Max Recommend Depth for OW certified diver

[Diver Tim]

Resurrecting a REALLY old thread, but it seemed like the appropriate venue.

Background: I'm a certified OW diver (not AOW). I've now got 10 total open water dives logged. I'm aware of the 60' "recommended limit" for OW divers (seems a little like an oxymoron... Is it a "recommendation" or a "limit"?). Here's the thing...

*Dons flame-retardant suit*

My dives 9 and 10 were to local shipwrecks in about 100' of water.

I realize that the recommendation is for OW divers to limit their dives to 60', but in good conditions (warm water, good vis, no current, no surge, equipment working well, good buddy), what hazards would I have exposed myself to at 100' that aren't present at 60'?

I have a well-developed sense of self-preservation, but I found no reason to feel uncomfortable about these dives. What am I missing?

Thanks...

Tim

 

[Walter]

It's not an oxymoron. It is a recommendation that you limit yourself to 60 feet.

I know you made 8 dives prior to diving to 100 feet. I know nothing else of your background. What were the depths and conditions of your previous dives? Who was your buddy? What is his experience level?

In general, the two biggest problems with going to 100 feet too soon without a gradual buildup of deeper experience is a much greater effect of narcosis and using up your air much more quickly.

 

[BodenseeDiver]

my first Dive was 35min by 12m, my sec. Dive was 40min by 18m and my thirt Dive was 30min by 30m, Yes @ PADI - specialists remembers yourselves
Ohh I´m CMAS Diver

 

[piikki]

The big hazard is very much related to what Walter said. You don’t know what you don’t know until you accumulate some experience. If something were to go wrong, even if you weren’t so narc’ed, you have way less time (gas) to sort it out at 100ft than at 50 ft. If (when) you are narc’ed, and maybe do not yet know how it affects you, you are likely to make mistakes that can be way more drastic when you start up from 100 ft than when you start up from 50 ft.

For example, you can gather up way more speed on an uncontrolled ascent and we all know that is not a desirable situation. Also, the deeper you go the less reserve you usually will have to assist anybody else, particularly your buddy if anything was to go wrong with them. Consider if you would want to live with those consequences. You might want to take a look at some good gas calculation worksheets that exist here on SB, and see how much gas is required to make safe dives to 100ft, especially on Al80 and even with good gas consumption rates. (eg Rock Bottom and Gas Management for Recreational Divers)

Then again you can read dozens and dozens of accounts of newbies making these dives every day without ANY trouble, and feeling confident. Feeling very comfortable or confident is not necessarily a sign of being ready though, sometimes quite the opposite. But some learn faster than others and some conditions are more akin for quick progression to deeper dives. The potential for nasty dives are even in very shallow water but personally I do not see why stack the deck when learning. The deeper dives aren’t going anywhere

 

[psychocabbage]

PADI has their guidlines and others vary. I am NAUI certified. My first real OW dive (I dont call checkout dives in a quarry OW.. Much too controlled) was in Cozumel. 80ft. Was I past my limit? No. 130 is the basic OW limit in NAUI. Whats the difference btw the two?

I have found that this propegation of "you are narced when you get past xx" is just a bunch of generalization.

Me, my wife and 2 of our 3 daughters have all hung out at 103ft and not had any issues.. The wife and I along with 1 other person were the only ones to successfully complete our Advanced dives down to 116ft in pitch black. When we surfaced, exactly where we were supposed to, we found all the other students got scared and bailed. It was dark and nothing but the 2ft in front of your light could be seen. .So I kept an eye on my dept gauge and compass, kept on track and waited where we were supposed to be for the time we were supposed to wait.

My 16yd old did Devils Throat with us last summer. That was fun. 123ft. We dont do depth for the thrill. I think for us, its more of going where not everyone goes. Sure lots of divers will do Devils Throat, but far more do Palancar Gardens and whatnot.

I often read on here how there isnt much to see past xx ft.. That isnt always true.. Some of us look for odd things.. I have a love hate relationship with hydroids.. so while I hate them they love to hit me when I am not wearing my full suit. I do enjoy seeing them and some of the really big ones are deep.

I agree with one of the posts in the begining.. Its all about what you are comfortable with. Stay in your comfort zone and life will be peachy! My kids know that they can call a dive for whatever reason without any of us being mad or upset. We would rather they feel safe. There is always another dive if you ensure you live to dive again.

 

[Blackwood]

I have a well-developed sense of self-preservation, but I found no reason to feel uncomfortable about these dives. What am I missing?

I'm not sure you're missing anything, but I'll echo what Walter said. The primary concern is the increased rate at which you'll consume gas. The secondary concern is increased narcosis.

Certification limits are primarily "course limits." Most open water programs are limited to about 60 feet, and conventional wisdom is that unsupervised divers not proceed deeper without first gaining some experience.

My first real OW dive ... was in Cozumel. 80ft. Was I past my limit? No. 130 is the basic OW limit in NAUI. Whats the difference btw the two?

50 feet.

 

[rstofer]

PADI has their guidlines and others vary. I am NAUI certified. My first real OW dive (I dont call checkout dives in a quarry OW.. Much too controlled) was in Cozumel. 80ft. Was I past my limit? No. 130 is the basic OW limit in NAUI. Whats the difference btw the two?

Hm...

Way back in '88 I took the NAUI sequence of 3 levels: OW I - 40', OW II - 60', Advaned OW - 100' (I think).

Sure, the dive tables go to 130' but I would be very surprised if NAUI recommended 130' for 'Scuba Diver' (OW) level divers. If that were the case, why offer 'Advanced Scuba Diver' at all?

In fact, PADI AOW only recommends 100' today. That last 30' on the table is beyond the recommended limits.

Even though the NAUI OW I course was far superior to the new OW programs, the depth was seriously restricted. What it does is drive new divers right into the OW II class where they get more supervised dives. Seems right to me!

But there are no scuba police so every diver can decide for themselves.

However, it is worth remembering the father-son recently certified OW team that attempted 185' off of San Diego. Only the son survived. This was a serious example of failed air management and diving beyond training levels.

Richard

 

[boulderjohn]

In many ways, it is much easier to dive at 100 feet than at 60 feet. Changes in depth do not impact your buoyancy nearly as much. If you are on a wreck, you can find it very easy to get absorbed in viewing all the interesting details without feeling as much of a concern to work with your diving skills.

That is a big part of the problem.

You can get wrapped up in what you are seeing. Add a touch of narcosis and the lack of understanding of how fast you will be using up your air at 4 atmospheres of pressure, and you may suddenly find yourself at 100 feet without as much air as you need for your ascent.

Then comes the next problem. You are in an emergency situation. Do you have the experience to make a good decision about what to do next, or will you have a "OMG, I have to get to the surface fast!" reaction?

There is a thread in the accidents forum about just such a situation. Although the facts are not clear because the news reports are even more garbled then usual, it appears that a relatively inexperienced diver did exactly what I just described and is now recovering from the paralysis brought on by a severe DCS hit.

In summary, yes you can dive to those depths, and beginners do it all the time without incident. If nothing goes wrong, they have great dives.

If nothing goes wrong.

The real question is whether you have the skills to plan the dive appropriately, watch your air supply carefully, and make sound decisions if something does go wrong.

 

[ringmod65]

But there are also unknown unknowns,
The ones we don't know
We don't know.

Former Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld
Feb. 12, 2002, Department of Defense news briefing

 

[diver 85]

We(wife, daughter & myself) were doing 100'+ dives in Belize after about 15 to 20 'local' dives ---back in the mid 80's...2 months later we all did the North Wall in Grand Cayman to 125'....