Marketing: Are we ok, or do we need help?

[Trace Malinowski]

Diving instructors are only "really worth" what people are willing to pay, irrespective of how many divers there are.

Ah, true that. Now, we just have to make people realize they may not want one who wants to make less in one class than a golf pro in 3 hours.

And, make competing instructors not want to be part of that model and to get the education needed to matter.

And, shops not to want to treat education as a loss leader.

And, Akimbo is right.

And, back to that career change before it is too late.

Truck driving school? Masters degree? Suicide?

 

[Wookie]

Pay scales for both are determined by competition. The price rises when there aren’t enough people standing in line to do the job.

Not always. Let's look at Commercial diving school. Tuition is what, 10 grand for enough training for an ADCI card? Then buy a superlite or a Gorsky or whatever for another few grand, then be a tender for months or years if you can find a job before you get to use your new toys, and you're never going into sat, where the big money is made.

They're lining up for financial aid at the Ocean Corp, Young Memorial, etc.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Not always. Let's look at Commercial diving school. Tuition is what, 10 grand for enough training for an ADCI card? Then buy a superlite or a Gorsky or whatever for another few grand, then be a tender for months or years if you can find a job before you get to use your new toys, and you're never going into sat, where the big money is made.

They're lining up for financial aid at the Ocean Corp, Young Memorial, etc.

Which is why commercial diving school didn't make my list and suicide did.

 

[Wookie]

Which is why commercial diving school didn't make my list and suicide did.

Sorry, the point was that Commercial Diving schools buck the trend of supply and demand. There are more commercial divers (or, more properly, ADCI card holders) than you can shake a stick at, and there are a few jobs for them. Most jobs are for $200 a day tenders, and that's just crap work. Military fellows with GI bill benefits and others are beating down the door to get admitted, hell, The Ocean Corp has a $100 application fee just to get the application reviewed.

Commercial diving schools have good marketing. We need to take a lesson. Trace, go figure out how they do it, then come sell it to us. It isn't by using SEO.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Frank, I think that is PADI's marketing scheme for "Go Pro."

 

[Wookie]

Frank, I think that is PADI's marketing scheme for "Go Pro."

The problem with diving is, us old cynical bastards are more likely to say "no, we really don't want you." Back to the gruff boat captains and shop owners problems. I've said a thousand times that we're our own worst enemy.

 

[RJP]

Sorry, the point was that Commercial Diving schools buck the trend of supply and demand. There are more commercial divers (or, more properly, ADCI card holders) than you can shake a stick at, and there are a few jobs for them.

Actually, Frank, this proves the supply/demand thing. You're simply confusing the demand for commercial divers with the apparently larger supply of idiots willing to pony up $10k to get trained for a job with no prospects.

 

[Akimbo]

…And, back to that career change before it is too late…

The may be another option, but like all new businesses concepts, there is high risk.

I have only taken one recreational dive class since 1962 that was worth spit. It cost well over $1000 (all-in) and lasted 4½ full days plus hotel and food — the Performance Freediving Course. I am sure legions of people told them that it could never work. Now there are several competitors. These divers go around the country teaching the classes as well as out of their home-base in Florida. They have status gained through competitive freediving, and a shipload of satisfied customers.

What if a small group of accomplished instructors banded together and offered a really intensive high-end course? Instead of traveling, pick a place with good but demanding diving conditions. Students would end up with a pile of standard merit badges so they could get air fills plus a wall-hanger certificate.

If marketed properly, I can see parents willing to pay for their teenager to attend the “best”, divers disillusioned by the current training mill, and people willing to pay for the prestige.

There’s the rub. In order to be prestigious you have to craft, develop, and earn a reputation. Factor in that there will be graduates that die diving and how the reputation will survive. For some people, part of the allure will be the high price. Charge a butt-load of money but make sure everyone feels they got great value. Imagine a crazy eye-watering price and triple it. Cater to the adventure sector and do everything possible to discourage the casual vacation diver.

Give customers some unique experiences like a deep chamber dives and a taste of surface supplied diving. Perhaps you could work a deal with a commercial diving school to access facilities. Their incentive is the possibility of getting a few recreational to commercial converts. Expose them to how rebreathers work and to understand the principals (without qualifying them to use them). Let them experience 15 minutes on a DPV and whatever else you can. People will learn a lot of indirectly related skills at the same time.

I hope someone finds the “formula” and makes lots of money from the school and lecture circuit. The lasting contribution to society will be to help reverse the terrible direction dive training is going. At this rate, there will be government intervention in US dive training.

 

[Wookie]

The may be another option, but like all new businesses concepts, there is high risk.

I have only taken one recreational dive class since 1962 that was worth spit. It cost well over $1000 (all-in) and lasted 4½ full days plus hotel and food — the Performance Freediving Course. I am sure legions of people told them that it could never work. Now there are several competitors. These divers go around the country teaching the classes as well as out of their home-base in Florida. They have status gained through competitive freediving, and a shipload of satisfied customers.

What if a small group of accomplished instructors banded together and offered a really intensive high-end course? Instead of traveling, pick a place with good but demanding diving conditions. Students would end up with a pile of standard merit badges so they could get air fills plus a wall-hanger certificate.

If marketed properly, I can see parents willing to pay for their teenager to attend the “best”, divers disillusioned by the current training mill, and people willing to pay for the prestige.

There’s the rub. In order to be prestigious you have to craft, develop, and earn a reputation. Factor in that there will be graduates that die diving and how the reputation will survive. For some people, part of the allure will be the high price. Charge a butt-load of money but make sure everyone feels they got great value. Imagine a crazy eye-watering price and triple it. Cater to the adventure sector and do everything possible to discourage the casual vacation diver.

Give customers some unique experiences like a deep chamber dives and a taste of surface supplied diving. Perhaps you could work a deal with a commercial diving school to access facilities. Their incentive is the possibility of getting a few recreational to commercial converts. Expose them to how rebreathers work and to understand the principals (without qualifying them to use them). Let them experience 15 minutes on a DPV and whatever else you can. People will learn a lot of indirectly related skills at the same time.

I hope someone finds the “formula” and makes lots of money from the school and lecture circuit. The lasting contribution to society will be to help reverse the terrible direction dive training is going. At this rate, there will be government intervention in US dive training.

Pro-Dive did this, and it worked. Then someone died and it didn't. Hall's does this. Any CDC does this. It does work.
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[Akimbo]

Sorry, the point was that Commercial Diving schools buck the trend of supply and demand…

Not really because they don’t turn out divers with enough experience and skill to stand in the sat diver line. That line is not that long because so many commercial dive school grads don’t or can’t make the rest of the investment.

Not unlike most professions, it takes years after formal education to really get good at the job. Divers have to learn enough and gain the confidence of a diving contractor that they will accomplish whatever they are asked. The consequences of failing are measured against DSV day rates in the mid-6-digit range, not diver salaries and depth pay. Add crane and support vessels that are standing by waiting on you and the numbers get into millions/day.

Commercial dive schools benefit from the same mentality as all the 3-5 letter acronyms that dominate recreational training. Both benefit from people who love diving and have dreams of making a living at it. They also have the allure of the lottery because the best do make a lot of money. Unfortunately also like the lottery, a lot of divers lose their money in short order.

Don’t think that supply and demand hasn’t taken its toll on sat divers too. They earn a small fraction as divers did at the peak in the late 1960s and early 70s.