Is nitrox "briefing" enough without certification?

[Snakekid97]

Hi all,

I have a basic OW certificate with about a dozen OW dives. I recently moved to a coastline, but I haven't gone diving in the ocean in about a year (although I have done a couple of quarry dives since). I recently talked to a local PADI instructor/dive charter owner about easing back into things. After scheduling a date to go out on his charter, I found out they only use nitrox on all of their dives. They claim it's the better way to dive. Their website states " If you are not Nitrox certified, don’t worry, we will give you a Nitrox Briefing that lets you dive Nitrox that day...We will also put a _ Dive Computer on your wrist set for 32% so you can track your NDL."

I have read that I should have a certification for nitrox (which I don't have). My question is: would you trust a "Nitrox briefing that lets you dive Nitrox that day" or does this seem to be a questionable practice? I have no prior experience with Nitrox.

I should add, the charter is a 2-tank trip on reefs 40-60' deep over about a 3-hour period.

Thanks!

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

• Understanding what alerts/alarms for NITROX MOD the computer will produce (one local guy will take students down to 33ft on this very gradually descending sloping area with their computer set to 100% so they experience the various alerts the computer makes, and the first time they seem isn't when its actually happening). To be crystal clear, the student diver is not on 100% O2, just setting the computer to it so it can flip out and the student can observe.

That's a great idea and I'm shamelessly going to steal ... ahem ... use that, but also provide a properly set dive computer for the course. It is important for them to learn on their own computer.

 

[RobPNW]

I think I got a pretty thorough class. I ready the whole book, took a written test, watched an instructional video, the instructor made me do about 5 multi tank, multi enrichment dive scenarios with dive tables, had to demonstrate setting up my computer, and had to do the O2 calibration, gas analysis, tank inspection, labelling etc. I wasn't required to do dives, but I got a credit for 2 tanks that I used later in the week.

 

[azstinger11]

That's a great idea and I'm shamelessly going to steal ... ahem ... use that, but also provide a properly set dive computer for the course. It is important for them to learn on their own computer.

Yeah I really like it as well. I can't count the number of times I've been on a boat and some diver asks the boat DM how to set their computer to NITROX mode .Which tells me that should they exceed their MOD they also may not understand exactly what their computer is telling them.

For students diving shearwater computers he has little laminated cutouts he sticks in his wetnotes he can flash them and have them identify on their displays. All others its just written text or a point and look type of thing. Still think it's really valuable overall though.

 

[tursiops]

Daft question: would a trimix/CCR cert be acceptable?

Every Trimix course I know of has Nitrox as a prerequisite.

I would never want to overestimate the stupidIty of some dive shops/operators, but it makes no sense not to accept the trimix card. Kind of like saying "this trip requires an OW card so I can't accept your AOW card."

 

[NW Dive Dawg]

All of the "learning" information is basically available for little to nothing online on Ebay in books or DVD. PADI, SDI, SSI, etc.... Either you learn it and you know it...or you don't....can't help with that.

As far as analysing, calibrating and marking tanks.....all of that info is easily and also available online. There is no physical reason I can think of as to why watching and understanding a video instruction would be any less effective than watching and understanding a live person demonstrate and explain the exact same information.......with the exception that with the video class you can save it and watch it over and over if anything is unclear.

When it comes to the academics...either you get it or you don't. When it comes to analysing tanks and marking them, and understanding anything and everything about Nitrox.......including MOD's and setting and understanding your computer........ you either get it or you don't.

The ONLY reason I can think of as to anyone would pay any agency for all of this readily available and free information is so that you will have "THE CARD" and you will be honored, regaled, accepted and recognized just so operators can feel better about having their collective asses covered legally.

I am admittedly a contrarian by nature..... and have little respect for any self proclaimed "authority"... and have no problem Photoshopping a PADI Enriched Air cert card and then spending my dollars on an actual portable analyser...

How many times have I gone to Bonaire to Buddy Dive and proudly present my EAN card and they say...."OK, thanks....how much weight do you need". EVERY TIME!

What I'm getting at is that all of the "Nitrox" information is 100% available and free.....so spend your $$ on a decent analyser and know and learn how to use it. I like this one.... Cheers!

Analox O2EII Pro Nitrox Analyzer

An updated version of the O2EII, the O2EII Pro is the ideal portable nitrox analyzer, which can easily be taken on all of your diving adventures. The addition of the hose barb now allows the unit to be

www.scuba.com

​

 

[azstinger11]

All of the "learning" information is basically available for little to nothing online on Ebay in books or DVD. PADI, SDI, SSI, etc.... Either you learn it and you know it...or you don't....can't help with that.

As far as analysing, calibrating and marking tanks.....all of that info is easily and also available online. There is no physical reason I can think of as to why watching and understanding a video instruction would be any less effective than watching and understanding a live person demonstrate and explain the exact same information.......with the exception that with the video class you can save it and watch it over and over if anything is unclear.

When it comes to the academics...either you get it or you don't. When it comes to analysing tanks and marking them, and understanding anything and everything about Nitrox.......including MOD's and setting and understanding your computer........ you either get it or you don't.

The ONLY reason I can think of as to anyone would pay any agency for all of this readily available and free information is so that you will have "THE CARD" and you will be honored, regaled, accepted and recognized just so operators can feel better about having their collective asses covered legally.

I am admittedly a contrarian by nature..... and have little respect for any self proclaimed "authority"... and have no problem Photoshopping a PADI Enriched Air cert card and then spending my dollars on an actual portable analyser...

How many times have I gone to Bonaire to Buddy Dive and proudly present my EAN card and they say...."OK, thanks....how much weight do you need". EVERY TIME!

What I'm getting at is that all of the "Nitrox" information is 100% available and free.....so spend your $$ on a decent analyser and know and learn how to use it. I like this one.... Cheers!

Analox O2EII Pro Nitrox Analyzer

An updated version of the O2EII, the O2EII Pro is the ideal portable nitrox analyzer, which can easily be taken on all of your diving adventures. The addition of the hose barb now allows the unit to be

www.scuba.com

​

Been a few boats that ran both my AOW card (also why they refused my LA County Advanced card, since they didn't have a database to run it against) and my NITROX card against the PADI lookup system. Was told if I hadn't also had a PADI (or major agency) AOW card I wouldn't have been able to board. So yeah... ticket's certs please is a thing. Should it be, is a discussion for a different thread as this is the new divers forum, but it is sufficient to say that is for some locations.

 

[Pavao]

Perfectly OK, and within training standards.
PADI calls this "Dive Today," and is available to any diver at least 12 years old.
You do some paperwork (Risk Release, Medical form), and can even do it on Dive 4 of your OW course...you do not need to already be OW certified. You do NOT have to do all the Knowledge Development stuff, but there is a short briefing about benefits and hazards of Nitrox. You DO have to be shown how to analyze a tank, mark a tank, and set your computer. The instructor has to monitor your analyses, and ensure your computer is set correctly. All this may be credited toward the full Nitrox course.

This is one of those threads that illustrates how much noise and nonsense scubaboard can be, I’ve said it before, often one needs to be an expert on the subject one reads here to be able to filter out what is actually good information.

It took 5 pages, 40 responses, before finally this one came up. Many responding prior to this response are instructors, some responses were quite authoritative in condemning the practice, and not because they dont agree with it, but because they’re unaware of the standards, thinking the operator here is likely questionable.

True there isnt enough information on the op to know that is actually what the operator is doing, but that goes both ways, there isn’t enough info to show operator is doing anything questionable either, but the op‘s question set the tone, “would you trust…”, but valid question from op though, she doesn’t know it is perfectly fine and was smart to ask questions. Like Tursiops, I too knew that it is possible to do a ”discover nitrox”, and the hints for me that it is actually the case here, is the use of 32%, computer and being shallower than 60’ (where 36% would’ve been more common).

From what I read from operators website, it suggests to me they aren’t charging extra for the “discover nitrox”, and I’d make an assumption here, they rather facilitate having all their divers dive nitrox than dive air, this makes sense to me, safety wise, logistically and for better enjoyment of their costumers.

And now, let’s argue about my post…

 

[tursiops]

This is one of those threads that illustrates how much noise and nonsense scubaboard can be, I’ve said it before, often one needs to be an expert on the subject one reads here to be able to filter out what is actually good information.

It took 5 pages, 40 responses, before finally this one came up. Many responding prior to this response are instructors, some responses were quite authoritative in condemning the practice, and not because they dont agree with it, but because they’re unaware of the standards, thinking the operator here is likely questionable.

True there isnt enough information on the op to know that is actually what the operator is doing, but that goes both ways, there isn’t enough info to show operator is doing anything questionable either, but the op‘s question set the tone, “would you trust…”, but valid question from op though, she doesn’t know it is perfectly fine and was smart to ask questions. Like Tursiops, I too knew that it is possible to do a ”discover nitrox”, and the hints for me that it is actually the case here, is the use of 32%, computer and being shallower than 60’ (where 36% would’ve been more common).

From what I read from operators website, it suggests to me they aren’t charging extra for the “discover nitrox”, and I’d make an assumption here, they rather facilitate having all their divers dive nitrox than dive air, this makes sense to me, safety wise, logistically and for better enjoyment of their costumers.

And now, let’s argue about my post…

In 2004 PADI brought out Discover Enriched Air, a no-dive certification that allowed use of 32% using air tables or computers, under indirect supervision of a PADI pro. eLearning for this became available in 2005. The requirements for two EANx dives to receive full EANx certification was dropped in 2006. Sometime after that Discover Enriched Air quietly disappeared and is no long available. It was a useful tool for those who did not have access to open water to do the required two dives for the original PADI nitrox course.

 

[L13]

You don't know what you don't know.

If he read this thread, he knows everything he needs to know.

 

[L13]

The course I teach is at least 10 hours in class plus two dives. BUT, I teach a NAUI course!!!

And you think all that is necessary? What do you do different on your nitrox dives compared to air dives?