Instructors - Agencies Split from overweight

[SparticleBrane]

If you are quoting me I didnt ask that for that reason. I was a DM for 5 years before I became an instructor...and most of the time I was a DM I had no inclination to be an instructor.
I dont give a **** if someone is an instructor or not, but if someone is busy slagging off the standards and other instructors, and generally shaking their head about the poor quality of training these days then I expect them to step up to the mark, become an instructor and try to MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

Otherwise you are not helping are you?

Nah wasn't quoting you -- just a general statement.
I'd like to think I make a difference. I work with classes of 10-20 OW students per semester, currently as an AI in training.

 

[Azza]

Nah wasn't quoting you -- just a general statement.
I'd like to think I make a difference. I work with classes of 10-20 OW students per semester, currently as an AI in training.

No worries. I too hate people that think that because someone is not an instructor they dont know what they are talking about.
Good to hear you are out there making an effort

 

[MikeFerrara]

I dont give a **** if someone is an instructor or not, but if someone is busy slagging off the standards and other instructors, and generally shaking their head about the poor quality of training these days then I expect them to step up to the mark, become an instructor and try to MAKE A DIFFERENCE.


Otherwise you are not helping are you?

Sure you can. Dive training is a product. Providing information about a product can influence the product choices of others. Done on a large enough scale it can even apply market pressure.

 

[Azza]

Sure you can. Dive training is a product. Providing information about a product can influence the product choices of others. Done on a large enough scale it can even apply market pressure.

Ok I will agree with that to an extent but are you not better off on the inside where your efforts will make more of a difference? I mean PADI consult their instructors on the manual (apparently) so wouldnt you have more chance of getting a change in standards by being a PADI Instructor?

 

[Steve R]

I dont give a **** if someone is an instructor or not, but if someone is busy slagging off the standards and other instructors, and generally shaking their head about the poor quality of training these days then I expect them to step up to the mark, become an instructor and try to MAKE A DIFFERENCE.

Otherwise you are not helping are you?

Spart, they say this a lot too. I heard that regularly.

The problem is as I have said, you become an instructor, and they just toss up another barrier............

In the end it's a waste of your time because they don't want your help, they don't want your input and do not care what you think, end of story, thanks for coming out and playin' the game.

It's not your job to help or think, and it only causes them (and you) grief.

Your job is to put as much coin into their coffers (including your own coin) as you can, and do it as oft as you can. The rest be damned, it is of lesser consequence.

Step up to the mark..make a difference...........ROFLMAO

Who's kidding who here? lol.

I thought that too, until I stepped up to that plate, tried to help, and got nothing but BS from Padi HQ themselves. Not ONCE did they ever make even remotely a good call. Oh, and that's not bashing, whiners, that first hand accounts, in writing, every last one, just as Mike has also experienced before I ever showed up.

I shoulda known, I shoulda known <shaking his head in personal disgust>

It's too funny once you realize the real game being played though.

You stay put Spart, you're perfect right where you are bud. Don't waste your effort and coin on worthless agencies that don't want your help nor would even consider your input as worthy even as an instructor.

 

[Azza]

Spart, they say this a lot too. I heard that regularly.

The problem is as I have said, you become an instructor, and they just toss up another barrier............

In the end it's a waste of your time because they don't want your help, they don't want your input and do not care what you think, end of story, thanks for coming out and playin' the game.

It's not your job to help or think, and it only causes them (and you) grief.

Your job is to put as much coin into their coffers (including your own coin) as you can, and do it as oft as you can. The rest be damned, it is of lesser consequence.

Step up to the mark..make a difference...........ROFLMAO

Who's kidding who here? lol.

I thought that too, until I stepped up to that plate, tried to help, and got nothing but BS from Padi HQ themselves. Not ONCE did they ever make even remotely a good call. Oh, and that's not bashing, whiners, that first hand accounts, in writing, every last one, just as Mike has also experienced before I ever showed up.

I shoulda known, I shoulda known <shaking his head in personal disgust>

It's too funny once you realize the real game being played though.

You stay put Spart, you're perfect right where you are bud. Don't waste your effort and coin on worthless agencies that don't want your help nor would even consider your input as worthy even as an instructor.

You are a little bitter and twisted aren’t you? I agree PADI is not perfect and never even pretend they are. I agree with a lot of stuff Mike says but I try and do my part and make sure my students are well trained.


If someone is an instructor or not it makes no difference to me.
I didn’t find I suddenly became a better diver or more knowledgeable when I made the jump from DM to Instructor at all.
Most of the outstanding divers I dive with are not instructors…in fact most of them have a maximum of AOW/rescue in the recreational agency scheme of things and a few of them have more skill and knowledge than I. I am comfortable with that as I am comfortable with my penis size.
I became an instructor to try and make a difference as much as I could. The rest of you can sit around and circle jerk all you like…some of us are actually trying to make a difference.

 

[Thalassamania]

...wouldn't you have more chance of getting a change in standards by being a PADI Instructor?

---No.

 

[Azza]

---No.

Ok, now that is clear I am going to hand in my PADI instructor card and sit around on the internet like a pelican on the wharf and tell stories of "Days Gone By" to any poor sap I can convince to listen to me.
**** the few divers a year I manage to train to a reasonable degree...they can all suffer the same consequences as every other sap in the dive industry.

 

[MikeFerrara]

Ok I will agree with that to an extent but are you not better off on the inside where your efforts will make more of a difference? I mean PADI consult their instructors on the manual (apparently) so wouldnt you have more chance of getting a change in standards by being a PADI Instructor?

An instructor is a customer. You ARE NOT ON THE INSIDE.

I think if you look back at your instructor membership agreement, agreeing with the PADI system is pretty much a condition of membership.

No, buying and selling PADI products does not seem to be the way to convince them that changes should be made.

 

[Azza]

I understand that I am a customer but most businesses listen to their customers if enough of them bring enough pressure to bear...

My Dive club, the Southern Ocean Diving Society or S.O.D.S for short, is considering becoming a BSAC branch which will be the first in New Zealand. The Padi rep has offered us cut price, and some FREE, materials to stay with the PADI system (this would enable us to pass the materials on to the students at normal cost and the club will make a profit that can go toward a number of club related things) so somewhere we have got PADI thinking. There are 5 instructors so far in our club...

We have also been involved in a spat with a local dive shop instructor who didnt like what he read on our forum or the fact we told a forum member to ask his instructor why he didnt get taught SAC rates on his PADI deep course, and has threatened to sue us (Despite the fact you cant sue in NZ) and get PADI to QA us. PADI basically told him to piss off that we were doing a good job with our students and why hadnt he taught SAC rates..........

So PADI are listening to us, albeit not about changing standards but about training at least...

Also note there are rather a few subtle changes in the 2007 padi manual so I do expect a few more...