Jackson Blue Accident?

[100days-a-year]

Roak,you can always threaten to tell the Techdiver list folks where blacknet isOmar was the 1st to call him out ."It's always precarious at the top ,so many ways to fall and so many willing to see you fall."Tony..Dec23 2001

 

[roakey]

Originally posted by 100days-a-year
Roak,you can always threaten to tell the Techdiver list folks where blacknet is

Never. Folks here think *I'm* bad. I'd hate to see cavers/techdiver/DirQuest members descend on this board.

I *always* supply information. Even if I'm ranting. If I don't have information to add, I don't post.

Roak

 

[Lost Yooper]

DIR isn't a substitution for stupidity. If your brain isn't wired right, and you ignore the obvious, then DIR won't help ya. If you follow strict DIR (WKPP DIR), then something REALLY bad would have to occur to kill ya -- something probably out of your hands.

The track record claim is only that the WKPP hasn't had a death in the 7-8 years that Irvine has directly run the WKPP. DIR was coined by Irvine and was implemented, as such, by him when he took over. I believe the WKPP has had a few deaths prior to Irvine's direction. I've lost my notes regarding this, but one such incident was a cave collapse killing Parker Turner, I think. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. I'll look around for more pre-Irvine (as director) deaths in the WKPP.

Mike

 

[lakesdiver]

Iguana Don,
Nice to know this place will not be allowed to turn into the hate-laden, mud-slinging pit other dive forums have become.

Thanks.

 

[blacknet]

Hello,

Nice to know this place will not be allowed to turn into the hate-laden, mud-slinging pit other dive forums have become.

Well isn't that what it has turned into before I posted?

Ed

 

[roakey]

Originally posted by blacknet
Hello,
Well isn't that what it has turned into before I posted?
Ed

Looking back I see a couple posts about the incident, a prediction from me that soemone will try and associate the death with the WKPP (implying DIR, but I didn't explicitly say that, I wish I had), a couple posts saying we shouldn't associate the death with any group, we should simply learn from it, which I agreed with and then your post trying to associate the death with a group (DIR).

So to answer your question:

"Well isn't that what it has turned into before I posted?"

No, it turned into this [mudslinging] WITH your post, not before.

Roak

 

[Asiandivergal]

Dont jump on me for saying this, it's just that i read somewhere something about cave and wreck divers. It mentioned that some people who venture into tech diving are deep down trying to prove something to themselves and to others, and who have to maintain a "macho" front to their fellow tech divers. For them to abort a dive because of sickness or poor conditions etc would make them appear weak. I would say that this is a common fallacy which befalls many divers, be it an open water novice diver or an experienced cave diver with 1000+ dives under his/her belt.

 

[blacknet]

Asiandivergal,

This is very true indeed. So true in fact you will probably get some nasty responces to that comment from others. Just keep in mind if they are somewhat hostile then they fit that catagory.

Ed

 

[roakey]

Aisiandivergal,

You're completely correct. I'd be willing to bet that “machismo” is the second leading cause in diver deaths right behind inexperience.

Believe me, your statement is right on and rest assured you’re not going to be attacked.

You're also right that we can all learn something from this. To learn, it's important that we look for a cause, rather than trying to place blame on what groups a diver may or may not hang out with, which is why we rankled at blacknet's question about the diver being DIR. If some piece of DIR configured equipment caused the problem, fine, we'll discuss that. But in this case it did not come down to equipment, philosophy or methodology. The person had been told by a doctor not to dive; he had a medical condition that he should not have dived with. It matters not what group he belonged or didn't belong to. He exhibited bad judgement by getting into the water and unfortunately paid for his poor judgement with his life.

Let me aplogize for blacknet using your post as an excuse to get on a soapbox and predict that you will be attacked. He doesn’t understand and therefore doesn’t like the philosophy that many of us follow, and is constantly making feeble attempts to discredit our philosophy whenever he can.

His prediction that you’ll be attacked is wrong, and just adds to the growing list of flawed positions that he’s taken lately.

A quote that I’ve always liked and describes my position on technical diving perfectly is:

“Good technical diving is about reduction of risk, not taking risks.” In other words if you’re a cowboy and have gotten into technical diving for the thrill, you’re a lousy technical diver.

Roak

 

[blacknet]

roakey,

Do NOT put words into my mouth or do anything on my behalf. You have never met me, dove with me and don't know jack about me. You are just assuming what you think you know. We all know what is stated about assuming. Since you preach about rumors and hearsay then don’t show double standards and engage in the same yourself.

However, if you wish to make any form of apology then you can retract your statements until you can prove yourself worthy in posting anything relating to me.

Ed