Max depth for new divers

[PaulChristenson]

Thanks Paul. ScubaKimmie, the DAN chart says the standard plan only covers PLANNED depth to 130'. I'm not sure what that actually means.

It means if they recover your body below 130', they could refuse to pay...

 

[Sasquatch]

Why have the guidelines? Probably 2 big reasons, safety and money.

Safety? There is no question that as you go deeper the risk goes up. You are farther from air, perhaps have little or no light in some cases. You are also becoming mentally impaired and at some point will cross over into narcosis. With stuff like that going on it can make sense to logg a few dives and to perhaps be exposed to the depths under controlled conditions the first time or 2 down there.

Money? You could take a full semester or year long dive class like some college programs offer and have this all rolled into one massive learning experience. The problem is that this is too daunting for many prosective divers so the course has been pared down to just enough to get you diving. The ommited training is sold as AOW and other specialties. It's all about getting people into diving and continuing education.

Why is it ignored?
In some cases I am sure that ignorance is bliss and divers don't appreciate what may happen. Some divers are more naturally comfortable and are inherent risk takers. Some of these divers are always on guided dives and make the assumption that there is safety in numbers and in having an experienced DM or guide.

As for the operators, again it's all about $$. They feel that with a signed waiver and a willing diver under guided conditions the whole thing is an acceptable risk to book a seat on the boat.

At the end of the day it is a self regulated industry that we enjoy on an international basis no less. Do you need an AOW card to dive to the deeper recreational depths? Certainly not, self study, good mentors and dumb luck are all common options.

Pete

Pete hit it the best in my opinion. Becoming familiar with the affects of nitrogen narcosis is VERY important. He was the first to mention that.

The rest of his post I thought was relevent and worth repeating, too.

Sea ya!

 

[DivingCRNA]

What they mean by "One of Those" is that you are regurgitating PADI pablum instead of thinking for yourself about your own safety.

Your reluctance to go deeper than 60 feet will probably be better recieved if you put it in terms of your comfort, instead of the arbitrary limits set by a training agency.

Also-remember that dive depth and difficulty do not necessarily correlate. I have a friend who did his trimix cert in florida and thought 200 feet in Florida was super easy, but in the lake in the midwest it is a colder, darker, much more challenging dive. Or-15 feet deep, but with an overhead is much more difficult and dangerous than 70 feet in warm, clear, ocean, open water conditions.

It is all relative. Just like dating is, here in the Ozarks!

Just food for thought.

Ok. I have a question.

In my PADI book it says that the maximum depth for people with an Open Water cert is 60'. Advanced Open Water is up to 100' and should not exceed 130'. Right?

So WHY, when I get on dive boats with my Open Water C-card, do we routinely do dives to 80-90 feet? And when I mention to people who talk about going deep, that I am not comfortable with that (I only have about 14 dives under my weight belt) I get a reply like "Oh you're not one of THOSE". Like I am too scared or wimpy to go deeper.

I have been to 80-90 feet obviously and it really doesn't bother me. But at the same time I am more comfortable at shallower depths and prefer them because there is lots to see and it is usually brighter.

I just don't understand why these guidelines were established if nobody follows them. Or am I being overly cautious?

 

[DiverBeth]

As someone who is still a newbie I appreciate the concensus of stay within your comfort level. My dive instructor last year stressed that first of all you can see most things at the 40-60 ft depths. Secondly, the deeper you go the shorter your dive. Thirdly, when you're out of your comfort zone you're more likely to encounter problems.

On my first dive trip I jumped in (3rd dive of the trip) not feeling well. As soon as I hit the water I went from bad to very bad and felt like panicing. I called the dive and the dive master helped me back to the boat. So I missed a dive. The rest of my group had a great dive. When they came back up they were concerned about me and that I was ok. Everyone said I did the right thing and that I didn't push it.

I agree that if other divers don't respect your comfort level regardless of experience they are losers.

 

[Damselfish]

Thanks Paul. ScubaKimmie, the DAN chart says the standard plan only covers PLANNED depth to 130'. I'm not sure what that actually means.

My understanding is that if you were to accidentally go beyond 130' as part of the accident, as part of things generally heading south, that would be covered. As opposed to just intentionally diving past 130' and then something happened. Don't recall where I read this could have just been someone else's, speculation but it makes sense to me. How exactly they would always tell for sure is another matter.

 

[zinnia7]

What they mean by "One of Those" is that you are regurgitating PADI pablum instead of thinking for yourself about your own safety.

Your reluctance to go deeper than 60 feet will probably be better recieved if you put it in terms of your comfort, instead of the arbitrary limits set by a training agency.

Gosh....if you can't trust the "experts" who train you...then who can you trust?

I'm not regurgitating anything. I just happened to read that when I was scanning my book and I thought about my own comfort issues with depth. I guess I started all this to see if there was anyone like me who thought that perhaps new people should not be pushing limits without training.

There is obviously a lot more to deep diving than what I have learned in my Open Water classes. That is why they have advanced classes, n'est pas? There are so many more variables - especially when it comes to air consumption. How much you need to ascend etc. Maybe I am worried more about my husband/buddy than me. He runs out of air so quickly and really needs to work on that. I would feel better about him "working on it" in shallow water.

I really didn't mean to stir up so much drama. But I do appreciate all of the advice. You know what I think my biggest downfall was?? Joining DAN and having access to read all of the fatality and accident reports. I probably should not have done that. I read so much about narcosis and problems at depth. Yep...that is probably what started this whole thing.

 

[fmw625]

I am OW PADI, My first few dives were 45 fsw or less. They were great dives. In Cozumel we went to 85 fsw. These were great dives. In Belize we went to 55 fsw. Wonderful dives. I would go deeper if necessary but would stay with in NDL. The reason I like shallower dives is there I get more bottom time, the lighting is better, I usually bring a disposable under camera that doesn't have a flash and get better pics to share with my non-diving wife.

 

[Diver Dennis]

Zin, as far as the accident reports go, they can be a good learning tool but the fact remains that diving is quite safe and if you can get to the dive site alive, you've conquered the most dangerous part of the journey, except maybe getting home again. Dive to the depth you feel comfortable at but just make sure to communicate that to the dive shop before you go. Your comfort level will increase as you dive more and your husbands air consumption should improve too.

Thanks Paul and Damselfish, I'll have to look into that a bit more.

 

[Diver Dennis]

When you sign up for the dives, ask about their destinations and tell them the sort of diving you want to do for the money you're paying them. If they try to stay too ambiguous or don't offer the sorts of destinations you want, move on to the next dive operator. Consider it part of the vacation planning - you're selecting a destination for a reason, wall diving, reef diving, sea turtles, etc, so start your dive plan from your home telephone. Even if the trip is arranged by your LDS or a travel agent, learn the particulars early on - it's easier to negotiate and change things, or if everything's set in stone you may decide to go on a completely different trip.

It's all the more important at 1 dive trip a year - it's an awful lot of money to spend flying and hotelling to not get to do exactly what you want with your money. Comfort level notwithstanding, for me it's what do I get to see balanced against bottom time - I'd rather spend 75 minutes at 20 feet than 10 minutes at 90 feet unless what's at 90 feet is really compelling, especially if 6-8 tanks has to last me a whole year :11:.

What H2Andy said and Jim reiterated is true - it's a recommendation. It's more illustrative to tell a student that's learning 74 other things at the same time 'you can go to this point on your depth gauge' than a fuzzy 'dive to your comfort level'. Wull how deep is that? Uh, you know, until you're not comfortable any more.

What many others are saying is true, don't do a dive that you're not comfortable doing (and do have the courage and conviction to do that when necessary), but you can minimize those situations by nailing down as much as you can before you give them your credit card number. I think you'll find that most operators will do what they can to make you happy, but that's harder to do once a group is heading out of a marina.

Oh sure, Diver Dennis says in 2 sentences what it's taken me so long to type. Well, I've got too much time invested in this, so I'm posting it anyway!

Please post away. It helps to get everyone's opinion and your answer was much more entertaining than mine.

 

[DivingCRNA]

There is nothing for you to be defensive or dramatic about. I tried to help and give you some insight.

As for trusting "experts".... You are ultimately responsible for you own safety, so understanding the reasoning for limits is important.

Gosh....if you can't trust the "experts" who train you...then who can you trust?

I'm not regurgitating anything. I just happened to read that when I was scanning my book and I thought about my own comfort issues with depth. I guess I started all this to see if there was anyone like me who thought that perhaps new people should not be pushing limits without training.

There is obviously a lot more to deep diving than what I have learned in my Open Water classes. That is why they have advanced classes, n'est pas? There are so many more variables - especially when it comes to air consumption. How much you need to ascend etc. Maybe I am worried more about my husband/buddy than me. He runs out of air so quickly and really needs to work on that. I would feel better about him "working on it" in shallow water.

I really didn't mean to stir up so much drama. But I do appreciate all of the advice. You know what I think my biggest downfall was?? Joining DAN and having access to read all of the fatality and accident reports. I probably should not have done that. I read so much about narcosis and problems at depth. Yep...that is probably what started this whole thing.