Minimum requirements for tech courses

[phoenix31tt]

Not to mention... Those people who think they are better than they are... Will possibly do deco dives without the formal training anyways... It's easy enough got someone to read up on deco diving and cut some tables and think they are ready for a deco dive instead of waiting till the have racked up 50 or a 100 or 150 dives to qualify for official training...


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[Bennno]

You seemed to have indicated that there was a meaningful difference between 20 and 200.

Yeah stupid me, that's exactly what I thought but know I've learned from you guys that experience doesn't matter in diving at all. 20 or 200 is no difference... why would the guy that has done 10 times the dives be any better... I get it know. Great logic guys!

 

[phoenix31tt]

Yeah stupid me, that's exactly what I thought but know I've learned from you guys that experience doesn't matter in diving at all. 20 or 200 is no difference... why would the guy that has done 10 times the dives be any better... I get it know. Great logic guys!

Dont do what you accuse others of doing... Nobody says that experience doesnt matter... But 200 horrible dives just means you have vast experience in horribly diving... A guy with 25 excellent dives wins anyway... And a guy with 25 dives and passing an intro to tech course wins hands down


The only way to judge experience and readiness is by doing an assessment dive... Not counting logbook numbers

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[Bennno]

Let's try it again.

The 30 dive requirement allows you do start training to become a decompression diver.

Yes, for the 10th time, I think that is a stupid rule! That's my opinion and it's based on having seen tons of divers in the water for almost 20 years.
If you disagree, fine.

 

[boulderjohn]

Yes, for the 10th time, I think that is a stupid rule! That's my opinion and it's based on having seen tons of divers in the water for almost 20 years.
If you disagree, fine.

Sorry, but what you said was "Seya and other geniuses think it's a good idea for people 30 dives to go deco diving." You don't go deco diving with 30 dives--you start the course then.

If you take a class in school, they don't give you the final exam the day you walk in the door. You seem to be utterly incapable of understanding the difference between a prerequisite for training and the graduation standards.

 

[Bennno]

Dont do what you accuse others of doing... Nobody says that experience doesnt matter...

It's been said here over and over again. Leave me alone now, I've already given in... you guys are right... lots of 20 dive divers totally rule and those more experienced guys often totally suck because of bad habits and stuff you guys have once seen somewhere and yadi yadi yada.

---------- Post added July 19th, 2015 at 10:03 PM ----------

You don't go deco diving with 30 dives--you start the course then.

Right, and than they go through rigorous training and emerge as awesome tec divers with 35 or 40 or even 50 dives or whatever. Awesome! Now that's much better!

 

[Seya]

It really annoys me that people like Seya and other geniuses think it's a good idea for people with 30 dives to go deco diving. People obviously don't realize that a bunch divers have actually killed themselves because they overestimated how good they are... there is no such thing as a great diver at 30 dives, someone might be good for only having 30 dives but in the great scheme of thinks they all suck more or less!

And it's not only the training standards for students. Check the PADI or TDI minimum standards for Trimix Instructors! They are a joke. Only 20 trimix dives to become a trimix instructor! Who wants to take a course with a guy that has done only 20 times what he is teaching now... seriously?
All this is for financial reasons, obviously.
That really pisses me off... as you can tell. Now there are a bunch of people that are defending stuff like that... and that pisses me off even more.

You keep on lying I have never ever said that at all. And you keep on resorting to personal attacks when you do not know me or anything about me. I'm done with you.

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[The Laconic]

You just have to avoid the "to fast too soon" problem, but that is another discussion.

On the contrary, I think that IS this discussion.

---------- Post added July 19th, 2015 at 04:05 PM ----------

You seemed to have indicated that there was a meaningful difference between 20 and 200. If there's no "magic" number... how do you know that 20 isn't enough? I'm not saying that it IS enough... but I have no way of stating unequivocally that it isn't.

I think that one unacknowledged source of disputes here is that there are two different interpretations of "magic number", and they are not equivalent:
1. If you have at least N dives, you are qualified to start technical diving.
2. If you do not have at least N dives, you are not qualified to start technical diving.

Some people are interpreting magic number in terms of #1, and I think that's a lost cause. I think we can agree that there are divers who, no matter how many dives they'e done, shouldn't get into technical diving.

In contrast, there is a case to be made in terms of #2, and personally, I think the agencies are setting the bar way too low, but maybe I'm wrong, which is why I solicited opinions.

Note that my original question wasn't "where should the agencies set the bar", but rather "where would you, as someone (presumably) with experience in technical diving, perhaps even as a trainer in technical diving, set the bar"?

 

[boulderjohn]

Right, and than they go through rigorous training and emerge as awesome tec divers with 35 or 40 or even 50 dives or whatever. Awesome! Now that's much better!

With that many dives and that much training, they can do 10 minutes of deco on a dive above 130 feet in depth. Is that your definition of an awesome technical diver?

 

[phoenix31tt]

If not, what would you consider to be the minimum realistic requirements for an entry-level technical diving course? I'm not necessarily talking about cave or wreck here, although that would be a fine question too, just deco diving. (If you feel the urge to respond "but all diving is deco diving", OK, but you know what I mean.)

I think many people have said it is less about number of dives and certifications and more of an assessment of skills...


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