Question Is AOW a waste of time?

[onepointfivethumbs]

(I know my post history makes me look like a tire-kicker, please be assured it's because of poverty)

Let's say my friend has $500 burning a hole in his pocket. He got a Peregrine for Christmas, and recently sat through an EANx class.
Let's also assume that my friend's ultimate goals are MOD3 CCR/Full Cave and cold, deep, dark, scary wrecks from history books.
My understanding that the best bang for the buck for someone so economically challenged is to become BFF's with a local tec diver who has lots of spare gear and patience, who would teach him to dive a drysuit, bp/w, long hose, doubles, shoot a dsmb/bag, perfect buoyancy and trim, kicks and turns. He would then sign up for GUE-F or UTD-E, get a tec pass, take Tech 1 and OHP/Cave 1, then buy a CCR for everything else.
Now, my friend knows that at this second, taking Fundies would be a waste of time because he has never dove doubles or a drysuit in his life, and would be out $2,000 and a lot of embarassment.
The traditional pathway of OWD->AOW->EANx->ITT->AN/DP->TMx becomes appealing in that it's smaller bites both psychologically and financially; but when looking at course prerequisites for classes like AN/DP and Apprentice Cave, the trend appears that (whether for insurance or standardization purposes) many instructors want specialties like Deep, Rescue, and most of all AOW.
It makes sense, for example, nonpenetrative Wreck is a waste of time if you are going to have Cavern or better before taking Advanced Wreck. It makes sense not to take Deep if you are going to take AN/DP. It makes sense not to take Mod1/Air Dil if you will have AN/DP/TMx and can go straight to Mod2/Helitrox Deco Dil.
I understand PADI exists to sell classes to vacation divers. I can live without the prestige of being a fish identification mermaid diver. The attitude of AOW being the "course buffet" does not do much to help sell it.

With the expectation of future technical courses, what will he learn in AOW that he could not practice on his own, or that will not be covered in greater detail in future courses?

I figure his options are:
1. Put the cash in an S&P500 Index Fund and buy a clapped out CCR in ten years
2. Put it towards a Drysuit (most likely a SeaSkin) and associated class
3. Take AOW and annoy the instructor
4. Put it towards a BP/W, set of regs, or SMB/Spool/Lights

 

[RyanT]

My understanding that the best bang for the buck for someone so economically challenged

Economically challenged and tech diving don't belong in the same sentence. Getting to MOD3/Full cave is stupid expensive. It takes time, equipment, and training. In between training, it requires just doing tech dives and gaining experience. Even basic tech dives aren't cheap.

 

[NW Dive Dawg]

I'll vote for option number 2 since I think that will result in more dives in your area.......and more dives is the best training you can get at this stage in your dive path.

 

[Marie13]

Economically challenged and tech diving don't belong in the same sentence. Getting to MOD3/Full cave is stupid expensive. It takes time, equipment, and training. In between training, it requires just doing tech dives and gaining experience. Even basic tech dives aren't cheap.

This. Plus, as the OP noted, tech instructors may want tech students to have AOW.

Tech is not cheap. That’s why many tech divers are not folks in their 20s. You need cash.

Say OP’s buddy wanted to go tech via CCR, rather than OC. Aside from the cost of the CCR, training ain’t cheap. Mod 1 (air dil, no deco, limited to 100ft - this is for people without OC tech certs) is going to run around $2K, give or take a few hundred on either side. You have to add on travel costs, etc. So you could drop $3K total easily for Mod 1. And without OC tech training, to upgrade to helitrox, you need 50 hours on the unit.

Tech training costs are about $300 a day, from what I’ve read here.

OC gear can be bought cheaper on the used market with some patience, but dry suits depend on size and if your buddy is a weird size, he’ll have to go custom. Even a Seaskin will be $1K or so,

 

[Lorenzoid]

Take AOW because virtually everyone takes AOW. No further rationale is necessary. The course is offered all the time, takes only one or two days of your time, and costs an amount of money that is a tiny tiny fraction of what you will end up spending on your journey to tech diving.

 

[arkstorm]

Take AOW because even if you have hundreds of dives in your log book, many dive operators won't take you to a dive site that is deeper than 60' without AOW cert.

 

[lowwall]

There is no such thing as cheap, deep tech diving. If you can't afford the training, you can't afford the diving.

I'm going to make a suggestion that's not on your list. Talk to your local shops and tell them you don't have much money, but you're interested in becoming a DM. The is a way to gain experience at low cost. You'll might have to pony up some money for more training at the start, but at some point the shop should start letting you trade tank monkey work for free dives or training. This is also a route to cheap gear or at least free loaner gear.

 

[tursiops]

(I know my post history makes me look like a tire-kicker, please be assured it's because of poverty)

Let's say my friend has $500 burning a hole in his pocket. He got a Peregrine for Christmas, and recently sat through an EANx class.
Let's also assume that my friend's ultimate goals are MOD3 CCR/Full Cave and cold, deep, dark, scary wrecks from history books.
My understanding that the best bang for the buck for someone so economically challenged is to become BFF's with a local tec diver who has lots of spare gear and patience, who would teach him to dive a drysuit, bp/w, long hose, doubles, shoot a dsmb/bag, perfect buoyancy and trim, kicks and turns. He would then sign up for GUE-F or UTD-E, get a tec pass, take Tech 1 and OHP/Cave 1, then buy a CCR for everything else.
Now, my friend knows that at this second, taking Fundies would be a waste of time because he has never dove doubles or a drysuit in his life, and would be out $2,000 and a lot of embarassment.
The traditional pathway of OWD->AOW->EANx->ITT->AN/DP->TMx becomes appealing in that it's smaller bites both psychologically and financially; but when looking at course prerequisites for classes like AN/DP and Apprentice Cave, the trend appears that (whether for insurance or standardization purposes) many instructors want specialties like Deep, Rescue, and most of all AOW.
It makes sense, for example, nonpenetrative Wreck is a waste of time if you are going to have Cavern or better before taking Advanced Wreck. It makes sense not to take Deep if you are going to take AN/DP. It makes sense not to take Mod1/Air Dil if you will have AN/DP/TMx and can go straight to Mod2/Helitrox Deco Dil.
I understand PADI exists to sell classes to vacation divers. I can live without the prestige of being a fish identification mermaid diver. The attitude of AOW being the "course buffet" does not do much to help sell it.

With the expectation of future technical courses, what will he learn in AOW that he could not practice on his own, or that will not be covered in greater detail in future courses?

I figure his options are:
1. Put the cash in an S&P500 Index Fund and buy a clapped out CCR in ten years
2. Put it towards a Drysuit (most likely a SeaSkin) and associated class
3. Take AOW and annoy the instructor
4. Put it towards a BP/W, set of regs, or SMB/Spool/Lights

I'm not going to waste my time by offering facts to replace your opinions, since your mind appears to already be made up.
Option 1 is silly; you end up with a clapped lout CCR and no idea how to dive it.
Option 2 has some merit.
Option 3 is half right.
Option 4 is a waste of time at this point; you don't need equipment, you need experience and training.

 

[sea_ledford]

Get AOW and deep, they'll be pre-reqs for anthing down the road anyway. As @lowall says, get a job in a dive shop if you want to go "cheap."

Or get a job in a better paying industry and not have to go "cheap."

I was told in about 2005, when I was initially looking at going CCR, plan on it costing $15k for CCR (unit, ancillary equipment and training). Today, I suspect it still costs about $15K. Maybe a little less since there are more used ccrs availible, particularly if you are close to where the training will take place. But plan on $15K.

 

[gbirch]

My recommended steps, FWIW:
Option 4: You mean that you don't already own all of this???
Then Option 2: Get a drysuit and a ton of experience diving it at all depths. Paradoxically, it's harder to dive a drysuit in shallows than it is deep, but since this is where you will spend most of your deco (when/if you get there), practice, practice, practice.
Then Option 3: As has already been said, like it or not some captains won't let you dive some sites unless you have AOW. That was the original motivation for me getting mine back in the day.

The only thing I'd add about Option 3 is why the hell would you want to annoy your instructor? Seriously?? Who goes into a class with this attitude? I know that your post was a bit tongue-in-cheek, but find a good instructor that you respect, and he will take you as far as he is able, piss him off in the class and he will not dive with you again (at least I wouldn't, but maybe I'm getting grumpy in my old age and pickier about who I choose to dive with).