Questions Answered.

[NAM001]

adam

for the most part a bp is a bp a harness is a harness. for single tanks i would have to say that a wing is a wing. the issue with wings are the size., it is eassy to oversize the wing. bigger is not better. you will not get a wing that accompdates both your shorty and your dry suit. reauirements are different inthe lift. tobin can explain it to you quite well. i chose the dss bp because of the bolt on weights for the steel plate. that option is only a subtile difference in the big picture but works so well for me when changing from wet to dry and fresh to salt. my single wing is very small looking but is i think a 28 lb wing. it works great.

you dont have to try on back plate and harnesses to find the right one unless you are short or tall. by tall in mean over 6-1. the wings are pretty standard so long as you have your weight on your bp and not piled onto your waist. you may need some weight on your waist if you are light on the feet i am perfect as long as i am diving with a shorty and not a full suit. once the full suit i need heavy fins and sometimes a little weight on the waist. getting the wing right is like getting a suit to fit right. when it is right it is right. as long as the wing is ball park you trim to taylor fit it. perhaps i am lucky but with my shorty my mass center is center of my chest. the rig sits center and the bolt on weights sit center and the wing lift is applied on the center. my doubles were not that simple but was doable. did he tell you what wing you needed? if so you have all the info y9ou need to get a good fit. and the fit does not have to come from dss. wheather of not you se a waight belt or ie. a weight plates(i recommend this)/weight harnenss could be important to the wing shape. in that I mean morelift on the waist than the body center.




hops here stock BP/Ws. the only plate i've ever seen is the HOG, and the apeks one the guy at the LDS uses. So i'm relying purely on the info i receive here, to make a decision on what suits me and my diving skills and conditions, best.

The shipping costs and time frame involved in getting it across the border, are the biggest draw backs with Tobins rig. there are dealers in canada. in ontario mostly. But no one stocks anything anymore.

As for brand. i'm liking the Apeks xtx-50 Regs. Anyone have any experience with their plates. i know they make a WTX harness thats pricey. one of the guys at my LDS dive their plate and basic harness. he likes it.[/QUOTE]

 

[adamp69]

Thanks KWS. and everyone else as well for you info. Tobin calculated that a 35lbs wing would probably do it, but i would be pretty close. And given that i was looking to purchase a drysuit in the near future (something else for me to drive you guys crazy about), that a 40lbs might be a better choice considering the difference in size would not be noticeable. Is the DSS plate the only one using the bolt on plates? I've always been interested in the DSS rig tobin recommended. Again, I'm still afraid of going too tek to quickly, however SangP made a very good point. Makes much more sense to try out the basic harness, which cost very little, and Upgrade if I want/need to, then to buy an expensive harness and rip everything off it.

So one more Question about Tobins rig. Should I ask for that Glide harness adaptor? has anyone been using it? or is it something else i dont need? Just for the record, I'm about 6.1ft, 230lbs. Kind of broad across the shoulders. What size/pattern should i be looking at?

 

[NAM001]

you can certainly try it ... i dont understand how it works and obviously i do not use one. i just adjust the belt as needed. there is a bit of hassle to readjust when switching form wfet suit to dry suit but such is life. i think i replaced the harness with another that was softer than the ridgid one from dss. you can always hit the shops and fine soft web belt. rigid belting has its advantages when suiting up alone though. the plates do not bolt to the plate. the bolts pass through the plate into the weights so its the bolt pattern onthe plate that counts. tapping the plate is a chore incase you are thinking about it. it is easier to drill the other manufacturers plate to allign with the bolts. i got a spare set of stainless bolts with mine. the bolts are easy to loose. the wing... i thik i am using the tourus 26 , it looks amall and it is. it has i think enough to counter my dry suit flooded with a light undergarment. remember the wing has to lift you full gear and a flooded suit with 10# to spare to keep your head abouve water. my 3mm fj is +19 my dui tls350 is +19 with ight undies and 38 with heavier 300 undies. given that you would probably need the lcd40 wing upthere in cold land. i am 6 foot and 250# i have the large plate. the torus 26 works well when using with 8" tanks also thre is not much bulk to it so the air is distributed all alond the side of the tank from the tacoing effect so i dont have a moving bubble. th larger wing the more moving bubble you have. inshort do you want to counter a 5# moving bubble otr a 10# bubble when you look up or down. my doudbles is a donut shaped wing it is the tourus 49 there is more controll of the bubble as the bubble trapps in the center ofthe wing and spreads fed and aft as it fills. great for doubles. i also have the torus 57 as you can see the waist portion is much larger to coulter for a weight belt. if you lean forward the bubble runns back and i become feet up and head down. that is why i bought the do nut to relace it. with teh dry suit heavy undies i use the 59 to counter the extra weight in the belt to counter the 38# lift it gives me.. the lighter the undies the better. or heavy on chest and lighter undies on legs. many many variables.

do not be afraid of "going tech to quickly" The gear does not make you a TECHY. If anything you would want to start the bp/w and become one with it. the tech stuff are just standards where crap gets hung ON THE BP/W. So learn from teh beginning how to deal with the foundation device (bp/w) and when you are comfortable with it diving in a rec aplication then move on to the tech applications and methods. Had someone told me about a bp/w and could exlained it to me i would have done it from the start, as opposed to having all the now unused crap in the back room.

how much difference will the bouyancy change from your currnt protection to getting the dry suit. ideally you should not ned so much for the suit but the problem with the drysuit is it floding and that requires more reserve lift capacity or easily dumpable lead with teh same wing. ??????

Thanks KWS. and everyone else as well for you info. Tobin calculated that a 35lbs wing would probably do it, but i would be pretty close. And given that i was looking to purchase a drysuit in the near future (something else for me to drive you guys crazy about), that a 40lbs might be a better choice considering the difference in size would not be noticeable. Is the DSS plate the only one using the bolt on plates? I've always been interested in the DSS rig tobin recommended. Again, I'm still afraid of going too tek to quickly, however SangP made a very good point. Makes much more sense to try out the basic harness, which cost very little, and Upgrade if I want/need to, then to buy an expensive harness and rip everything off it.

So one more Question about Tobins rig. Should I ask for that Glide harness adaptor? has anyone been using it? or is it something else i dont need? Just for the record, I'm about 6.1ft, 230lbs. Kind of broad across the shoulders. What size/pattern should i be looking at?

 

[adamp69]

thanks for all the info. I guess my plan is now, to try and get one of the canadian DSS dealers to get me the DSS singles rig, with the 40lbs wing and hopefully the weight plates. I think i'm gonna buy either the Apeks XTX-50 for regs. Or maybe the Legend lx as SAngP recommended. Either way. I think i should probably purchase the regs thru my LDS, just for warranty and servicing. even tho their prices are almost double what i can get them online for. lol. thanks everyone

 

[gcarter]

thanks for all the info. I guess my plan is now, to try and get one of the canadian DSS dealers to get me the DSS singles rig, with the 40lbs wing and hopefully the weight plates. I think i'm gonna buy either the Apeks XTX-50 for regs. Or maybe the Legend lx as SAngP recommended. Either way. I think i should probably purchase the regs thru my LDS, just for warranty and servicing. even tho their prices are almost double what i can get them online for. lol. thanks everyone

You don't have to buy through them in order to get warranty service. Give them a chance to price match or at least get more competitive. Also take note that there are some online sources for Apex that are grey market ie no warranty. Make sure it is an authorized dealer on or off line.

As one who has Apex regs, much as I like them, I still would suggest buying the Hog locally. I have used my son's Hog and would personally save the money when buying regs again.

 

[SangP]

Thanks KWS. and everyone else as well for you info. Tobin calculated that a 35lbs wing would probably do it, but i would be pretty close. And given that i was looking to purchase a drysuit in the near future (something else for me to drive you guys crazy about), that a 40lbs might be a better choice considering the difference in size would not be noticeable. Is the DSS plate the only one using the bolt on plates? I've always been interested in the DSS rig tobin recommended. Again, I'm still afraid of going too tek to quickly, however SangP made a very good point. Makes much more sense to try out the basic harness, which cost very little, and Upgrade if I want/need to, then to buy an expensive harness and rip everything off it.

So one more Question about Tobins rig. Should I ask for that Glide harness adaptor? has anyone been using it? or is it something else i dont need? Just for the record, I'm about 6.1ft, 230lbs. Kind of broad across the shoulders. What size/pattern should i be looking at?

Please allow me to throw a couple of spanners into the works.

1. Any questions you have about a DSS rig you really should throw to Tobin, he'll also help you find the best way to get the rig in Canada.
As for your built I would suggest a large plate and really a 35lbs wing is sufficient, if you go dry then it's really more then enough.
Also Dan is selling for a very good price here:
Deep Sea Supply Pro Fit Singles Rig w/LCD40 wing, tank straps

Here's a review of the glide harness:
DSS Glide Harness Adapter makes getting in and out of your hogarthian rig easier - dyv.us : Scuba Diving Philippines

If for some reason you don't like the glide harness, sell it to me seriously.


2. For the regs, I won't advice getting it from the LDS or online as the warranty is the same anyway as your lds will also gladly service any reg you throw his way for $.

What you should ask your lds is the price of servicing an apeks or hog that you already have followed by a what if I bought one from you? If the prices of servicing isn't that far off, get them online.

Also as good as the Apeks DS4/XTX50 or Aqualung Legend LX or Scubapro are, the Hog regs are really good too. The Hogs work fine for a lot of the techie guys and gals so there isn't a reason you should dismiss them considering their price. If your LDS can service them well I'll say go for it. You can get the complete package from Dan's dive shop.
http://www.dansdiveshop.ca/dstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=24_2&products_id=820
Although, I would ask if they could swap out the D1 1st stage for a D2 as it's lighter:
http://www.dansdiveshop.ca/dstore/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=24_2&products_id=827


You could dismiss the miss information from one of the sales guy at Dan however, their prices are hard to beat.

 

[adamp69]

Dans is in the toronto area. And yeah, i'm hoping i can get the DSS rig thru them. I can buy, and get any of the major player regs serviced thru my LDS. but the guy who services them told me that if i bought them online, the free parts warranty would be void. One of the guys who works at the shop has a set of Apeks XTX-50s for sale. they've been serviced properly and still have warranty, but again, the warranty will be void once i purchase them from him.

The other Dive shop in my area sells the HOG equipment. The price on the HOG gear is great. I am currently diving a set of Dive Rite regs that look identical to the HOGs i was looking at.

So Money aside. If all the regs were the same price. what would you buy?

 

[SangP]

Dans is in the toronto area. And yeah, i'm hoping i can get the DSS rig thru them. I can buy, and get any of the major player regs serviced thru my LDS. but the guy who services them told me that if i bought them online, the free parts warranty would be void. One of the guys who works at the shop has a set of Apeks XTX-50s for sale. they've been serviced properly and still have warranty, but again, the warranty will be void once i purchase them from him.

The other Dive shop in my area sells the HOG equipment. The price on the HOG gear is great. I am currently diving a set of Dive Rite regs that look identical to the HOGs i was looking at.

So Money aside. If all the regs were the same price. what would you buy?

I'm assuming that the parts are free but not the servicing costs and the price is similar to this:

Regulator Service and Parts - Dive Gear Express

Parts costs for 2 2nd stage and 1 first stage is about $62. You service em once every 2 years and you keep the regs for a max of 6 years.

Total costs $186 so unless the price of the lds hog regs are no not more then $200 I don't seen a financial need to get the regs from them anyway.

If the regs, servicing costs and parts prices were the same, I'll get the Apeks regs cus I'm very familiar with them. However, in your case, I would say the Hog D2/D1/D1 setup
http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/edge-gear/309166-hog-bal-second-hog-d1-antsi-results.html

 

[gcarter]

Dans is in the toronto area. And yeah, i'm hoping i can get the DSS rig thru them. I can buy, and get any of the major player regs serviced thru my LDS. but the guy who services them told me that if i bought them online, the free parts warranty would be void. One of the guys who works at the shop has a set of Apeks XTX-50s for sale. they've been serviced properly and still have warranty, but again, the warranty will be void once i purchase them from him.

The other Dive shop in my area sells the HOG equipment. The price on the HOG gear is great. I am currently diving a set of Dive Rite regs that look identical to the HOGs i was looking at.

So Money aside. If all the regs were the same price. what would you buy?

Complete and utter BS. If you buy them grey market, your entire warranty is void. If you buy them from an authorized dealer, full warranty is in effect. On or off line does not matter. The LDS is lying to you. And if about this, what else?

 

[SangP]

Complete and utter BS. If you buy them grey market, your entire warranty is void. If you buy them from an authorized dealer, full warranty is in effect. On or off line does not matter. The LDS is lying to you. And if about this, what else?

With such misinformation left and right no wonder he's so confused. adamp69 I suggest you move over to the US lol!