Lion Air flight JT610 crashes into sea after take-off from Jakarta...

[Dan]

Good question.

At this point, a problem has been noted. Remember the investigation is still continuing to fully understand the chain of events. When a defect or problem is found during an investigation - even if it's not a contributory factor a notice goes out to all operators as a first instance.

In the second instance the manufacturer will be working around the clock to find solutions and fixes which can then be communicated to all operators. While the Manufacturer will advise only the FAA (or other agencies) can issue a notice to ground the fleet and even if they do, it only applies to operators or aircraft within their jurisdiction ( which means that aircraft not under their control will be denied access to airspace controlled by the FAA)

In this case, from the link posted by Chilly

"“Boeing and the FAA are providing operators with information and a reminder of how to address a stabilizer trim nose down condition,”

"“There are several steps a crew can take, but in the end they switch the electric stabilizer trim off and revert to manual trim."

So in this case its reinforcing to operators and crew the steps to be taken if they have a spurious indication (remember there are redundant and separate indication systems including basic flight instruments which aren't operated by computers)

To hopefully reassure you, the 737 is a proven design, I'd keep flying on one.

But I just don't like to hear:

“The Wall Street Journal, also citing unnamed “people familiar with the matter,” writes “the moves are the first public indication that investigators suspect a possible software glitch or misinterpretation by pilots – related to an essential system that measures how high or low a plane’s nose is pointed – may have played an important part in the sequence of events that caused the Boeing 737 Max 8 to plunge into the Java Sea.”citing unnamed “people familiar with the matter,””

“Two U.S. airlines fly the Boeing 737 Max 8. Southwest has 26 while American Airlines has 16. Combined, the airlines have hundreds more on order.”

‘United Airlines flies another variant, the 737 Max 9, which also is covered by Boeing's bulletin. None of those U.S. airlines have reported the issue covered by Boeing’s bulletin regarding its 737 Max aircraft.’

I fly domestically with Southwest, AA & United. I need to check which airplane I’ll be flying with from now on, staying clear away from Boeing 737 Max airplanes until they “fix” the problem, if this problem is the cause of the crash.

 

[billt4sf]

More blame to go around:

In Indonesia Plane Crash Inquiry, New Focus on Possible Aircraft Problems


"Mr. Ony said that part of his investigation centered on why the plane had not been grounded by Lion Air, given that it had experienced multiple airspeed problems.

“This is strange,” he said in an interview on Wednesday. “We found several events that we should investigate, but they didn’t report them.”

 

[Dogbowl]

Good question.

At this point, a problem has been noted. Remember the investigation is still continuing to fully understand the chain of events. When a defect or problem is found during an investigation - even if it's not a contributory factor a notice goes out to all operators as a first instance.

In the second instance the manufacturer will be working around the clock to find solutions and fixes which can then be communicated to all operators. While the Manufacturer will advise only the FAA (or other agencies) can issue a notice to ground the fleet and even if they do, it only applies to operators or aircraft within their jurisdiction ( which means that aircraft not under their control will be denied access to airspace controlled by the FAA)

In this case, from the link posted by Chilly

"“Boeing and the FAA are providing operators with information and a reminder of how to address a stabilizer trim nose down condition,”

"“There are several steps a crew can take, but in the end they switch the electric stabilizer trim off and revert to manual trim."

So in this case its reinforcing to operators and crew the steps to be taken if they have a spurious indication (remember there are redundant and separate indication systems including basic flight instruments which aren't operated by computers)

To hopefully reassure you, the 737 is a proven design, I'd keep flying on one.

I do understand your point...and thanks for trying to reassure me, but my very human reaction is that I’m uneasy about flying on one of these planes (not the 737 in general but the newer “MAX” version). Air Canada has 19 in their fleet while Garuda has 1. And a whole lotta other airlines have them too.

 

[Dan]

More blame to go around:

In Indonesia Plane Crash Inquiry, New Focus on Possible Aircraft Problems


"Mr. Ony said that part of his investigation centered on why the plane had not been grounded by Lion Air, given that it had experienced multiple airspeed problems.

“This is strange,” he said in an interview on Wednesday. “We found several events that we should investigate, but they didn’t report them.”

“John Cox, the former executive air safety chairman of the Air Line Pilots Association in the United States and now the chief executive of Safety Operating Systems, a consulting firm, said that unlike previous versions of the Boeing 737, the Max 8 has an automated system that can take control of the aircraft and cause it to point its nose down sharply without pilot instruction.”

Not sure if such automation is a good idea.

 

[k4kafka]

Not a big conspiracy theorist,however...lots of mysterious plane crashes in that part of the world lately. Speculation seems to center on the aircraft,software glitches etc.,everything except possible deliberate actions taken by the flight crew,or persons unknown...

 

[divinh]

“John Cox, the former executive air safety chairman of the Air Line Pilots Association in the United States and now the chief executive of Safety Operating Systems, a consulting firm, said that unlike previous versions of the Boeing 737, the Max 8 has an automated system that can take control of the aircraft and cause it to point its nose down sharply without pilot instruction.”

Not sure if such automation is a good idea.

Sharp nose down might be for stall situations, to build up speed to regain lift.

 

[Altamira]

In a effort to keep things in perspective, we should all understand that pilot error and other human factors still account for about 70-80% of all aircraft fatalities. If you want to worry about something as you board the airplane, I would start with the pilots' competence, experience, complacency, training, mental state, and whether or not they have had adequate crew rest. Deficiencies in those areas is far more likely to kill you than a mechanical problem. Personally I would not hesitate to board a B-737 Max tomorrow. In fact, if you want to send me a couple tickets on Southwest Airlines, I will even take my wife on one of the Max aircraft.

 

[Dan]

Another Lion Air incident: Lion Air plane aborts take-off after wing hits pole on runway

 

[Diving Dubai]

unlike previous versions of the Boeing 737, the Max 8 has an automated system that can take control of the aircraft and cause it to point its nose down sharply without pilot instruction.”

CONTEXT:

All Airbus Models are "Fly by wire", I can't comment on Boeing, I suspect Dreamliner (787) is too

With Fly by wire NONE of the flight controls are directly linked to the actual components. The inputs go into computers, the pilots "request" a control input and if the parameters are correct the control surface moves.

Modern cars are drive by wire, your throttle and steering wheel aren't directly connected - they go via computers.

I remember the brouhaha of the general public when twin jets were introduced, and the Certification and validation to allow these to fly across the Atlantic directly.

Nowadays no one gives a second thought to flying across the Pacific in a 777. You'd be shocked to find out how many computers run each engine.

There's also less margin for maintenance error with computers - change a box and plug another box into it to carry out a test. Mechanical linkages with lots of nuts and bolts to come loose however...

 

[lowflyer]

Another Lion Air incident: Lion Air plane aborts take-off after wing hits pole on runway

Given the level of incompetence resulting in that incident, the passengers might consider themselves lucky they didn't actually take off to face something more lethal.