Let's chat about DSLR vs Point and Shoot - looking for some wisdom / experience

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As the TG6 us also rated for 15m depth without a case if you are using a case and had a minor leak it is not life ending for the camera itself. That is not the case for non waterproof cameras where housings have leaked and they got flooded. No issues with mine leaking so far and have taken it down to 45m depth. I have never had any fogging or moisture with the Olympus PT 059 housing.

Also when you close the door and then using locking mechanism you really feel it has to be firmly closed before locking. Then there is a small button to lock the locking mechanism. Risk of accidently opening the housing is nil if properly closed and locked.
One of the things I really like about the TG6 is the redundancy. That said, since I got away from Canon's case I never had another problem. Ikelite cases are solid.

I've heard AOI makes the Olympus OEM cases as well. It comes down to being able to reconfigure the camera and housing for different activities. I like the idea of adding lenses/ports and being able to optimize my equipment for what I'm trying to do. The Pen E-LP9/10 just seems like a more flexible setup. As a bonus I expect to be able to take some pretty good photos on land.

One difference that really stood out to me was that you had full manual control of the LP/9-10. The TG6 lets you set aperature priority, but you are still stuck with some shutter speed compromises and less than optimal aperature behavior.

My other observation was that the camera gear is part of the equation, but you really need lights and in particular good strobes if you want pictures that are very good. This synchs with my experience using ambient light on the G9. The AOI case has an led trigger using the hotshoe to fire the strobes. It's a brilliant alternative to using the on-board flash which will burn the battery.

I'm pretty much sold on the PEN E-LP10. I want to sleep on it and maybe wait a day or two before I pull the trigger.
 
To tarponchik,

On any compact but especially newer ones (Canon G7X II / III and Sony RX100 V/ Va / VI / VII) with a 24mm native lens focal length you may have to "tap" the zoom to eliminate vignetting. It will depend on what WA lens you've attached, what housing you're using, etc. Yes, the beautiful Nauticam WWL-1 (28mm) or newer WWL-C are great but work best on a Nauticam housing. Other brand wet lenses may not have as good results.

I would contend tapping from 24mm to 28mm using lenses designed for 28mm isn't a huge deal and maybe equivalent to backing up 6" - 12" or so. You could shoot everything full wide if you only see mild vignetting then crop the corners easily in post.
Can you explain what tapping the zoom means? My attempts to google the subject only gave me zoom as in the video conference tool.
 
It's a brilliant alternative to using the on-board flash which will burn the battery.
The pop-up flash on my OM10 can be set to 1/64 power so that it will trigger an extermal srrobe but is not enough light to significantly affect the camera battery.
 
Can you explain what tapping the zoom means? My attempts to google the subject only gave me zoom as in the video conference tool.
It means briefly touching the zoom in/out button so that is only changes the focal length from 24 to 28mm...just a tap on the button.
 
The pop-up flash on my OM10 can be set to 1/64 power so that it will trigger an extermal srrobe but is not enough light to significantly affect the camera battery.
I think backscatter even recommends doing that with the LED trigger. The LED is just a nice touch in the case.
 
What is ILC? Sorry, I don't recognize that acronym.
Interchangeable Lens Camera.
My pricing numbers are based on buying the 60mm lens used.
I'd be careful about fixating on the 60mm lens; on M43 it is has an angle of view equivalent to that of a 120mm lens on full frame, which makes framing quite tight. It's great if you're shooting tiny stuff, but you've indicated a preference for medium-sized subjects earlier in this thread - for that, 45mm or even 30mm may be a better fit.

The Pen E-LP9/10 just seems like a more flexible setup.
There are different kinds of flexibility. With a dedicated lens/port setup, you're locked in to a specific size of subjects for the duration of the dive, whereas with wet lenses, you can adapt to most situations without surfacing.

That said, the ability to shoot macro and wide on the same dive is very situational. Even in places where you have your pick of subjects and scenes (say, Richelieu Rock in Thailand), it's simply a different mindset. Shooting wide-angle, you're hovering over a reef, looking for that nice composition, waiting for the glassfish to frame the coral head just so, or even out in the blue, chasing down a school of barracudas or whatever - there might be macro subjects out there, but you won't see them, because they're so small and camouflaged. Conversely, when you're shooting macro, your face is buried in the reef, looking through every crack and crevice, examining small leaves with a magnifying glass, trying to find that microscopic critter that will look oh so cool when blown up to a hundred times life size. That beautiful reefscape might be all around you, but you won't see it because that's not where your attention is centered. Yeah, if a whale shark shows up, someone will yank on your fin - but how often does that happen?

Switching also isn't instant - going from macro to wide, you need to take off your close-up lens, dock it, undock the wide lens, attach it to the port, zoom out, change aperture/shutter/ISO to wide-angle settings, reposition strobes, adjust strobe power, possibly attach diffusers... by the time you are done, that shark is likely long gone. You want to take quality photos of sharks, you splash down with the purpose of shooting sharks and don't spread your attention to macro.

My other observation was that the camera gear is part of the equation, but you really need lights and in particular good strobes if you want pictures that are very good.
This is unquestionably true. Photography is all about light, everything else is secondary. No light - no photo.

The AOI case has an led trigger using the hotshoe to fire the strobes. It's a brilliant alternative to using the on-board flash which will burn the battery.
The primary utility of an LED trigger is not in battery savings but in ability to fire bursts. For example, my strobes (Retra Pro with superchargers) can shoot half-power at 3 frames per second pretty much indefinitely - the limiting factor is the buffer on my camera. However, most pop-up camera flashes take at least a second or so to recycle, which makes this capability inaccessible.

Keep in mind, however, that some strobes have low sensitivity optical receivers that have issues triggering on relatively weak light pulses from an LED trigger, in comparison with a strong signal from a camera flash. Sea & Sea YS-D3 is particularly famous for this. If you're buying used, Inon Z-240 (out of production now) had four revisions, and it's only the type 4 that features a high-sensitivity optical sensor for use with LED triggers. Also, if you're using LEDs, make sure that you get 613-core fiber optic cables rather than single core - they are a bit more expensive, but they get much better light transmission.

I'm pretty much sold on the PEN E-LP10. I want to sleep on it and maybe wait a day or two before I pull the trigger.
Me, I'd wait a little bit. OM Digital (former Olympus camera division) just released a new flagship model, the OM-1. If you watch the classifieds forums in the coming months, there's a good chance you could snag a used EM-1 II or even III setup at a significant discount from someone who is upgrading, which will give you a slightly better sensor and much faster autofocus (E-M1 series and E-M5 III have PDAF; PEN series and earlier E-M cameras don't).

Here, for example, a full, almost ready-to-dive E-M1 Mark II system in a Nauticam housing, with camera, lenses and ports, lacking only arms and strobes, was offered for $3500 last month. Parts of it have already been sold, but with a new flagship out, I'd expect more and better deals to appear in the near future.

Yes, the beautiful Nauticam WWL-1 (28mm) or newer WWL-C are great but work best on a Nauticam housing. Other brand wet lenses may not have as good results.
It's a bit more complex than that. WWL-1 comes in two mount options - 67mm and Nauticam bayonet. These can be swapped by undoing a few screws. The 67mm mount will work with any housing equally well as long as the port fits the lens closely (i.e. minimal distance between camera lens front element and the wet lens rear element). However, WWL-1B and WWL-C come with Nauticam bayonet mount built in and it cannot be removed. Nauticam offers #83250 M67 to Bayonet Mount Converter II, but there is a catch - the 67mm threads on that converter are on the inside of a narrow groove. Nauticam's own flat ports have the threading on the inside of a fairly thin protruding lip, which fits inside this groove, for example:

1645241893799.png


But some manufacturers tend to use a wider flange on the front of their ports, like this:

1645241952742.png

Or this:
1645242198073.png


...which precludes the installation of Nauticam's adapter.

Therefore, if your port's front is compatible with Nauticam's bayonet adapter, you can use WWL-1B or WWL-C without issues; if not - you're restricted to WWL-1.
 
One of the things I really like about the TG6 is the redundancy. That said, since I got away from Canon's case I never had another problem. Ikelite cases are solid. I'm pretty much sold on the PEN E-LP10. I want to sleep on it and maybe wait a day or two before I pull the trigger.

Seems like a tossup but enjoy what ever you buy.

MANTIS.JPG
 
Interchangeable Lens Camera.

I'd be careful about fixating on the 60mm lens; on M43 it is has an angle of view equivalent to that of a 120mm lens on full frame, which makes framing quite tight. It's great if you're shooting tiny stuff, but you've indicated a preference for medium-sized subjects earlier in this thread - for that, 45mm or even 30mm may be a better fit.
I had assumed using some flip style diopters with it.
There are different kinds of flexibility. With a dedicated lens/port setup, you're locked in to a specific size of subjects for the duration of the dive, whereas with wet lenses, you can adapt to most situations without surfacing.
After talking to someone at Backscatter I realized that it's probably better to set the camera up for what I want to do on that dive as opposed to trying to do everything on every dive. While that does provide some limits, I can live with that.

I dive mostly from a boat with a small group. My upcoming trip to Cozumel in May is going to provide fewer macro opportunities then say a trip to Roatan that I have scheduled for August.
That said, the ability to shoot macro and wide on the same dive is very situational. Even in places where you have your pick of subjects and scenes (say, Richelieu Rock in Thailand), it's simply a different mindset. Shooting wide-angle, you're hovering over a reef, looking for that nice composition, waiting for the glassfish to frame the coral head just so, or even out in the blue, chasing down a school of barracudas or whatever - there might be macro subjects out there, but you won't see them, because they're so small and camouflaged. Conversely, when you're shooting macro, your face is buried in the reef, looking through every crack and crevice, examining small leaves with a magnifying glass, trying to find that microscopic critter that will look oh so cool when blown up to a hundred times life size. That beautiful reefscape might be all around you, but you won't see it because that's not where your attention is centered. Yeah, if a whale shark shows up, someone will yank on your fin - but how often does that happen?

Switching also isn't instant - going from macro to wide, you need to take off your close-up lens, dock it, undock the wide lens, attach it to the port, zoom out, change aperture/shutter/ISO to wide-angle settings, reposition strobes, adjust strobe power, possibly attach diffusers... by the time you are done, that shark is likely long gone. You want to take quality photos of sharks, you splash down with the purpose of shooting sharks and don't spread your attention to macro.


This is unquestionably true. Photography is all about light, everything else is secondary. No light - no photo.


The primary utility of an LED trigger is not in battery savings but in ability to fire bursts. For example, my strobes (Retra Pro with superchargers) can shoot half-power at 3 frames per second pretty much indefinitely - the limiting factor is the buffer on my camera. However, most pop-up camera flashes take at least a second or so to recycle, which makes this capability inaccessible.
It still takes far less power to fire the LED's then to fire the internal flash.
Keep in mind, however, that some strobes have low sensitivity optical receivers that have issues triggering on relatively weak light pulses from an LED trigger, in comparison with a strong signal from a camera flash. Sea & Sea YS-D3 is particularly famous for this. If you're buying used, Inon Z-240 (out of production now) had four revisions, and it's only the type 4 that features a high-sensitivity optical sensor for use with LED triggers. Also, if you're using LEDs, make sure that you get 613-core fiber optic cables rather than single core - they are a bit more expensive, but they get much better light transmission.
Understood.
Me, I'd wait a little bit. OM Digital (former Olympus camera division) just released a new flagship model, the OM-1. If you watch the classifieds forums in the coming months, there's a good chance you could snag a used EM-1 II or even III setup at a significant discount from someone who is upgrading, which will give you a slightly better sensor and much faster autofocus (E-M1 series and E-M5 III have PDAF; PEN series and earlier E-M cameras don't).
I'll take a glance at these...
Here, for example, a full, almost ready-to-dive E-M1 Mark II system in a Nauticam housing, with camera, lenses and ports, lacking only arms and strobes, was offered for $3500 last month. Parts of it have already been sold, but with a new flagship out, I'd expect more and better deals to appear in the near future.
Yea, he still has the housing for sale unless the listing is stale.
 
Just an opinion, so take it with a grain of salt (and maybe a slice of lime & a shot of tequila), but I would not get too concerned about getting vignetting if you shoot a little wider than the recommended 28mm.

You will likely run your images through some editing software after you get home, but before you show them to your friends. Cropping of the image is pretty simple to do in just about every editing software/app. Vignetting is not a big deal as long as you have your image framed so that the subject is not off to the sides. You will be able to see exactly what the vignette will cover as you compose your shot and if you find that you do have a little vignetting, you can fix it in post.
 

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